It was $2.91.gal in New Hampsta yesterday; I paid more than $50 to fill up for the first time in my long and mis-spent life.

Originally posted by Desert Dawg





I would argue the point that a modern, computer controlled stick shift can be made to ping moreso than the same car/engine with an automatic would.
In either case, the knock sensor hears what's going on and backs the timing off to compensate.
The knock sensor is much more sensitive than the human ear.


I've had no problems with winter gas when we experience a sudden heat wave.
Higher gas mileage in such a situation hasn't happened either.

your right the knock sensor can pick it up before you hear it, but then it's also knocking below the threshold of your hearing all the time. they run the car lean and advance the timing to reduce emmisions and increase milage. you can confuse the computer in a manual easier that an auto. ever drive the early computer controlled FI's. ever have them do a little lurching in second? stop some where and play with the clutch and throttle, starting from a stopped condition. you'll get it to do an audiable knock. usually it's only one before the computer catches it. sometimes one and a softer one.

i can get any fi manual to knock when its at idle. it's all practice and easy to confuse the computer with the load change. practice a little and everyone can do it in any car.

do you know how to get abs to lock up? i can get abs confused enough to lock up. it's rather fun to do. just find one of those rail road crossings with the seel plates between the track. when its wet hit the brakes. abs will try and keep the wheel's from locking and as soon as you hit pavement they will suddenly grab and lock then release and grab and lock. it's an interesting thing to try when there's no one in front of you.

i happen to know a thing or two about distillation of hydrocarbons and what boils at what temp and pressure. lets just say i have operational experience with the distilation of hydrocarbons

vapor lock can and does happen with an electric fuel pump, if it has to pull gas from the tank and the rvp is to high then you'll only be pulling vapors. remember the lower the pressure, the lower the temp things boil at, give off more vapor, when your suction is lowering the pressure . if the pump is in the tank then it wont. although. with the summer rvp at only 11.5 psi (as low as 9psi in some places) then you probably wont have it happen. winter rvp can be as high as 15psi and as low as 13.5 psi.






[edit on 3-5-2006 by bigx01]

Paying $3.79 for regular in Napa, Ca. Drive 14 miles Upvalley and it jumps $0.20 per gallon in a nicely undisguised effort to relieve tourists and wealthy locals of their cash. There are a grand total of 4 gas stations to serve the 30 miles between Napa and Calistoga...all different brands.

The Valley gets a ton of traffic and, being the good Capitalist's we are, the station owners take advantage of the opportunity. Heck, it's always $0.20 more up there.

I know California has to use special fuel blends because of State pollution regs, but still...it feels awfully odd to drive past the huge refineries along San Pablo Bay, about 30 minutes south of here, and yet hear the argument that distance from the production facility effects price...I'm sure there is a logistical element which I don't see...



[edit on 5/3/2006 by apocalypticon]

Paying $2.749/gal in South Carolina.

Still, it's cheaper than any store in North Carolina.

BTW. The roads aren't THAT much better!

[edit on 3/5/06 by Intelearthling]

Originally posted by xander68I noticed that gas seems the cheapest in the mid-west.. and people in California are getting screwed! Why would mid-west states only be paying 2.40 a gallon? What makes it cheaper out there? Anyone know?

Not positive, xander68, but it may very well have something to do with state laws regulating the mix of fuels, additives, etc. It is always given as a reason for the higher fuel prices on the West Coast.

Originally posted by apocalypticon

Originally posted by xander68I noticed that gas seems the cheapest in the mid-west.. and people in California are getting screwed! Why would mid-west states only be paying 2.40 a gallon? What makes it cheaper out there? Anyone know?

Not positive, xander68, but it may very well have something to do with state laws regulating the mix of fuels, additives, etc. It is always given as a reason for the higher fuel prices on the West Coast.

because some of the largest refineries are in the gulf area. most of what the midwest gets is by pipeline and there's very little cost associated with that. there's no pipeline to california and where i live here in the northwest there is just the 5 refineries that supply all of western wa/ oregon from the california border to the canadian border and cascade range west.

supply limited by law (magnusen act (sp)) that keeps the price artificially high. the lawmakers here wine that prices are high but they wont increase allow an increase in refinery size.

you can't limit refineries and then complain that prices are higher than average in the country.

maybe they should buy two lunches and eat them with both faces

i live near 4 of those refineries. and it's called the "magnuson act" or something like that. which limits water borne crude ships to what is needed in the area you described. of course that means supply is tight and demand is strong so higher prices. they need to reevaluate whats needed and allow the smaller refineries to expand to what bp in ferndale does (220k bbls a day) otherwise the small refineries may close down when prices drop. (us oil in tacoma is the smallest) refineries pay the spot price on a 30 day delay so what ever it was 30 days ago is what they pay.

