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ex sf vets speaks out

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posted on May, 22 2006 @ 06:28 PM
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If what this guy is saying is true, and he actually carried these orders to kill innocent people, then why is he still walking around a free man?

I would have thought he, and the officers who gave the orders would be up for War crimes?

Others have been up for charges of abuse against POW's. Did they not get sent to prison?

Maybe the truth will come out, as and when he gets arrested for War crimes.




posted on May, 22 2006 @ 06:33 PM
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Originally posted by Dronetek
all you have to do is look up his name and stories related to him.


Obviously not, or I would know, wouldn't I? Because I have done that.



Look, all it takes is to watch the video to know hes a fraud.


Again, obviously not. You expect me, a 40-something woman who's never been in the service to know that his uniform is 'wrong'? What's wrong with it? He's out of the service, maybe he's just wearing it wrong. It looks like fatigues to me.



He claims he was in Fallujah for the invasion, but the facts say he was in America protesting a coffe shop.


Where does he claim to have been in Fallujah during the Invasion? He spent time in Fallujah but doesn't claim to have been there for the November 2004 Invasion.

You talk about how people believe this simply because they want to end the war. Perhaps you should consider those who discount this simply because they support the war or this administration.

I'm not saying I'm 100% convinced he's telling the truth, but I have no reason as yet to not believe him.



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 06:35 PM
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Originally posted by Dronetek
He's even wearing the same goddman BDU shirt!


So a guy who was betrayed by the Army and hates what his nation forced him to do gets around in his camo gear when he's off-base and off the clock? What, he can't afford a new t-shirt a cheap pair of Chinese-jeans?



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 06:42 PM
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Originally posted by Bikereddie
If what this guy is saying is true, and he actually carried these orders to kill innocent people, then why is he still walking around a free man?


Eddie, if you think this isn't happening in Iraq, you really need to open up a little. I know you're a sensible guy and I know your son hasn't experienced stuff like this, but this is not the first story like this.

Listen to what he says toward the end of the video. He's trying to get the story told. People won't listen or believe him. What more is he supposed to do?



I would have thought he, and the officers who gave the orders would be up for War crimes?


Look around. Everyone's discounting him. Saying he's making it up. Some get caught, some don't.



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 06:45 PM
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Originally posted by HowlrunnerIV
So a guy who was betrayed by the Army and hates what his nation forced him to do gets around in his camo gear when he's off-base and off the clock?


Many Vietnam Vets wore their fatigues to let people know they were vets. It's common. It's also a sign of protest.



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 06:51 PM
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Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Eddie, if you think this isn't happening in Iraq, you really need to open up a little. I know you're a sensible guy and I know your son hasn't experienced stuff like this, but this is not the first story like this.


I'm not saying that this does not happen, and I'm not saying it wont be the last we hear of things like this.



Look around. Everyone's discounting him. Saying he's making it up. Some get caught, some don't.


I haven't discounted anything he has said. I watched the video and listened. And asked questions without discrediting anything that he said he did.

Like i said, why is this guy still walking around if what he says is true? War crimes are War crimes, and this guy has admitted to them. Thats all i am saying.



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 07:00 PM
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Seems a little young for Special Forces, 22 really does seem young to be part of an elite unit. In the UK our SF tend to take more mature guys with years of service under their belt.
Committing atrocities in war is nothing new, its happened in every war ever fought.
But because of the instant news we get now its just more widely known about. My country did some pretty damnable things over the centuries, concentration camps in the Boar War for instance, hell we even put Washington to the torch ( something we have said sorry for by the way )
The US has had its fair share of units gone out of control My Lai and the '68 tour of 101st's Tiger Force in Vietnam being the most well known.
But this isn't just confined to the UK and US, every Army that has ever put men into the field has done things like this boy describes in his blog.
Its wrong and its evil but it happens when you take young men and sharpen them to a razors edge by training and conditioning and put them in a pressure cooker environment.
The thing is a Soldier can legitimately refuse an order that he deems un lawful but peer pressure and the heat of the moment can often over ride even the most basic taboos and the sense of right and wrong that we all take for granted.
I'm not defending the men who find them selves put in this position, i think we can all agree it is an evil thing to take an innocent life, but don't judge someone until you have walked a mile in his shoes.



