Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
I don't find where you said a "perceived" tone.
I was emphasizing that I perceived a tone that wasn't there. I wasn't trying to change what I initially said.
You said, "The patronizing tone of your response..." Regardless, I wasn't feeling patronizing when I wrote it. It would be nice if you and I could
just extract the issues between ceci, riley and I and assume that each other has good intentions.
Since you explained that I was 'hearing' stuff that wasn't actually there, I got what you meant. I'm sorry if it seemed like I was still arguing.
In my mind, we're just friends having a spirited debate.
Originally posted by HarlemHottie
Because we know the exact numbers, we can agree that racism is a societal problem exacted against all races.
Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
I wasn't aware that we know the exact numbers... I'm a little confused by this... Sounds like you have some sources I don't?
Well, the statistics from the FBI are a very good start on 'the numbers' of anti-white racism. I asked for background, and you gave it. You've
convinced me! In my response, I was trying to make the point that it was those numbers that made me see it as a societal problem, instead of one
really crappy thing that happened to Riley.
To be absolutely honest, I'm very concerned about our discussion turning into another argument and I won't let that happen, even if it means
It won't happen. It seems like the both of us, and correct me if I'm wrong, are reading additional meanings into what each other said, if that made
sense. You know what I mean. And don't step out.
Why is racism such a taboo subject? I now have a pretty good idea of why people have a hard time discussing it civilly, without sarcasm, accusations,
'tones' and anger. It's a sensitive subject, especially for people who have suffered it a lot.
I agree with what you said about the sensitivity of the subject, but I would also posit that the medium, a discussion board, leaves a lot open to
interpretation unless you just abuse
It's like me discussing rape. I don't have much sympathy when people start talking about the poor men who are falsely accused of rape. How it ruins
their lives. Boo-Hoo. Because of my biased position, it's hard for me to acknowledge that men are not only sometimes the victims of rape (by women
and other men) but that they are sometimes falsely accused and hurt by the accusation.
But I manage (grudgingly) to see that side of it.
Yep, you hit it right on the nose.
And I have felt resistance to that since like page 1 or 2 of this thread.
Incidentally, I wasn't as heavily involved in the thread at that point as I am now, but I see what you're saying.
I fully acknowledge white racism. I have acknowledged that I was raised in a racist environment and still have some prejudicial tendencies I'd like
to shake. But having read my posts, you know I 'fight' for the victims of racism, prejudice and discrimination, for whatever reason.
Let me say this now, because I'm now seeing that I never stated my position. I started out not prejudiced at all. My mom went out of her way to
expose me to whites, since there weren't that many in our neighborhood when I was growing up in the 80's. As a child who read a lot, I found out
about all the stuff that had happened to my people in this country before I was born and thought, with a sigh of relief, Whew! Thank God I missed
that. When my mom explained to me that her father had been run out of his small Southern hometown, where our ancestors had been enslaved, for
standing up for himself against a white man, I felt relief that they had relocated to NY.
No one ever called me the N-word, but I have been referred to as a 'colored gal,' which I found offensive, but more ignorant than racist. I
explained to the person who said it that we're no longer 'colored,' and she was appropriately embarrased, and we got over it. Over time, I've
personally been affected by institutional racism, and that's why I've made that my focus in this thread. I'm not prejudiced against white people
individually, at all. Of course, white people are just people, with the same concerns and issues as everybpdy else. What I don't like is the way
they act in groups, for example, lynch mobs, the NYPD, and the US government. (I don't like the way other people act in groups either, but I didn't
really think that was pertinent to our conversation.) My prejudice shows itself when I'm immediately suspicious of those groups.
I'm sure that someone will take offense to what I said, but it's my opinion, and I thought that honesty would be more useful here than tact.
In this thread, specifically about racism, I wanted to explore all facets of it. But time after time, it is indicated to me that racism against white
people is either 'classism', doesn't exist, is from invalid sources, or in some other way mis-labeled or questionable.
Some of the stuff you bring up here was said by Ceci, so I'll let her defend herself, but I'll address my classism remark and the whole invalid
sources thing. The reason I mentionned classism was because, in all of my conversations about race with black people, what tends to come up the most
is that white people are rich, to which I respond, not true, since I've personally known poor white people. But, the assumption remains that, since
white business owners are more likely to 'give a chance' to a fellow white person, they have more opportunities to improve their economic status.
In fact, I'm sure that a majority of the wealth in this country is controlled by whites, and so, just a theory here, as a criminal of any color,
wouldn't you rob the person with the most likelihood of having something worth stealing? That's why I said what I said. Also, the stats of the
website you provided left out the percentage of white-on-white crime, so I can't say with say with any certainty if the white criminals in those
years robbed/beat/etc other white people, as a result of classism.
About the initial sources, yes, they were invalid because they were biased. I wouldn't give you a link to a Black Power website to try to make a
point in this discussion.