Former NSA Director Nominated to Head CIA

Thank you, WP23, that is so reassuring! And so un-Constitutional! Any way you slice it, it is an invasion of privacy circumventing the FISA Court, and a violation of the 4th Amendment.

[edit on 11-5-2006 by Icarus Rising]

I wish i knew how old some of our posters are. I wish i could guage who thinks what and why.
There are those here who think dictatorship is good, and Bush is an ideal person.

Maybe i could understand. But i dont.

Originally posted by Icarus Rising
Thank you, WP23, that is so reaussuring!

Glad I could help, I sure don’t want my fellow Americans to be worried all the time.

Originally posted by Icarus Rising
And so un-Constitutional! Any way you slice it, it is an invasion of privacy circumventing the FISA Court, and a violation of the 4th Amendment.

That’s open to debate. By the way, how did they invade your privacy if they don’t even know who made the calls?

EDIT: DG if you want U2U me and I’ll answer any questions you have.

[edit on 11-5-2006 by WestPoint23]

The agency, however, has the means to assemble that sort of information, if it so chooses.

Ah, you forgot to bold this part in your last external quote. Oooops!

The wiretapping and now this blatant attack to our constitutional rights is Illegal, Illegal and more Illegal no matter how much you sugar coat the corrupted government we have.

The whole issue is so hot right now that the president himself had to come out of his office to lie onces again to the American public and justified that what he does is right and that he is protecting us.

I do not want a protection that takes away my constitutional rights and gags me from my freedom of speech because I will be in danger of expressing myself due to be tag a terrorist.

Shame with anybody that support this actions and this attacks to us the American people in this country.

Originally posted by Icarus Rising
Ah, you forgot to bold this part in your last external quote. Oooops!

Just because they have the means to do it, does not mean that they did.

[edit on 11-5-2006 by WestPoint23]

Marg, every dictator has had followers. This is no different, there will be those who WILL NOT see things like you or I.
Hitler had hoardes of people hooting and rallying for him, lets not forget that. Other dictators as well!!!
As mad as it makes me, i do realize it is human nature to adulate someone and put them in a shrine, and give up all your worldly possesions for this one person.
Not to mention that some people refuse to be wrong.
:shk:

That is the problem young people are more idealistic than us the older generation that has seem more and experience more.

They are the easy targets to a dictatorship in the making.

Dg, life in our nation is becoming suffocatin and our way of life is in danger.

This is like having the Nixon era all over again but with a dangerous twist.

The politicians of today are backed up by the powers that be, as long as they served the beast of money and corruption they are protected.

DG, Marge, when you actually want to discuss the topic, with something other than your opinion, feelings, and “experience” let me know, k? I don’t mind the ‘matter of fact’ views and conversation but it’s your views against mines and that really goes nowhere.

Originally posted by WestPoint23
Before you go any further learn what the program was all about. They did not listen to your phone calls nor did they record anyone’s personal information such as names, addresses, and any other identifying sources.

Boy, what a relief! I'm so glad we can trust this government agency to tell us the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth! Whew! [/sarcasm]

See, that's my beef with any of this wiretapping business. IF we could trust the government and all of it's agencies to be honorable and act with integrity, then we could believe what they say, but they have proven to me time and time again that they are untrustworthy and will lie to keep us in the dark.

And now, we can't even ASK about it. Security issue kills domestic spying inquiry.

WASHINGTON - The government has abruptly ended an inquiry into the warrantless eavesdropping program because the National Security Agency refused to grant Justice Department lawyers the necessary security clearance to probe the matter.

And Hayden appears to want to change FISA so that Bush's wiretapping program won't be breaking the law after all! If Bush breaks the law, change the law!

WASHINGTON - CIA director-nominee Michael Hayden has told at least one Democratic senator that he may be open to changing the law that governs eavesdropping on U.S. soil to allow the Bush administration’s warrantless surveillance.
...
Durbin said Hayden told him: “With all the publicity that has surrounded this program, we may be closer to the possibility of asking for a change in FISA.”
Source

This is a clear dictatorship in the making.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Boy, what a relief! I'm so glad we can trust this government agency to tell us the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth! Whew!

Well, technically the agency didn’t say anything, being a secret program and all. The “whistle-blowers” as some like to call them were the ones who apparently revealed this program and its mission. You do trust them don't you?

[edit on 11-5-2006 by WestPoint23]

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

And now, we can't even ASK about it. Security issue kills domestic spying inquiry.

WASHINGTON - The government has abruptly ended an inquiry into the warrantless eavesdropping program because the National Security Agency refused to grant Justice Department lawyers the necessary security clearance to probe the matter.

Well, then the gov't is not doing their job. Just because the NSA said they will stop sharing info does not make that the end of the road. Why do we have courts, otherwise?

