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Pyramids at Giza were there BEFORE the Egyptians got there.

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posted on Aug, 26 2006 @ 10:22 PM
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Originally posted by Harte

Originally posted by Marduk
ok ok but teook has eyebrows like a girl
i suspect he moonlights as a drag entertainer

He shore has a purty mouth!


H


I see you guys are finally coming out of the closet huh?




posted on Aug, 26 2006 @ 10:48 PM
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Samuel Noah Kramer in Enki Builds the E-Engurra:
"Then Enki raises the city of Eridu from the abyss and makes it float over the water like a lofty mountain.


never heard of a metaphor Beth
if you find any lofty mountains that float over the water be sure to let me know
you do know that Eridu was excavated by H.R. Hall in 1918 right ?
it was amazing the way that it didn't float above anything at all
remarkably unfloaty



posted on Aug, 26 2006 @ 11:21 PM
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ONE...


Andrew Collins, author of Gods of Eden: Egypt's lost legacy and the genesis of civilisation (Headline, 1998), cites a 10th-century Arab historian who recorded a folk tale about the origin of the Great Pyramid. According to the story, the builders struck the stone blocks with a special rod, causing them to levitate and float through the air for the distance of "one bowshot." Collins insists that "the ancient Egyptians were able to set up some kind of sustained sound vibration that enabled the building blocks to defy gravity." He adds, "Although simply a legend, there are traditions from all around the world that speak of the movement of stone blocks and the construction of walls and buildings by sonic levitation."



posted on Aug, 27 2006 @ 12:06 AM
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Zero
Collins is a well known pseudo crackpot who makes it up as he goes along
thats like saying its true because Von Daniken says so
can you quote any actual credible sources ?


[edit on 27-8-2006 by Marduk]



posted on Aug, 27 2006 @ 01:23 AM
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Originally posted by Marduk
Zero
Collins is a well known pseudo crackpot who makes it up as he goes along
thats like saying its true because Von Daniken says so
can you quote any actual credible sources ?


[edit on 27-8-2006 by Marduk]


Yes, everything that doesn't fit the paradigm is either a crackpot or a metaphor. Like Acharya S' belief that all the ancient civs references to supernatural events were metaphors - ALL OF THEM, no matter what continent, no matter what tribe, no matter what. Just a metaphor for the sun, moon, planets and stars and nothing else. It's amazing that what the ancients called their history, mainstream wants to call their metaphors and hallucengic trips on magic mushrooms



posted on Aug, 27 2006 @ 09:35 AM
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It's amazing that what the ancients called their history, mainstream wants to call their metaphors and hallucengic trips on magic mushrooms

now youre getting confused
its Hancock who claims they were all on drugs
you dont think Hancock is mainstream do you ?



posted on Aug, 27 2006 @ 07:26 PM
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Originally posted by zorgon
ONE...


Andrew Collins, author of Gods of Eden: Egypt's lost legacy and the genesis of civilisation (Headline, 1998), cites a 10th-century Arab historian who recorded a folk tale about the origin of the Great Pyramid. According to the story, the builders struck the stone blocks with a special rod, causing them to levitate and float through the air for the distance of "one bowshot." Collins insists that "the ancient Egyptians were able to set up some kind of sustained sound vibration that enabled the building blocks to defy gravity." He adds, "Although simply a legend, there are traditions from all around the world that speak of the movement of stone blocks and the construction of walls and buildings by sonic levitation."


This contradicts all (and I mean *ALL* of the older sources, including Heroditus of Greece, one of the first to collect the stories of the people and write about what folks told him.

It sounds like he's doing a very bad riff/interpretation of the Arabian Nights folktales. If a fable about pyramid blocks being moved by sound had existed, it would have been put forth by EVERY "pyramidologist" and old time archaeologists in the world.



posted on Aug, 27 2006 @ 08:17 PM
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Originally posted by Byrd

Originally posted by zorgon
ONE...


