Potential Local Power Increase for BNP?

More people 'consider voting BNP'

Anger with the main parties has led more people to consider voting for the British National Party, a report for a social policy research group says.

The Joseph Rowntree Reform Trust said up to 25% of voters said they "might vote" for the far-right party.

Now I would first like to say that the results from the report aren't as scary as they first may seem.
Its 25% of voters who might vote BNP, hell I might vote for the Green Party but it doesn't mean I actually will.
I believe the percentage of people who would actually vote for the BNP is nothing at this point something to be too worried about, however the fact that 25% of people might vote BNP is something to be worried about, how many people have seen the BNP's (hate) policys and looked at the actions of its members.

But don't doubt that the BNP has made gains, although small gains but gains none the less.
For in the 2005 general election the BNP gained 0.7% of the vote, nothing we honestly need to be worried about.
In the European elections they gained 4.9% of the vote, once again nothing scary as they failed to gain a seat, but these slow but steady gains could be a problem in the future.

Further down the source the ''Home Office minister Andy Burnham'' says ''he believed support for the BNP was very localised'', which I believe is true, the BNP live off fears and worries amongst local populations they target working class multi-ethnic areas where people are in fact more worried about their jobs and decent housing.

Minister says BNP tempting voters
White working class voters are being "tempted" by the British National Party as they feel Labour is not listening to their concerns, a minister has said.

I think the Employment minister has it right when she says ''they feel Labour is not listening to their concerns'', but its not just Labour its all the major parties.
People are fed up of the cheesy PR and Spin method from which the big three parties seem to have become addicted to, its turned politics from a world of idealogy into a realm where lies and backstabbing are the norm.
If the big three want to recapture minds and hearts then they need to start listening, listening on both a national and local level, for people see past the bright white smiles and shiny policy names.

People always bring out these statistics near election times to bring out the vote for the powers that be. The government doesn’t want alternative parties winning and the words "BNP" are medicine to this "problem". People will vote anything to avoid a BNP victory (even Labour).

WARNING: The following may be classed as: offensive, derogatory, insulting, impure and dirty. It should not have been created or thought about but now that it has I ask that you do not read it and get offended.

Frankly though; and I would NEVER say it to an opinion pollster, or to anyone who knew me directly (and didn't know me well); but I too would consider voting BNP. I know this is a real life thought crime, and I know if I joined their party I might loose my job, or if I were a public figure I would be "named and shamed". Furthermore I know the party is probably riddled with spies, and that in any case it has little or no chance of coming to power let alone government.

But I would still consider voting for them; here’s why...
1. Unlike any of the major political parties they have ideology and things they are prepared to suffer for (like in some of the ways I listed above). Anybody who is prepared to suffer for things they believe in is already half way to winning my trust, and yes it might be biased but that doesn’t include terrorists.
2. The BNP would almost certainly end modern political correctness. Now I don’t have a problem with the ideals of political correctness (including being against racial discrimination).
What I hate is the socially authoritarian nature of political correctness, and the damn right artificialness. Ever noticed that the most insecure people tend to be the most politically correct? Well I hate it; I hate the idea of weak words like "offensive" and taboo of political expression. I especially hate the media dominated-controlled agenda of modern political correctness. And even though I'm against racial discrimination I dislike so called “positive discrimination” this is ideological, provocative towards our people and just as racist no matter how “positive” people say it is.
3. The BNP is genuinely hated by the filth that makes up our modern political parties (and especially those strong advocates of political correctness who dotter our populace).
4. The BNP would not bankrupt the country
5. The BNP would sort out crime, and those non-Muslims who rioted over the Mohammed picture would certainly have been put under surveillance (if not deported) (rather than just ignored till public uproar).
6. The BNP has little or no chance or coming to power let alone government. This is why I tolerate all their other policies like being against blacks and perfectly decent Muslims. If it were a choice between Lib Dem, Labour or British National Party at the next election I would almost certainly vote Lib Dem. And the BNP are like the Lib Dem’s in the sense that at most they’re a party of office and not government (well in this lifetime or decade anyway).