Gas here in Humbolt County CA is $3.45/gal for regular....

Just filled up my tank this afternoon...for regular unleaded it came to a whopping 3 dollars and 39 cents.

As of today (May 3rd, 2006)
Location - Silicon Valley
Price for unleaded: $3.30/gal ..

[edit on 3/5/2006 by radiotrish]

In Richmond Cnty. NC, the current lowest price is 2.83 per gallon. This is down from 2.91 last week. Thank goodness I don't have to commute far to work.

I'm paying $1.17 per litre here in New Brunswick Canada. The worst part is this province is pretty much owned by Irving the Canadian oil giant. Even better is I drive a Dodge Durango with the 5.9L V-8. I put $20 in just to start it

So I suppose in US terms I am paying $4.20 US per gallon...YIKES !!! Looks scary when you put it in terms of gallons....

I paid €119.9 last week in Ireland and believe its gone up again since then.

We are paying like £1,05 in some places per ltr. So thats like $9 a gallon. I put a full tank in my car the other day, of hi-oct, it cost me £118.95.

So im belive that the people in the US and other countrys have it quite good when it comes to petrol.

Does anyone know where I can get a Flinstone car ??? Seems like the next logical step...

This is so not a big deal. And you’ll see I’m right when six months from now the price is about the same and everyone is still alive.

Where I live (DC-Baltimore area) Gas has gone up about 50 cents in the last two or so months. That’s about an extra $5 a week for me. Since It’s gone up I’ve stopped driving my Civic Si like I’m going for pole position (what can I say? Too many track days) and I got an extra 80 miles out of tank which is little more than 2 gallons. So I’m ahead a $1 a week.

I still drive my S2000 like I’m going for pole though…

I don't pay anything for petrol I've haven't driven a car in over 10 years.

Originally posted by bigx01

i can get any fi manual to knock when its at idle. it's all practice and easy to confuse the computer with the load change. practice a little and everyone can do it in any car.

i happen to know a thing or two about distillation of hydrocarbons and what boils at what temp and pressure. lets just say i have operational experience with the distilation of hydrocarbons

vapor lock can and does happen with an electric fuel pump, if it has to pull gas from the tank and the rvp is to high then you'll only be pulling vapors. remember the lower the pressure, the lower the temp things boil at, give off more vapor, when your suction is lowering the pressure . if the pump is in the tank then it wont. although. with the summer rvp at only 11.5 psi (as low as 9psi in some places) then you probably wont have it happen. winter rvp can be as high as 15psi and as low as 13.5 psi.

[edit on 3-5-2006 by bigx01]

Being able to trick the computer and get the car to ping strikes me as interesting, but not particularly useful.

I agree that you can get vapor lock with an electric fuel pump.
Especially so when the pump is mounted forward and perhaps up on the firewall.
All of the electric fuel pumps I've dealt with - and that's most of them - recommend the pump be installed to the rear so it's pushing fuel instead of pulling it.
If the pump is gravity (as in a drag race car with it's tank outlets at the bottom of the fuel cell) fed or siphon fed (top outlet tank or fuel cell) the pump has fuel at the inlet and has only to push it up to carb or injectors.

I've never had vapor lock with a rear mounted electric pump.


Anyway, it looks like you're a part of the refining process.
I believe California is still using MTBE in their gasoline.
After what, four years or so of being outlawed by then governor Gray Davis?
With the proviso that the refineries could use up remaining stocks of MTBE.
They must have had a lot of it on hand.

I note that MTBE gasoline gets just about 10% less mileage than does straight gasoline.
That was true in both of my vehicles.
It was easy to track because I use gas mileage as an indicator of how well the engine's running.

Since MTBE didn't clean up the exhaust 10% and things only improved a couple of percent - if that - from what I understand, the only reason for MTBE was as a profit boost for the oil companies.

Not to mention that MTBE is such a fierce polluter of the water table.
It enters the water supply and doesn't go away in any reasonable length of time.

As a small aside and taking note of the recently retired Exxon CEO's 400 million dollar retirement package I see that one of the retirement perks was that Exxon continue to pay his country club fees.

What a frickin cheapskate.
400 mill and he can't cough up his own country club fees?

Originally posted by Essan
I don't pay anything for petrol I've haven't driven a car in over 10 years.

How do you get around?

I note that a lot of New York folks don't own cars or drive.
Strikes me that taxi costs could more than equal the fuel costs of owning their own car.

Went down a whopping penny, now paying $1.104 per liter, still not anywhere near the 74 cents a liter when I moved here 3 years ago. Thinking about buying a smart car or perhaps a turbo diesel.