Andrew Collins, author of Gods of Eden: Egypt's lost legacy and the genesis of civilisation (Headline, 1998), cites a 10th-century Arab historian who recorded a folk tale about the origin of the Great Pyramid. According to the story, the builders struck the stone blocks with a special rod, causing them to levitate and float through the air for the distance of "one bowshot." Collins insists that "the ancient Egyptians were able to set up some kind of sustained sound vibration that enabled the building blocks to defy gravity." He adds, "Although simply a legend, there are traditions from all around the world that speak of the movement of stone blocks and the construction of walls and buildings by sonic levitation."


This contradicts all (and I mean *ALL* of the older sources, including Heroditus of Greece, one of the first to collect the stories of the people and write about what folks told him.

It sounds like he's doing a very bad riff/interpretation of the Arabian Nights folktales. If a fable about pyramid blocks being moved by sound had existed, it would have been put forth by EVERY "pyramidologist" and old time archaeologists in the world.


This is certainly a more logical approach to debate the question than simply claiming the guy was a crackpot or the people didn't know how to recount their own history without metaphors every two seconds.



posted on Aug, 27 2006 @ 08:22 PM
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Originally posted by Marduk



It's amazing that what the ancients called their history, mainstream wants to call their metaphors and hallucengic trips on magic mushrooms

now youre getting confused
its Hancock who claims they were all on drugs
you dont think Hancock is mainstream do you ?



He makes some interesting points, but I'm not terribly thrilled with the direction it's taking. Some of his other work is pretty good. I don't agree with him on everything but then I don't agree with you on everything either.



posted on Aug, 27 2006 @ 09:36 PM
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LaBtop,

Since you are very adept at research and have the patience to prepare a thorough presentation on the subject matter you are studying, I have a CHALLENGE for you if you are willing to accept it. (insert mission impossible music) Here's the CHALLENGE:

I've been researching the life of Seti I, in relation to his and prior pharaohs abiding interest in finding the burial site of Osiris at Abydos. Upon discovering the Osirieon, during excavations for his own Temple, Seti I connected it to his own temple via an underground passage. There's no indication of what Seti I found there. No references to the contents of the chamber, anywhere, only the blurb that it must've contained a sarcophagus at one point and perhaps some funerary equipment/furniture. If you could find out what specifically Seti I found when he opened the Osirieon or what later archaeologists found upon re-discovering it, that would be nothing short of fantastic. (Hint: Specifics please. No standard byline of "they think it may have contained a sarcophagus." I already know that!)

The real CHALLENGE, however, is to find out what, if anything is happening and/or has happened with the "K" corridor in Seti I's tomb in the Valley of the Kings. I already am aware that they had determined the passage continued to descend with more hieroglyphs on the walls, even below the water line - so I need new data. Like, have they done anything else in that regard? Any new info? Have they dug deeper? New chambers found? I can't believe they would find the longest and most highly decorated tomb of a pharaoh in all of ancient Egypt and stop digging in a tunnel that continued onward! Something must be going on down there. We need to know what!



[edit on 27-8-2006 by undo]



posted on Aug, 27 2006 @ 10:34 PM
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Originally posted by zorgon
ONE...


Andrew Collins, author of Gods of Eden: Egypt's lost legacy and the genesis of civilisation (Headline, 1998), cites a 10th-century Arab historian who recorded a folk tale about the origin of the Great Pyramid. According to the story, the builders struck the stone blocks with a special rod, causing them to levitate and float through the air for the distance of "one bowshot." Collins insists that "the ancient Egyptians were able to set up some kind of sustained sound vibration that enabled the building blocks to defy gravity." He adds, "Although simply a legend, there are traditions from all around the world that speak of the movement of stone blocks and the construction of walls and buildings by sonic levitation."


Its called the Staff of Ra (not like Indie's in Raiders..). The stones were wrapped in wet papyrus, then they hit the stone to get the staff vibrating. Once the staff was at the right frequency? they laid the staff back onto the stone so the vibrations could go into the stone and vibrate sympathetically. I guess this would make the stone as light as the staff, which would make it movable by one or two guys.