I would be sincerely worried if the BNP were facing the prospect of government. For one thing they would bring back national service, and apart from being fascist and damn right stupid it isn’t my cup of tea. In fact I would sooner turn the gun on the person forcing orders on me than be made to carry them out (I'm serious). National Human Shield Service might be a good idea for criminals but only if bigger prisons or better rehabilitation schemes somehow really can’t be found.
Anyway like I said the BNP won’t be in government any time soon so all that “kick out foreigners” and “introduce national service” stuff is pie in the sky. I might sooner look out the window and see a green moon made of cheese.
So therefore with that in mind; hence the reason I may be voting for them. And if you look at the reasons I’ve given I think they’re quite sound don’t you?

It’s a lovely statistic that 25% of the population might vote BNP, because to me it means that least somewhere there are at least 25% of the population who aren’t brainwashed. And no, I didn’t say the other 75% are brainwashed just that 25% certainly isn’t (well unless they’re super hardcore BNP members that is, because every party has its brainwashed including Labour and the Conservatives).
Then again about 49% of the population don’t vote, and I guess they aren’t counted by the pollsters or certainly ballot as much.


[edit on 090705 by Liberal1984]

Originally posted by Liberal1984
1. Unlike any of the major political parties they have ideology and things they are prepared to suffer for (like in some of the ways I listed above). Anybody who is prepared to suffer for things they believe in is already half way to winning my trust, and yes it might be biased but that doesn’t include terrorists.

- The other parties do have an 'ideology'. But the days of a rigid 'creed' are long gone. We all ought to have had our eyes open about where that kind of 'thinking' leads, sadly not for some it appears.

You'll find a lot of political nutters 'suffer' for their beliefs, unfortunately their track record tends to be that when given a sniff of power they spread that suffering around, a lot.

2. The BNP would almost certainly end modern political correctness.

- You mean they would try and end this particular version of 'political correctness' and then impose their own (as is/was the case in every fascist and totalitarian state there has even been).

In large part they would fail, because the ideas that we treat each other with respect and a modicum of consideration (and no matter what extremes anyone might dig up - which are usually a grossly exaggerated myth anyway - is what PC is all about) are too ingrained in most.

3. The BNP is genuinely hated

- You say that as if laughing at and hating fascists is a bad thing.

by the filth that makes up our modern political parties (and especially those strong advocates of political correctness who dotter our populace).

- "Filth"?

Nice way to trash large parts of the rest of the 'nation'.......but then that is the truth about those on the ultra end of right or left, hmmmm?

Angry that even 'their own people' want nothing to do with their ideals they end up condescending and hateful of those they claim to 'love' so much.

4. The BNP would not bankrupt the country

-
What fantasy exactly is this based upon?

A BNP government could not help but spark a flight of capital and the ruin of the nation's finances!

5. The BNP would sort out crime, and those non-Muslims who rioted over the Mohammed picture would certainly have been put under surveillance (if not deported) (rather than just ignored till public uproar).

- There hasn't been a police state yet that ever "sorted out crime".
Where did you get that idea from?

Even the most repressive toilets in the world have crime problems (in fact it breeds crime, just a different sort).

6. The BNP has little or no chance or coming to power let alone government.

- That much we can agree on.

This country will never vote for a bunch of neo-nazis (and especially not a bunch of neo-nazis so risibly chicken-sh** that they now go around pretending they are not neo-nazis - when everyone knows they are - in public)

It’s a lovely statistic that 25% of the population might vote BNP

- That isn't the "statistic".
It's a guesstimate of what % of the tiny turnout in the council elections they might attract.

When the results are in why not return and let us all know how many council seats out of the thousands contested they won and then refer back to that 25% if you like.

to me it means that least somewhere there are at least 25% of the population who aren’t brainwashed.

- Well if you think those who don't agree with your outlook might be "brainwashed" that is your conceit.

