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John Lear's theory regarding the "Soul Collector"

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posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 07:20 PM
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Hey Sleeper long time no see, what dark crevis have you been hiding in?

Anyway just a few questions I'd like to postulate

- You mentioned that souls can be delayed before entering a homosapien, but in the case of designer babies (perhaps one day fully cloned humans) will these people still have souls?

- Does having knowledge of our destiny (the ideology of a 'soul collector') have any implications for when we die. Basically if one understands and believes this concept, are they considered more enlightened by ET thus may be treated differently?

- If souls can be temporarily lost by ET, and if you relate this to the ideology of ghosts, for the most part they are seen within places of tragedy. Through this therefore, could one presume that death by tragedy might increase ones chance of their soul being temporarily lost?

- How many (if any) government agencies are privy to this information?

I feel I'm scouring away from something and that to experience it I need to be truly alone. It's a combination of fear and intrigue which relates back to an experience I had as a child. Perhaps you could ask you ET friends to verify it for me?


Thankyou for your time, it's good to see you again

[edit on 12-7-2006 by kolo_heights]




posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 07:21 PM
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Ah, the garbage thread. Well here's some more.

www.prweb.com...


In the book, Jacocks recounts details from the many times he was
abducted by aliens, beginning when he was a young child. He
details how the encounters grew in intensity and how he began to
realize he was dealing with humanoid beings with amazing
abilities. Gradually, he began to hear their voices and see
them. Recently at work, a scanner reacted to an unknown code
inside his body. X-rays revealed two needle-like objects, which
he now believes to be tracking devices. These experiences,
Jacocks suggests, are not only real, but they should be explored
as proof of alien existence, rather than mocked or hidden away
in secrecy.


So there ya go. The proof. 2 needles in his arm.
How come all you scammers can't get together on one saucer and get yer stories together? Wait lemme get this straight. Y'all keep gettin abducted by the same folk and never run into each other? Is this Comedy Central?
Keep it cummin.



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 07:42 PM
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I admire your stubborn skepticism longhaircowboy, but dont you feel that theres anything in life (or after for that matter) which just happens that cannot be proved or disproved?

I'm not suggesting the theory of a 'soul collector' is 100% truth (though I lean towards the fact that it holds many truths as it amalgemates many ideologies within religion, history and society - making sense of them), but not everything you experience can be displayed on paper, fully verified and left out for the world to see.

Applying human rationale to ET thinking is tricky


[edit on 12-7-2006 by kolo_heights]



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 08:23 PM
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Originally posted by kolo_heights
Hey Sleeper long time no see, what dark crevis have you been hiding in?


Hi kolo,

My office den, but it’s not dark, I like lots of light.


- You mentioned that souls can be delayed before entering a homosapien, but in the case of designer babies (perhaps one day fully cloned humans) will these people still have souls?


A clone is another body but it will not share the soul of the person it was clone from it will get its own soul.



- Does having knowledge of our destiny (the ideology of a 'soul collector') have any implications for when we die. Basically if one understands and believes this concept, are they considered more enlightened by ET thus may be treated differently?


That in itself will not add any to you.



- If souls can be temporarily lost by ET, and if you relate this to the ideology of ghosts, for the most part they are seen within places of tragedy. Through this therefore, could one presume that death by tragedy might increase ones chance of their soul being temporarily lost?


ET never loses a soul, sometimes souls are allowed to visit places for many reasons, some just need more time before they can are ready to go.



- How many (if any) government agencies are privy to this information?


None that I’m aware of



I feel I'm scouring away from something and that to experience it I need to be truly alone. It's a combination of fear and intrigue which relates back to an experience I had as a child. Perhaps you could ask you ET friends to verify it for me?


There is no experience or anything else on this planet worth fretting about let alone fearing. If you can’t deal with it head on, but have given it your best shot---move on. Most things work themselves out or they become mute.



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 08:28 PM
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- Does having knowledge of our destiny (the ideology of a 'soul collector') have any implications for when we die. Basically if one understands and believes this concept, are they considered more enlightened by ET thus may be treated differently?


That in itself will not add any to you.


Surely being in knowledge of your destiny you are able to manipulate it, or are we just completely helpless?

How does one add to it?

If this theory is true, why would humans need to know of its existence? If aliens are an overiding force in our one true fate, death, why attempt to educate humans in a process they will probably not remember?

Surely keeping the process disclosed outweights the positives of releasing it onto a society which for the most part doesnt need or care to know, let alone can have a true say in...