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 07:05 PM
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Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by HowlrunnerIV
So a guy who was betrayed by the Army and hates what his nation forced him to do gets around in his camo gear when he's off-base and off the clock?


Many Vietnam Vets wore their fatigues to let people know they were vets. It's common. It's also a sign of protest.


No, they wore their jackets, not their shirts.

But he carries his ID with him and leads a protest against discrimination against Vets?

Okay, maybe in the New Homeboy World Fashion Order untucked, oversized shirts are de-riguer, but in the protest article it said he was in uniform. ie all of it.

Man might be a sea of contradictions, but this guy has too many inconsistencies for me to put my faith in his word.



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 07:14 PM
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Man might be a sea of contradictions, but this guy has too many inconsistencies for me to put my faith in his word.


It doesn't matter really if he is lying about it or not, personally i don't believe this particular incident ever happened. But don't fool yourself into thinking it cant happen, it does. And time can take an awful toll upon the soul of men who find themselves haunted in later years by the sins they committed for Flag and Country.y.



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 07:15 PM
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The name of the person portrayed is called Jesse Macbeth. The whole thread is about him.

The thread was started by ivaw vet. I was going to email him until i saw his email address. cplmacbeth@military.com .

Coincidence he has the same surname as Jesse.

Also his second posting stands up for Jesse Macbeth. After that, he has posted nothing more.



Well, I do know this guy.
I have seen his dd 214, he is real.
I dont think you should judge some one by how they spell.
He is all over the internet.
I know he is really messed up from what he has seen.




Weather or not he executed children or women, only he and his unit knows.
We should respect the fact that he was there, untill we find out differently.


He admitted he did these things.


I think ivaw vet is Jesse Macbeth.

(post quotes shortened)



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 07:21 PM
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Perhaps he is the same guy Eddie. Perhaps by posting this on the net he is trying purge himself of the deamons or perhaps he is just looking for some attention. I for one feel sorry for him either way.



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 07:27 PM
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Originally posted by Janus
Perhaps he is the same guy Eddie. Perhaps by posting this on the net he is trying purge himself of the deamons or perhaps he is just looking for some attention. I for one feel sorry for him either way.


He could be. But i have my doubts as to ivaw vet's real identity.
I have to second your sentiments too.


[edit on 22-5-2006 by Bikereddie]



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 07:36 PM
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Originally posted by HowlrunnerIV
No, they wore their jackets, not their shirts.


Oh yes they did.
I was there. You're right, they wore their jackets. I wore my brother's. It was the height of fashion, but they wore the shirts adn t-shirts, too.



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 07:52 PM
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Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic


I'm not saying I'm 100% convinced he's telling the truth, but I have no reason as yet to not believe him.




Well, than you are just ignoreing the facts. Why would a ranger wear the WRONG DARN UNIFORM in his military ranger picture? Why would he have his hat on backwards? He's not even wearing the correct undershirt for goddsake! I just dont see how you believers are reconciling those facts. Right off the bat he's discredited and that dosnt seem to matter to a few of you.

Also, he did say he was part of the fallujash invasion. You must have skipped one of the video segments.



[edit on 22-5-2006 by Dronetek]

Mod Edit: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 22/5/2006 by Mirthful Me]



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 08:02 PM
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Im not familier with US dress code, although ill admit his beret looks like a pancake on his head, but saying that ive seen some pretty scruffy ex Army in a hodge podge of ex surplus gear. I dont think this guy is the real deal but we do know things like he describes have happened in the past and will happen again in the future.



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 08:13 PM
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Originally posted by Janus
Im not familier with US dress code, although ill admit his beret looks like a pancake on his head, but saying that ive seen some pretty scruffy ex Army in a hodge podge of ex surplus gear. I dont think this guy is the real deal but we do know things like he describes have happened in the past and will happen again in the future.


So basically you are going to believe what you want regaurdless of the evidence or facts involved?

Also, your hat is one of the most important things to take care of, especially when you are getting your picture taken. Attention to detail is what Rangers pride themselvs on. Without it they are just another group of soldiers.

[edit on 22-5-2006 by Dronetek]



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 08:21 PM
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Originally posted by Janus



Man might be a sea of contradictions, but this guy has too many inconsistencies for me to put my faith in his word.