I didn’t say the other 75% are brainwashed just that 25% certainly isn’t

- Why's that then?
Because you think blaming immigrants for 'you lot' or even 'the state of the nation', a desire to return to an England something like it was in Elizabeth the 1st time (the BNP 'leader' actually said that was his ideal in a TV interview) and what basically amounts to a series of 'attitudes and policies' that would - or ought to - embarrass Alf Garnet for their simplistic nature are perfectly rational and thought out and not at all the product of crass ignorance?



[edit on 20-4-2006 by sminkeypinkey]

Frankly sminkeypinkey you are exactly the sort of person that makes me want to vote BNP. If you don't understand why, then I give up trying to explain. But you made an excellent honest point about the BNP abolishing one form of political correctness and replacing it with another. Frankly political correctness is authoritarian in nature and whoever supports I will oppose. But not the BNP just yet. Why? Because as said the chances of them ever coming to power and implementing any of their more extreme ideas are very slim indeed.

And sminkeypinkey I pass the point back: Most people do not make up the political parties of this country; in fact their lack of involvement is almost certainly a key root of the political problems in this country. If you thought I was calling anyone who votes for them filth then you read those words into your mind and not me.

Basically sminkeypinkey you said it when you said "as if laughing and hating fascists is a bad thing". Because anyone who hates somebody because of their political beliefs (especially when they are out spoken) is themselves worthy of hate.
I would make an exception for anyone who's political beliefs involve thuggary or terrorism because such people should be detestable to everyone accept themselves. But it’s only an acceptation for behaviour (as opposed to political beliefs).

The other good point sminkeypinky made was about the outflow of capital from this country. Again this is only possible in theory that a BNP government should actually win power; but if they did win power chances are sminkeypinky would be wrong because a great social-political force would probably be at work (say through economic downturn across Europe or even the world).
Meanwhile (like in local elections) don’t you think the other parties would be throwing more money to solve an area’s problems? I.e. so they become apparently less likely vote BNP in such large numbers next time.

Anyway hope I’ve done a good job at explaining why people like me might vote BNP. Obviously anyone who is should keep their mouth mostly closed because if your engaging with just anyone your quite likely to have a "heated" debate in no time at all (as this thread shows).

Originally posted by Liberal1984
Frankly sminkeypinkey you are exactly the sort of person that makes me want to vote BNP. If you don't understand why, then I give up trying to explain.

- Well there's a huge cop-out if ever there were.

The fact that my finding the BNP a pathetic and weird mix of the disgusting and the utterly ludicrous "makes you want to vote for them" (a fascist, ridiculously out of date narrow nationalist and racist party) is very much your own problem, not mine.

Most people do not make up the political parties of this country

- OK, there's truth in that in terms of party membership (although they are amongst the biggest voluntary paying members only 'clubs' in the country, still).

Nevertheless the fact is that the majority of 'the people' support one or other of the 3 major parties come election time.

in fact their lack of involvement is almost certainly a key root of the political problems in this country.

- I disagree.
I am not at all convinced this is anything like as big a 'problem' as some wish to make out.

The politically obsessed imagine a nation with nothing better to do than navel-gaze over their politics is, some how, 'better' but that doesn't make it so.

Those who dream of a nation desperate to be bound and lit by the spark of a political ideology are fooling themselves, IMO.
In Europe that kind of thing went with the 1910/20/30's and has long since gone by.

I quite like the fact that ones' personal politics are not a life and death matter to people in this country (as they are or have been in some many others) and that people can ignore utterly politics if they wish to without any personal risk.
I don't see that as all bad at all.

Naturally that would all change if the fascists came into power as they attempted to exert control and extract 'loyalty' to the party (as that kind always do).

Fascist 'PC' verses today's 'PC'?

Don't be absurd.
What idiotic and deluded maniac would turn to fascism's version of 'PC' to escape today's free and democratic reality?
Some people might feel roused to condemn todays 'PC as "socially authoritarian" but that is as nothing to the vicious and authoritarian version of 'PC' fascists impose - every time.

