Originally posted by Excitable_Boy
I honestly don't believe someone can be born that way. There is no sin nature.
Isn't it then a mental decision to eat the wafer and drink the wine? Can one do that without deciding to do it? Aren't they basically the exact
same things, just done in a different way?
Why doesn't God just live inside everyone anyway? Why would God create mistakes that need to be fixed before He is willing to except them? I don't
think God creates mistakes.
What form of Christian are you and why is yours right and all the rest wrong? Four square...is that Quakers? Why isn't Catholicism true
Christianity? and again, why is your belief right and all the rest wrong?
Genesis 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
Genesis 1:31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.
Genesis 2:15 And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it.
 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.
 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall
not eat of every tree of the garden?
 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye
 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took
of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
Genesis 5:3And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth:
Adam and Eve were made in God's image, when they disobeyed, sin entered the human race, their spirits died and then in Gen. 5:3 we are told that the
children born after that were in Adam's image with the sin nature passed along.
Eating the wafer isn't how someone receives Christ. They are not the same things. That wafer isn't changed into Christ, it is still the same wafer
it was when it was made. That wafer will doing nothing to help your spiritual condition. Eating that wafer is a decision, but it's a decision to eat
some food that feeds the physical body. Adam and Eve made a mental decision to disobey God and sin entered the human race. For sin to be removed each
individual must make a mental decision to place their faith in Christ for the forgiveness of sin. We are talking about the soul here.
I don't know if this helps. Suppose someone committs adultery and they are catholic. They have a feeling they are doing wrong. They decide to go
to church and ingest the eucharist and are under the assumption that it should change them if they are doing wrong. Since that wafer doesn't have
the capability to change that person spiritually that person continues on in their sin. The sin hasn't been removed nor have their desires been
Now someone, anyone catholic, methodist, atheist. They are in the same situation and they hear the gospel. How it is a decision to place faith in
Christ alone for salvation. No ingesting anything. Simply trusting and believing that Jesus Christ is the only way of salvation and the only way for
sin and sins to be forgiven. That person has been drawn by the Holy Spirit and heard the truth and believed it and placed their faith in it.
Salvation then occurs in that life. The Holy Spirit who you cannot see(you see the wafer, that is still a wafer) enters that person and The Holy
Spirit brings that person's dead spirit back to life and makes it sensitive to the things of God. That person is a new creation.
God didn't make a mistake. Everything when He created it was good. satan and his angels and man rejected God, that's where the problem started.
God cannot live with sin, that sin must be punished, which means death and seperation from God. That's God's law and the way it is. So either we
pay for our sin and are seperated from God or God puts into place the alternative plan. Having our sin placed onto someone else. Someone sinless who
had no sin of His own to pay for, Jesus. So that's how our sin is removed and forgiven, by a transference to Christ and in return we are given the
righteousness of Christ.
Why did God do it this way. We don't know the complete answer to that question outside of eternity, but here is one reason.
People are a triune being "like" God. We have a body, soul and spirit. The Bible tells us God walked with Adam and Eve, as in 3 friends walking
next to each other.
When adam and Eve fell, God(the Father) could no longer do that. He was seperated from them. Jesus came to them in the garden after the fall but not
God in His complete fulness. That's not the way God intended, but He knew what would happen so He had the plan already in place to fix the problem,
, I believe upgrade His relationship with mankind, so that it will be better than the original setup.
If 2(Adam and God, Eve and God, Me and God, You and God), what's the closest they can be. Probably holding hands right?
What if there is another way to be even closer, which is what God desires. What if God can live in us. Because of what Christ has done to remove
sin, the God of the Universe lives in those who place their faith in Christ. This also brings another closeness. Since The Holy Spirit(God) lives in
us, our spirit is joined to His Spirit and we are given insight into the Mind of God. We are capable of seeing things and knowing things that God
satan's lie was that if they ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil they would be like God. satan lied and he knew he was
lying,..........but what he didn't know was that he was also kinda telling the truth to a degree.
The lie part was they wouldn't know good and evil, in reality they did good and evil.
and death came to man. The truth he wasn't aware that he played a part in was this,
Galatians ch. 4
 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,
 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.
 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.
 Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.
So now God lives inside those who place their faith in Christ and guess what, we are going to be like God. A down payment has come and then at
Christ's return and in eternity the complete payment is made.
Now when I say like God I don't mean we will be a God, remember that was satan's lie, that we could be God. But we will be "like" God. We will
be able to do some of the things He does and we will know the things He knows and we will learn who He is in totality. But this will take all of
eternity to find out. And Adam and Eve couldn't travel the universe. We will be able to do that. We are an heir of God. He is going to share the
universe(and whatever else there is) with us because of what Christ did, if we simply will place faith in Christ.
I am a christian. I am a member of an Evangelical Free Church. Their articles of faith are Biblically based and sound. Is my denomination the only
one with sound doctrine, no. Are all the people who attend my church saved, I'd like to think so, but I doubt it. Are there others from other
denominations who are saved, absolutely.
The truth of what the Bible about salvation is what one should strive to know.
That can be found in some denominations and others are false.
Jesus warned of this in Matthew 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
What He was saying was that not all would tell the truth of salvation. They will use His name and claim to know Him but really don't. They will
claim to tell the truth but really don't.
[edit on 12-6-2006 by dbrandt]