It doesn't matter really if he is lying about it or not, personally i don't believe this particular incident ever happened. But don't fool yourself into thinking it cant happen, it does. And time can take an awful toll upon the soul of men who find themselves haunted in later years by the sins they committed for Flag and Country.y.


Take it from a former Marine, who's wife is in the Army and knows Rangers.

His picture of him that was "taken" when he was in the Rangers looks absolutely wrong. His beret is on wrong, his uniform is wrong, his jump wings are not on his uniform, etc, etc.

The Rangers are a very elit military unit and there is no way on earth that this guy
can be a Ranger being this sloppy and messy.

Aside from that, his stories are completely inconsistent w/ an interview he gave on another website.

he doesn't make eye contact w/ the camera, when challenged w/ difficult questions, he stutters and stammers and won't look at the camera, stares at the ceiling etc.

If him and his unit did all the murder and killing of innocent Iraqi that he claims, this would be the biggest front page story since Vietnam.

In todays media and complete saturation of information, there is no way this could be covered up for long at all.

I would love to see a DD214 w/ his name, rank and serial number. A gradution picture from Bragg, ect.

B/C is he is the real deal, I'll be the first one to support him in his struggle to get out the truth.

But when he states that he can relate w/ terrorists killing and beheading innocent men, women and children, he loses all credibility with me.

Where are you cplmacbeth@military.com? Care to back yourself up?

B/C when you give interviews stating such charges, you better be ready to back yourself up 100%.

If the media picks up abuse at Iraqi prisons, don't you think the mass murder of innocents would be picked up as well?

Let's think logically



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 08:28 PM
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Dronetek, I'd personally like to hear from someone who's a little less emotional about it. Telling me that the "uniform is wrong" tells me nothing. I didn't know what you meant. I didn't realize you meant he had on the wrong uniform for a Ranger.

Could the picture have been taken before he was a Ranger?

If you would take the time to explain rationally instead of so emotionally, I might get it.

I'd be glad to hear from someone who has a level head about all this. Calm down and I'll listen.

I didn't say I believed it, btw. I said I'm not convinced. And yelling isn't going to convince me.

Dronetek, never mind.

Thank you, cplhunter, for a rational explanation.


And yes, where are you, cplmacbeth@military.com? How about answering some of these charges?

[edit on 22-5-2006 by Benevolent Heretic]



posted on May, 22 2006 @ 09:59 PM
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Benevolent Heretic, did you read the post I made on page one? The guy's story is inconsistent in so many ways, it's not even funny. NO ONE CAN WIN THAT MANY MEDALS BY THE AGE OF 22. It just doesn't happen. He says he can't remember "half of the purple hearts" (!?!). The most purple hearts awarded was 4-8 in VIETNAM. Getting 3 purple hearts in 20 years of service is considered a heck of a lot.

And his story is also dead wrong because there is no way he could have gone to Ranger School and gotten to the Ranger Regiment by age 22. He said he went into the Army because of being in trouble with the law. That disqualifies him from a Ranger contract, which would guarantee a shot at the Ranger Regiment right out of AIT (Advanced Individual Training). Which means he has to have gone to a regular unit after AIT, or at the most Airborne School. He might have been disqualified from that, too. He could NOT have been "picked to go to Ranger School" right out of Basic because they don't do that. You have to apply to it from your unit. If you go in as a Ranger contract and do make it into the 75th Ranger Regiment, you get trained up to go to Ranger School.

And going to Ranger School DOES NOT get you into the Ranger Regiment. So even if they did pick people to go to Ranger School right out of Basic (which they don't), he still wouldn't go straight to the Regiment afterward.

He is lying through his teeth. His uniform is on all wrong even. No soldier, ESPECIALLY a Ranger, gets up and makes a public statement with a messed-up uniform. A soldier represents their unit.


MBF

posted on May, 22 2006 @ 10:05 PM
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Come on people, reread this.



About me:
I served 16 months in iraq as an army ranger had to kill alot of innocent iraqi women and children and civilians becouse my country ordered me to i come back home and my country forgets about me the va tells me i am cant get service for my ptsd so i will tell america the truth about iraq the stuff america doesent want u to know. Also, I am a pathological liar.


Look at the last sentence!!!



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