And Hayden appears to want to change FISA so that Bush's wiretapping program won't be breaking the law after all! If Bush breaks the law, change the law!

WASHINGTON - CIA director-nominee Michael Hayden has told at least one Democratic senator that he may be open to changing the law that governs eavesdropping on U.S. soil to allow the Bush administration’s warrantless surveillance.

And if that does happen, then just remember that the same power can very well be in the hands of a Democratic president in about 1,000 days.

Which brings us full circle to your earlier statement:

IF we could trust the government and all of it's agencies to be honorable and act with integrity, then we could believe what they say, but they have proven to me time and time again that they are untrustworthy and will lie to keep us in the dark.

It gives me a headache trying to figure it all out.

Originally posted by WestPoint23
You do trust them don't you?

Go ahead and keep joking around about it and refuse to look at the reality of the situation. You're the one going to have to live in the country that's being created now. Your children are going to be the ones compulsorily implanted at birth with government devices that track their every move. You are going to have to live in the world where you have to show your papers when asked by an official, and where personal freedoms are a thing of the past and where privacy is an idea whose time has long gone.

Yuck it up while you can, because I'm convinced that it won't be long till an intelligent man such as yourself will be sorry you didn't see it coming sooner when you could have done something about it...

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Go ahead and keep joking around about it and refuse to look at the reality of the situation.

Ti’s called having a bit of fun. And unfortunately for us our realities don’t seem to be in agreement, however I’m really quite interested to find out what its like to think the way you do.

Also BH, I’m quite comfortable with the country that’s being created now, of course some things have to change, but nothing is perfect. As for the future, well, for obvious reason I can’t comment on it. I will say this though; it must be terrible to have such pessimistic views all the time. :shk:

I wonder... When the American people rise up as one and impeach this arse-willy, do you think the current Bush supporters will just shut up and claim to have always thought there was something fishy about him? Just kinda flip-flop so they don't appear to be ignorant?

I mean, WOW! These scandals are really adding up. Soon, to be seen as a Bush supporter will be similar to being, um, developmentally challenged (retarded for us non-PC folk).


I guess my point is, WHEN DO YOU SAY ENOUGH'S ENOUGH? And what do you do?

Originally posted by Jakomo
Just kinda flip-flop so they don't appear to be ignorant?

I believe someone already has a patent on that

Originally posted by Jakomo
I mean, WOW! These scandals are really adding up. Soon, to be seen as a Bush supporter will be similar to being, um, developmentally challenged (retarded for us non-PC folk).

Don’t worry, I’m sure the opposing crowd is viewed in the same light. What’s good for the goose…

[edit on 11-5-2006 by WestPoint23]

I just walked to the corner store, a little general ma and pa sort of store, and they have a big sign IMPEACH BUSH NOW. Anyhow, that gave me a smile. Citizens of Cape Cod for the Impeachment of Bush.

West, you are comfortable with all this because i bet you dont know what a dictatorship is. No disrespect, but i do not think you know the full implication of all of this. And please, dont tell me this is NOT a dictatorship, but simply a "modern" way of life and for the fight for terrorism. That doesnt cut it, as there is no such thing as modern dictatorship. Not yet, but if Orwell is right, the "Newspeak" will include a definition for modern fascism.

Originally posted by Jakomo
I guess my point is, WHEN DO YOU SAY ENOUGH'S ENOUGH? And what do you do?

Well, his opinion polls are down because of high gas prices. Other than that he has done a great job protecting America. He's a great President.

-- Boat

Originally posted by Boatphone
Well, his opinion polls are down because of high gas prices. Other than that he has done a great job protecting America. He's a great President.

-- Boat

Are they? I'm not really sure what this has to to do with this thread, but here is just one of many articles to the contrary of your personal opinions.

There are also significant pockets of conservatives turning on Bush and Congress over the their failure to tighten immigration laws, restrict same-sex marriage, and put an end to the Iraq war and the rash of political scandals, according to lawmakers and pollsters.

Since Bush took office, government spending has increased by more than 25 percent, the largest increase under any president since Democrat Lyndon B. Johnson.

msnbc.msn.com...

Just curious Boat, are you a Republican or Democrat because I really can't tell who is what anymore, all these parties seem the same now.

[edit on 11-5-2006 by Jamuhn]

Originally posted by Boatphone

Originally posted by Jakomo
I guess my point is, WHEN DO YOU SAY ENOUGH'S ENOUGH? And what do you do?

Well, his opinion polls are down because of high gas prices. Other than that he has done a great job protecting America. He's a great President.

-- Boat

I swear you just like to get a rise out of us. It works. Good job, dude. It passes time away, i'm sure.