Todays 'PC' simply means that in our public, political and commercial dealings with each other we agree we will not allow ourselves to use prejudice as the basis of those 'dealings' and decisions.
Claims that people cannot hold non-PC private views are an exaggerated lie.

On the otherhand the fascist version of 'PC' fully embraces base prejudice as the basis for making decisions in the world of commerce and politics.
It is the fascist version of 'PC' that has the track record as the one that tries to dictate what people's private views are supposed to be, actually.

Of course for as long as they are on the correct side fascists love the way their ideology does that.......until they fall foul of it and become the ones without rights or a say.

If you thought I was calling anyone who votes for them filth then you read those words into your mind and not me.

- We both know what you wrote and your intention.

Basically sminkeypinkey you said it when you said "as if laughing and hating fascists is a bad thing". Because anyone who hates somebody because of their political beliefs (especially when they are out spoken) is themselves worthy of hate.
I would make an exception for anyone who's political beliefs involve thuggary or terrorism because such people should be detestable to everyone accept themselves. But it’s only an acceptation for behaviour (as opposed to political beliefs).

- Someone who is a fascist fully deserves to be laughed at and hated, for theirs is an anti-democratic, vicious and ignorant ideology of hatred that fully deserves to be matched and returned in kind.
Their ideology is one of real political terrorism and a callous brutality towards their fellow man (who may have the outrageous gaul to see things differently).

.......and btw I take it you meant that "filth" comment in a kind and loving manner, hmmm!?

if they did win power chances are sminkeypinky would be wrong because a great social-political force would probably be at work (say through economic downturn across Europe or even the world).

- The day the UK votes in a fascist party (like the BNP) to power is the day the UK's economy goes into melt-down.

You can dream on and try and imagine all sorts that would 'soft-soap' that truth but it's garbage fantasy.
The international financial markets would be utterly stunned that the UK had chosen such a path and make every move to limit their exposure and contact with such a basketcase (a basketcase that, like every fascist regime before, would attempt to utilise a closed, retarded, risibly simplistic and dictatorial state-ist version of economics long since left behind by almost all of the rest of the world).

The vast amount of money that would leave (and not forgetting the enormous amounts of foreign investment that would dry up) would make the recessions we have had to date look like comparative boom times.
Wise up.

Meanwhile (like in local elections) don’t you think the other parties would be throwing more money to solve an area’s problems? I.e. so they become apparently less likely vote BNP in such large numbers next time.

- Whether or not particular areas have problems with the level of investment directed towards them or not is hardly reason to vote for avowed racists (who have now decided to be too chickensh** to openly admit their racism in the hope of fooling the gullible and excusing those who prefer to keep their eyes closed).

But like I said, rather than speculate on what might happen lets see the actual results.

Out of the thousands of council seats up for election we'll see just how many the BNP take.

Anyway hope I’ve done a good job at explaining why people like me might vote BNP.

- Not really.

Your first comment was to choose not to explain why you might ( ) vote for them.

Obviously anyone who is should keep their mouth mostly closed because if your engaging with just anyone your quite likely to have a "heated" debate in no time at all (as this thread shows).

- Well sorry to burst your bubble but it's just words on a screen, engage or not.

There's nothing "heated" or "disturbed" about it (not from where I am sitting anyway) and there is no reason for anyone to run away from a challenging debate either.

[edit on 20-4-2006 by sminkeypinkey]

Good point about me been open to voting BNP being my probnlem and yours. In fact given your earliar tone i'm surprised you said that at all. But yeah I agree.
As long as you can accept that much we can put our trust in democracy. Right now the BNP has no hope in any British democracy no matter how functional it may be. Maybe someday you will understand that is one of my primary reasons for being prepard to vote for it?

Originally posted by Liberal1984

I made a stupid typing mkistake
Instead of saying...
"Good point about me been open to voting BNP being my problem and yours"

What I meant to say was: ""Good point about saying me been open to voting BNP being my problem and NOT yours". Unfortunately missing that one word reversed the meaning of what I was saying!