An archaeologist went to Tibet where he saw stones lifted by music (one instrument was a gong/symbol made of 3 different metals including gold) and the stone was palced on a concave stone platform to amplify the sound. One in about 4 stones would shatter from the vibrations. The rest levitated or could be easily lifted.

I saw on the history channel how modern stone cutters who use the same techniques as the ancients would hit a large stone along a line to get the vibrations to run down the center of the stone. They then smacked one side really hard and it broke in two in an almost perfect cut.

A guy who went to egypt to test the great pyramid for its frequencys (the Kings chamber has a 16hz freq. (F#), same as the earth), his company makes a sonic levitation machine used to levitate small amounts of molten metal or whatever you want. I doubt they have tried to lift a stone with it, but it is sonic levitation. (and I gave a link to his website in an earlier discussion about sonic lev. you can search for it)

It would be very cool to go back in time to see the pyramids get built. Wheres our time machines and flying cars, arnt we living in the future?



posted on Aug, 29 2006 @ 11:44 AM
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Originally posted by ViolatoR

An archaeologist went to Tibet where he saw stones lifted by music (one instrument was a gong/symbol made of 3 different metals including gold) and the stone was palced on a concave stone platform to amplify the sound. One in about 4 stones would shatter from the vibrations. The rest levitated or could be easily lifted.


LOL Good work


That was TWO

Levitation in Tibet 1939




I saw on the history channel how modern stone cutters who use the same techniques as the ancients would hit a large stone along a line to get the vibrations to run down the center of the stone. They then smacked one side really hard and it broke in two in an almost perfect cut.


Yes and modern stone cutters get paid very well for such skills. Crystal vibration studies have been around a long time, kids used to be able to buy a crystal radio set to make at home. Why is it so hard for people to imagine that there may yet be properties involving crystal resonance that we have yet to discover?




A guy who went to egypt to test the great pyramid for its frequencys (the Kings chamber has a 16hz freq. (F#), same as the earth), his company makes a sonic levitation machine used to levitate small amounts of molten metal or whatever you want. I doubt they have tried to lift a stone with it, but it is sonic levitation. (and I gave a link to his website in an earlier discussion about sonic lev. you can search for it)


Cool! Thats why I love this board... you get some real answers
I didn't have that one yet. Please a name? or be so kind as to repost that link..

I have another one on levitation, but as it was electromagnetic I left it out but what the heck... it too IS levitation

Miesner Effect

And this is from the University of Melbourne not a psuedo science nut sace on magic mushrooms.



It would be very cool to go back in time to see the pyramids get built. Wheres our time machines and flying cars, arnt we living in the future?


We're working on those... but research takes money, and you have to keep out of sight from the MIB's The government really doesn't like you messing with this stuff... seriously...
[with good reason I might add... no matter what conspiracy nuts think... but thats for another thread] You can check out Pegasus for updates on that research...

Any decent link you have for us we will include



posted on Aug, 29 2006 @ 12:01 PM
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Originally posted by Byrd

This contradicts all (and I mean *ALL* of the older sources, including Heroditus of Greece, one of the first to collect the stories of the people and write about what folks told him.


Well perhaps that is true of *ALL* the mainstream archeological accounts and research. And to be perfectly honest I do not believe they used sonic vibrations to accomplish the task, as there are many other simpler ways. At this point in time it is impossible to offer proof of moving HUGH rocks by levitation, but experiments are being done by many university, private and government labs on levitation [or better stated anti gravity] research with some surprizing, albeit small results.

Small results are at the very lease proof that the principles are sound, its only a matter of time before its common usage, just like any other scientific discovery.


Off topic for one moment to illustrate a point...

One example of such research is plasma drives... for years UFO buffs and conspiracy theorists have talked about secret triangular craft that run on alien tech. These people claim humans are too dumb to create such tech, yet we ARE smart enough to reverse engineer these alien craft and use them... [kinda like the ancients where smart enough to cesign and buils mega structures, but were simpletons who saw "gods" in everything]

Well a simple check at a real source such as the AFRL and Los Alamos National Laboratory where they actually work on stuff like this and SHARE with the public will give you some surprising info...

