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Suntelia Aion and Ouroboros-- sources?

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posted on Apr, 19 2006 @ 06:21 PM
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A lot of Internet sites link the ouroboros to the concept of "Suntelia Aion", which apparently means "the end of the age". It's especially popular in 2012 circles. Does anyone know where exactly this concept appears in ancient Greek texts?

edit: Also, if anyone knows some good books related to Ouroboros feel free to recommend them.

[edit on 19-4-2006 by Shii]




posted on Apr, 19 2006 @ 11:39 PM
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Answer: it doesn't. That's why you can't find it.
en.wikipedia.org...

Like many other religions, the Greeks didn't have an "end of the world" scenario -- or date.

The frenzy over 2012 arose ONLY in the late 20th century (after hopeful doomsayers found their hopes dashed when other prophetic Dates O Doom failed to bring doom.) This hasn't stopped every hopeful re-interpreter on the planet from finding ways to tweak and hammer the data to prove that 2012 is THE Date O Doom (if you remember just 7 years ago, everyone was SURE that 2000 would be THE Date O Doom.)



posted on Apr, 20 2006 @ 12:26 AM
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'SUNTELIA' is a greek word and is used in the bible in this context: 'Suntelia (end) of the aionon (ages)'

www.biblestudents.com...

'Ouroboros' is also greek and means tail-eater:

www.tarvalon.net...

A ton of sites w/ the same article state Plato referenced 'Suntelia Aion', but I see no sources for it. Looks like humbug.



posted on Apr, 20 2006 @ 06:37 AM
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Originally posted by rizla
'SUNTELIA' is a greek word and is used in the bible in this context: 'Suntelia (end) of the aionon (ages)'

Ah... thank you! I didn't find any of those -- good hunting there.

I *think* the Bible was written in Koine Greek and not ancient Greek... anybody know? My knowledge of that language is very weak.



posted on Apr, 20 2006 @ 12:49 PM
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Originally posted by Byrd

Originally posted by rizla
'SUNTELIA' is a greek word and is used in the bible in this context: 'Suntelia (end) of the aionon (ages)'

Ah... thank you! I didn't find any of those -- good hunting there.

I *think* the Bible was written in Koine Greek and not ancient Greek... anybody know? My knowledge of that language is very weak.


Byrd,

This information appeared in another thread here, where I responded to a poster that kept saying "The end of the Suntelia Aion." I pointed out that he was saying "the end of the end of the age."

Anyway, I think I mentioned the Biblical source. I believe it's John. I could be wrong.

Harte



posted on Apr, 22 2006 @ 12:40 PM
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Thanks for your help, guys. The spurious Plato reference might be to Timaeus p.23, where he recounts an Egyptian belief:



exodus2006.com...
Whereupon one of the priests, a prodigiously old man, said: "Oh Solon. Solon. You Greeks are always children - there is not such a thing as an old Greek."
And on hearing this he asked: "What mean you by this saying?"
And the priest replied: "You are young in soul, every one of you. For therein you possess not a single belief that is ancient and derived from old tradition, nor yet one science that is hoary with age. And this is the cause thereof: There have been, and there will be, many and diverse destructions of mankind, of which the greatest are by fire and water, and lesser ones by countless other means. For in truth the story that is told in your country as well as ours, how once upon a time, Phaethon, son of Helios, yoked his father's chariot and, because he was unable to drive it along the course taken by his father burnt up all that was upon the earth, and himself perished by a thunderbolt - that story, as it is told, has the fashion of a legend, but the truth of it lies in the occurrence of a shift of the bodies in the heavens which move round the earth and a destruction of the things on the earth by fierce fire, which recurs at long intervals.
"At such times all they that dwell on the mountains, and in high and dry places, suffer destruction more than those who dwell near to rivers or the sea; and in our case the Nile, our saviour in other ways, saves us also at such times from this calamity by rising high. And when, on the other hand, the Gods purge the earth with a flood of waters, all the herdsmen and shepherds that are in the mountains are saved, hut those in the cities of your land are swept into die sea by the streams; whereas in our country neither then nor at any other time does the water pour down over our fields from above, on the contrary it all tends naturally to swell up from below. Hence it is, for these reasons, that what is here preserved is reckoned to be the most ancient; the truth being that in every place where there is no excessive heat or cold to prevent it, there always exists some human stock, now more, now less in number. And if any event has occurred that is noble or great or in any way conspicuous, whether it be in your country or in ours or in some other place of which we know by report, all such events are recorded from of old and preserved here in our temples; whereas your people and the others are but newly equipped, every time, with letters and all such arts as civilised States require; and when, after the usual interval of years, like a plague, the flood from heaven comes sweeping down afresh upon your people, it leaves none of you but the unlettered and the uncultured, so that you become young as ever, with no knowledge of all that happened in old times in this land or in your own. Certainly the genealogies which you related just now, Solon, concerning the peoples of your country, are little better than children's tales; for, in the first place, you remember but one deluge, though many had occurred previously; and next, you are ignorant of the fact that the noblest and most perfect race amongst men were born in the land where you now dwell, and from them both you yourself are sprung and the whole of your existing city, out of some little seed that chanced to be left over; but this has escaped your notice because for many generations the survivors died with no power to express themselves in writing. For verily at one time, Solon, before the greatest destruction by water, what is now the Athenian state was the bravest in war and supremely well organized also in other respects. It is said that it possessed the most splendid works of art, and the noblest polity of any nation under heaven of which we have heard tell."
Upon hearing this, Solon said that he marvelled, and with the utmost eagerness requested the priest to recount for him in order and exactly all the facts about those citizens of old. The priest then said: "I begrudge you not the story. Solon; nay, I will tell it, both for your own sake and that of your city, and most of all for the sake of the Goddess who has adopted for her own both your land and this of ours, and has nurtured and trained them - yours first by the space of a thousand years, when she had received the seed of you from Ge and Hephaestus, and after that ours. And the duration of our civilisation as set down in our sacred writings is 8,000 years. Of the citizens, then, who lived 9,000 years ago, I will declare to you briefly certain of their laws and the noblest of the deeds they performed; the full account in precise order and detail we shall go through later, at our leisure, taking the actual writings."