[edit on 12-7-2006 by kolo_heights]



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 08:57 PM
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Originally posted by johnlear
Originally posted by onbekend59



On the glass structure pic u posted, we all know the moon has no atmosphere, if it would have then we would see it from here.The sunlight would be reflected by the gasses inside the atmosphere and we would see a blue light around it.This is not the case with the moon so how do u explain that a glass structure is standing there, meteorites or various space debris would demolisch such a structure unless there was an atmosphere like here on earth.Explain yourself please.


Thanks for your input onbekebd59. Your statement "We all know the moon has no atmosphere" is incorrect. Firsoff and Pickering both wrote that the moon had an atmosphere. Based on what I have been able to learn the moon has an atmosphere equvialent to about 15,000 to 18,000 feet here on earth. In others words with a little conditioning (decompressing) you would be able to breath without a space helmut. The moon also has gravity equal to about 64% of that here on earth. That statement is made using the neutral point which is 43, 495 miles and Newton's Law of Universal Gravitation. For the formula and math see page 197 and 198 Moongate by William L. Brian II. The moons gravity is what holds the atmosphere. The atmosphere is extremely clean due to the efforts of its inhabitants and the fact that, although there is wind, there a never any sweeping sandstorms that would sweep dust up into the atmosphere. That is why those looking for an effect of an atmosphere on setting stars are disappointed. I have posted in several places a picture taken by the Lick Observatory of the moon in 1947 which clearly shows a huge explosion about 25 to 30 miles westnorthwest of Endymion. If there is no atmosphere then what can be the mechanism that holds the dust and debris in regular form and shape? I know what you are going to ask now. So John, if there is gravity on the moon more than the 1/6th that NASA claims and it is 64% that of earths then how did the lunar lander come down out of its 60 miles orbit around the moon, land and then climb back up to reattain the 60 miles orbit and then dock with only 22,000 pounds of fuel?

Thx for that input however thats not my next question/statement, the most noticeble effect of an atmosphere would be the blue shroud that surrounds the planet just like we have on earth and thats exactly what we dont see on the moon. So if the moon really holds an atmosphere at all then we should be able to see it, we dont even need a telescope for that. A former pilot like you cannot really disagree on the fact that an atmosphere should be visible when certain conditions are present.The only conditions needed are sunlight and the actual atmosphere itself.Sinds you are talking about an atmosphere equvialent to about 15,000 to 18,000 feet here on earth i assume it is big enough for us to see it yet still we see nothing. Thats more then enough proof for me that there is hardly an atmosphere on the moon. What do u make of that?



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 09:03 PM
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Originally posted by kolo_heights

Surely being in knowledge of your destiny you are able to manipulate it, or are we just completely helpless?


You mean having the knowledge that we never die?---for those that believe it or know it that is a gift.


How does one add to it?


To our destiny on earth? If you have one you will know it or you will find it eventually---but most on earth don’t have one other than to get through this life without causing trouble.



If this theory is true, why would humans need to know of its existence? If aliens are an overiding force in our one true fate, death, why attempt to educate humans in a process they will probably not remember?


Certain knowledge is a privilege, nothing more and most will never know for sure about anything.



Surely keeping the process disclosed outweights the positives of releasing it onto a society which for the most part doesnt need or care to know, let alone can have a true say in...


That part of society will remain forever in the arms of blissful ignorance---until they die and wake up to reality.

Those types will not be found on boards like this searching out for a sliver of truth unless their only purpose in life is to try and keep others in blissful ignorance as themselves.



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 09:21 PM
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Originally posted by sleeper



Originally posted by kolo_heights

Surely being in knowledge of your destiny you are able to manipulate it, or are we just completely helpless?


You mean having the knowledge that we never die?---for those that believe it or know it that is a gift.


The knowledge that our souls are "harvested". If one is aware of this process surely they have a greater say then someone who is blissfully ignorant to the whole process.



How does one add to it?


To our destiny on earth? If you have one you will know it or you will find it eventually---but most on earth don’t have one other than to get through this life without causing trouble.


Apologies I meant in reference to "adding" to our soul. You said that knowing your destiny (presuming the theory of soul collection is true) will not gain you enlightenment. Therefore what does one have to do for their soul to be recognised by ET as 'enlightened'? Surely being in the knowledge of your ultimate fate (your soul being collected) is the greatest enlightenment of them all?




If this theory is true, why would humans need to know of its existence? If aliens are an overiding force in our one true fate, death, why attempt to educate humans in a process they will probably not remember?