Like triangular craft that do not have ailerons to steer them, but use plasma... And still I see people in here saying "Its a Lie!!" :shk:

Air Force Plasma Actuator

Not its not aliens its our own Air Force... bout time the Human Race gets a little credit here..


(edit...DARN the last half of the post didn't go through... I will have to rewrite it later
)

[edit on 29-8-2006 by zorgon]



posted on Aug, 29 2006 @ 07:51 PM
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This thread: www.abovetopsecret.com... has a good video, im sure you've seen by now.

www.containerless.com... (Link is dead now) The Containerless Research website that made the levitation machine for use in making beads of glass or metel.

I did save a picture of the machine:


The guy who went to egypt to test the pyramids sound is Tom Danley



www.thelosthaven.co.uk...

One current theory championed by American engineer Tom Danley, postulates that the stones were 'floated' into place using a technique he calls 'sonic levitation'.
Danley has studied this technology for years based on earlier pioneering work with infasonics carried out by French researcher Vladimir Garveau during the 1950's...
-
Danley believes that an allied technology was employed by the ancient Egyptians to vibrate the stone blocks at a high frequency, thereby rendering them effectively weightless.
-
An American acoustics engineer - Tom Danley, has been working with colleagues in a company called Intersonics, on research which has led to Acoustic Levitation and Positioning Devices, which have been tested by NASA.




www.nasa.gov...

There's a new glass in town. The glass, developed with the help of a unique NASA levitator facility, is available for numerous commercial applications including lasers and optical communications.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
provided link and used 'ex' tags






[edit on 29-8-2006 by masqua]



posted on Aug, 29 2006 @ 09:08 PM
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its impossible to use floating vibrating blocks
sandstone would disintergrate before that was possible unless each block was completely free of any flaw
and flaw free sandstone is not what was used to build the G.P.
and besides when its possible for one man to move a block weighing 21,600lbs all on his own anyway who needs it
www.theforgottentechnology.com...
Wally Wallington frequently makes fools of Egyptologists and Pseudo Authors alike
all his techniques are simple, possible and were available to the ancients of the A.N.E.






posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 02:10 AM
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Originally posted by ViolatoR

www.containerless.com... (Link is dead now) The Containerless Research website that made the levitation machine for use in making beads of glass or metel.


No problem it was there [just removed the aal.htm and got there website

[ex[Our unique capabilities include containerless processing equipment. Containerless, as the name implies, means that we can process glasses without using a container (levitation melting) to enable benchmarking of ultra-high purity materials and synthesis of novel glasses.

Thanks for the link


Seems they are under NASA contract now too...


I wrote to Tom to add his work to our project, and no that was the first time I saw that video... pretty awesome... they control motion and speed too


It will take me a few days to get that info posted LOL I have a back log... sucks when you have to go to work
But thanks for the finds...

[edit on 30-8-2006 by zorgon]



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 02:16 AM
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Originally posted by Marduk
its impossible to use floating vibrating blocks


All I say to that is...

Clarke's Second Law:

"The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past
them into the impossible."


The experts said it was impossible to fly, yet two bicycle mechanis showed them how.
The experts said it was impossible to go faster than sound...seems they were wrong
I can find hundreds of these...

Actually I wonder why we call them "experts" if they are always proven wrong


But thanks for that direct link I only had it from another website and hadn't taken the time to hunt it down... He makes a very good point, but [turning it back at you] if you had a priest with a levitating rod, why do all that work? I mean I could build a building with that method today, but I would really rather use the crane...