He then goes on to tell the story about ancient Athens and... you guessed it... Atlantis.


Ouroboros is not mentioned until p.33.

mod edit- provided link and ex tags

please review this thread...www.abovetopsecret.com...





[edit on 22-4-2006 by masqua]



posted on Apr, 22 2006 @ 02:04 PM
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Originally posted by Shii
Thanks for your help, guys. The spurious Plato reference might be to Timaeus p.23, where he recounts an Egyptian belief:

He then goes on to tell the story about ancient Athens and... you guessed it... Atlantis.


Ouroboros is not mentioned until p.33.

I didn't see anyone mentioning Plato here but you. There is a Greek uasage of the term though. Like I said earlier, I've looked this up before. I found it again:


Let's begin where the word is first used by Matthew in Matthew 24:3. The verse says, "And as He sat upon the Mount of Olives, the disciples came unto Him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what [shall be] the sign of Thy coming parousia), and of the end of the world (aion: "age")?" (all quotes in this section are from the AV). The question for our consideration is this: what do the disciples want to know? Two things, actually. First, they want to know "when" the events are going to take place which Jesus had mentioned in verse 2. There He had made reference to the destruction of the temple buildings. His words were an obvious prophecy, and the disciples, just as obviously, were curious about "when" it would be fulfilled. Also, however, the disciples apparently understood that His prophecy had some implications about Jesus' future "coming" [parousia] and the subsequent "end of the world [aion -- better translated 'age']". Therefore, they asked Him "what" the sign would be that would indicate the fulfillment of His "parousia" promises as well as the "end [suntelia] of the world [aion]".

On the front end, let us make this clear: the use of "aion" signifies that the disciples were not thinking in terms of the end of the world as a final cataclysmic destruction of this earth, but, rather, were thinking in terms of the end of the "age" [a block of time that functions as a preliminary time of preparation for the establishment of the Kingdom of the Son on earth].

Source (one of many - google it):
www.biblical-thinking.org...

I had it wrong earlier. It is the Gospel of Matthew that's the source of the phrase "suntelia aion." The Greek usage comes from the fact that the earliest texts of this Gospel are (or were) written in Greek.

Like Byrd said, the Greeks themselves didn't have this sort of belief.

Speaking of ancient beliefs, what you labeled as an "Egyptian belief" in your previous post is not an Egyptian belief. It is a quaint little tale fabricated by Plato, nothing more.

Harte



posted on Apr, 22 2006 @ 06:31 PM
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Originally posted by Harte
I didn't see anyone mentioning Plato here but you.
Actually, Rizla referred to it. And I didn't mean it was a real Egyptian belief, just that Plato didn't even necessarily believe it himself...

Anyway, you seem to have found the real source, so thanks again.



posted on Apr, 22 2006 @ 07:05 PM
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Originally posted by Shii

Originally posted by Harte
I didn't see anyone mentioning Plato here but you.
Actually, Rizla referred to it. And I didn't mean it was a real Egyptian belief, just that Plato didn't even necessarily believe it himself...

Anyway, you seem to have found the real source, so thanks again.


Sorry, my mistake:

Originally posted by RizlaA ton of sites w/ the same article state Plato referenced 'Suntelia Aion', but I see no sources for it. Looks like humbug.


I should read more carefully! (Put brain in gear before opening mouth.)

Harte



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