Certain knowledge is a privilege, nothing more and most will never know for sure about anything.


Knowledge is a privilege in any form. But why relinquish this upon a miniority? Surely it could be more destabilising to individuals let alone society if one knew the 'truth'?...




Surely keeping the process disclosed outweights the positives of releasing it onto a society which for the most part doesnt need or care to know, let alone can have a true say in...


That part of society will remain forever in the arms of blissful ignorance---until they die and wake up to reality.

Those types will not be found on boards like this searching out for a sliver of truth unless their only purpose in life is to try and keep others in blissful ignorance as themselves.


I agree, but in my opinion there is no such thing as absolute truths. We all possess the abilities to unlock the truths inside of us. Human society is too busy searching externally when all the answers can be found within.



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 09:28 PM
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Some comments to John Lear and Sleeper:

Gentlemen, are you part of the solution or part of the problem?

People come to this forum to ask questions and, hopefully, find answers. There is enough about the world of UFOs that remains in conjecture. Both of you claim to have information about aliens interacting with humanity, about what exists on other planets and the moon and more, but when you're asked to supply proof to back up your claims, you are quick to say that anyone can choose to believe or not believe what you are saying.

Then why, I ask, should anyone believe you more than, say, what Jim Jones told his followers? Or the leader of Heaven's Gate? Both of those men claimed that they KNEW the absolute truth, and they led people all the way to their deaths convinced that what they were saying was hard fact.

Mr. Lear has made some large claims about what happens to our souls, what may be on the moon and that NASA is in a program of disinformation. When he's been pressed to explain himself further, he has selectively chosen his answers. On only one occasion has he said where he learned of some of the things he's been telling people on the airwaves and on here, and it came from a remote viewing book. When Sleeper corrected Lear as to what he believes happens to human souls that are "freed" underwater or under the earth, Lear was quick to change his opinion. Why then should anything Lear claims to know be taken with any sort of credibility when he himself cannot claim that these are facts?

To John Lear and Sleeper: if you believe that extraterrestrials are here and that they want to help humanity, then they better start revealing themselves to people like myself and the ones asking questions on here. There has been too many deceivers dressed up in new age costumes, or claiming to "know" what the facts are and are willing to portion pieces of these "facts" out to string along their cult of personality. If there are benevolent alien agencies here on Earth trying to help us, then they are aiding and abetting the deceivers. For those who do have critical thinking skills and want to learn what's really going on, where are the teachers that can rest our suspicions by showing us proof of what they claim?

Where is the evidence of millions of beings living on planets throughout our solar system?

Where is there evidence of a soul collector existing on the Moon?

Indeed, where are all the aliens? After all, if they claim to be using someone like yourself, Sleeper, as a means to get knowledge about their existence out there to people like me, then why can't they give you a message that they'll beam a bright light from the Moon tomorrow at precisely 10:30 PM?

Why is it that every person that steps forward with so-called wisdom cannot prove that they're not a charletan like the ones behind Heaven's Gate?

It's not enough to come on here and tell us selected items of "truth", then wait for more questions. If you cannot prove it, then it might as well be science fiction.



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 09:31 PM
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Originally posted by A Curious Soul
Both of those men claimed that they KNEW the absolute truth, and they led people all the way to their deaths convinced that what they were saying was hard fact.

Why is it that every person that steps forward with so-called wisdom cannot prove that they're not a charletan like the ones behind Heaven's Gate?


Simply because he is not asking you to do anything!



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 09:58 PM
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Originally posted by kolo_heights

The knowledge that our souls are "harvested". If one is aware of this process surely they have a greater say then someone who is blissfully ignorant to the whole process.


Knowing that we will be harvested---which btw is a misnomer, lends nothing to the fact that we die and are directed to one of several possible destination---determined only by those ETs over you.



Apologies I meant in reference to "adding" to our soul. You said that knowing your destiny (presuming the theory of soul collection is true) will not gain you enlightenment. Therefore what does one have to do for their soul to be recognised by ET as 'enlightened'?


We are not all here for the same reason therefore the answer is different for everyone, if they don’t know then its their job to find it out.



Surely being in the knowledge of your ultimate fate (your soul being collected) is the greatest enlightenment of them all?


I don’t quite see it that way but perhaps for some it is.




Knowledge is a privilege in any form. But why relinquish this upon a miniority?


On this planet it’s done the old fashion way, we have to earn it---it’s not relinquished. Those that don’t want it or are not searching for it will simply not get it.



Surely it could be more destabilising to individuals let alone society if one knew the 'truth'?...


That’s why the truth is difficult to find. Gold would be worthless if it were easily available.




I agree, but in my opinion there is no such thing as absolute truths. We all possess the abilities to unlock the truths inside of us. Human society is too busy searching externally when all the answers can be found within.


On this planet there is no absolute truth---and only upon death will most find it.



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 10:04 PM
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Originally posted by SteveR

Originally posted by A Curious Soul
Both of those men claimed that they KNEW the absolute truth, and they led people all the way to their deaths convinced that what they were saying was hard fact.

Why is it that every person that steps forward with so-called wisdom cannot prove that they're not a charletan like the ones behind Heaven's Gate?


Simply because he is not asking you to do anything!


Actually, both John Lear and Sleeper are asking me, as well as everyone on here that reads their words, to do something: to think about what they are saying. And isn't that precisely why you responded to my posting? I got you to think about what I was saying. You participated in the conversation.

However, when you join in a conversation it doesn't mean that what you're telling people should be accepted as the truth. There are hundreds of people claiming to have inside knowledge of the truth about UFOs and aliens. Not all of them can be right, correct? So how better to separate the wheat from the chaff than to think critically, ask questions and better yet, ask for proof.

Anyone can come here and start a discussion claiming that they know what the truth is. Just because Lear or Sleeper aren't asking for us to believe them doesn't mean that they get a free pass, or that questions can't be asked, or that proof can't be demanded.

And really, why can't the aliens prove themselves to us? They've supposedly done deals with governments around the world. It's practically a joke saying UFOs don't exist, based on all the eyewitness testimony, photos and videos from over the past 50 years. If aliens were monitoring the Earth in detail, surely they would know about forums like this. Why can't we ask for proof, especially if what Lear and Sleeper claim about a world government obsessed with absolute power and corruption is true? Why not give more power to us, the good guys, trying to fathom what is real and what is fiction? Doesn't THAT make more sense than sending out a human to parcel out bits and pieces of fantastic fiction, knowing that they can never ultimately prove what they're telling us?

Why should MJ-12 get a free pass and the ATS readers don't? Because if we never get better proof than what we've got now, we will NEVER solve the UFO mystery.



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 10:15 PM
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Isn't the internet wonderful?
I think I might have said that before.

But how many of you who post this stuff on the internet would be willing to say the same things in public? Or even come face to face with those who don't believe any of this and say what you have said on this forum. How many of you are willing to go on a news show or a talk show, and explain everything you've posted here?

The internet provides anonymity, so anyone can post anything.



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 10:21 PM
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Originally posted by A Curious Soul
It's not enough to come on here and tell us selected items of "truth", then wait for more questions. If you cannot prove it, then it might as well be science fiction.



Neither I nor John are here to convince anyone of anything, John has certain information and I have certain information.

The information is given for free to those who want it for whatever reason.

Feel free not to partake in my kool-aid

BTW, science fiction is nothing more than unrealized fact



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 10:26 PM
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Originally posted by sleeper

BTW, science fiction is nothing more than unrealized fact


No its not.



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 10:27 PM
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sleeper,

are you and John partners in this, or did you become interested because of what John posted?



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 10:33 PM
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I completely agree with your sentinents A Curious Soul, but unfortunately Sleeper and Lear (to a certain extent though information is slowly being released) have made it clear they possess no form of "real" evidence.

Free information it is, but sadly thats all it will remain...



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 10:35 PM
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Originally posted by Thekherham
sleeper,

are you and John partners in this, or did you become interested because of what John posted?



As far as I'm aware both have had their own experiences but they share many similarities in them



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 10:38 PM
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Originally posted by Thekherham
sleeper,

are you and John partners in this, or did you become interested because of what John posted?




I was quite happy after my thread was locked, I didn't miss any of this, John asked me to field some of the questions for him but I resisted for sometime. I gave in because John is a down to earth decent guy and we have some things in common, primarily knowledge about extraterrestrials.



posted on Jul, 12 2006 @ 10:51 PM
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Thanks for the answer, sleeper.

I hope you don't mind if I don't believe you, but it is really hard to do without any proof. As a person who has had many dreams about an alien world and being alien, I should perhaps approach this a little differently than I have been, but on the other hand when I read things about inhabited planets in our solar system (other than Earth), and cities on the moon, well, I find that hard to believe.



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