[edit on 30-8-2006 by zorgon]



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 10:27 AM
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if you had a priest with a levitating rod, why do all that work?

just imagine you were lucky and only one in ten blocks disintergrated when the priest tried to use his levitating rod on it
that would leave you with one tenth of the great pyramid to dispose of (which has never been found)
would Pharoah be impressed
its Pharoah who's important
you'd always use the most reliable method wouldn't you
we have electric car technology today
its more reliable than fuel driven cars
why don't we use it
and when you have thousands of labourers who are working for little or no wages what suddenly becomes the cheapest and most reliable method of construction

floating blocks may sound like a nice idea
but practicality is a workable hypothesis
if the floating blocks idea was actually being used the G.P. would be entirely made out of granite
because granite being more solid than limestone is far less prone to fall apart under a vibration
they found the camp that the pyramid building crew used you know
it had thousands of workers.
excavated remains of the workers showed that they had lived a life full of back breaking work
neither would be the case if they were floating rocks around the Giza plateau
and the quarry chosen was along the course of a river
can you float blocks over water ?
i guess the river would soon become blocked if you messed a few and dropped them
it isn't




[edit on 30-8-2006 by Marduk]



posted on Sep, 2 2006 @ 05:46 AM
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It just figures...Fall asleep at the keyboard for a year or so & Byrd steps into my own area of expertise, ancient Egypt. Grrrrr! Oh well, no hard feelings. Ya' snooze, ya' lose, right Byrd?
I just hope I'm not too late to add my own 2 cents.


Originally posted by Byrd
There's been people (and villages and so forth) in and around that area for more than 700,000 years.

It was about the past 30,000 years or so that populations began to concentrate around the Nile area...People had always been there (for as long as there were people, anyway) but the receding Ice Age was turning the northern savannahs into deserts. Former nomads needed better land & eventually migrated to the Nile. At the time, the Nile Valley was the best real estate available in the whole Med Sea area.


Originally posted by Byrd
There's a wealth of material that's not seen by people focusing solely on the pyramid argument...

Yep...The whole paragraph. A lot of the materials that were found had been dug up around oasis areas and areas that archeologists believed that old oasis existed. For example, a low-lying basin area (that caught & held summer rains in a seaonal lake) in what is now southwest Egypt (about 60 miles west of the Temple at Abu Simbel) called Nabta Playa, is where a tight-knit dry plains tribe of nomads settled. Even though, about 8,000 years ago, the settlement was considered permanent, they still had to pay close attention to seasonal rains because they only had 2 days to move on, between life & death, if their wells dried up. In this area, archeologists found a small circle (about 13m diameter) of stone slabs, arranged much like Stonehenge, but it was already in place more than 2000 years before Stonehenge! They even had a large festival area designated by 10 huge worked stones & 30 smaller mounds covered with worked stone slabs...The large stones weighed over 1-1/2 tons! The quarry where these stones originated was found over a mile away. Nabta Platya contained also, the oldest known examples of African pottery.

In some of the findings at Abydos (about 3250 BC) were also showing the indications of the beginnings of WRITING. Not a formal system of writing, certainly, but the beginnings of what would become the familar heiroglyphic style. Pottery shards had been seen to have crude symbols (representing sounds, not actual objects) indicating the inventory of tributes & trade between nomadic tribes; some trade even indicates wine-trade with Mesopotamia!
In fact, an entire tomb had been found filled with such burial goods...Designating a Dynasty 0 King U-J (no, Egyptians didn't use vowels in written language either). The labels on the tomb goods pushes back the date on Egypt having a system of writing by 150 years (to at least 3250 BC).

Egypt was already building the world's oldest know dams by the earliest times of the Pyramid Age (Even though Herodotus attributes it to King Menes, that has not been ascertained yet)! The Helwan Dam (20 south of Cairo) was built to protect Memphis from excessive Nile flooding.
(All of the above info: Egypt Uncovered by Vivian Davies & Renee Friedman)


Originally posted by Byrd
There's over a hundred of them, some can be dated because they were tombs, the earliest mention of pyramids and construction is during the time of Djoser (about 3000 BC) and these are not real pyramids but rather mastabas.

Basically, Djoser wanted a better tomb than every other "Ptah, Dick & Hathor" (:@@
...It was his Chief Architect, Imhotep, who came up with the idea of stacking mastabas into a step-pyramid.


Originally posted by Byrd
There was no worldwide Deluge. The records (grain shipments, wine making, treaties, etc, etc) start around 5,000 BC and continue onward. There's no thousand year gap and an "Ohmygods! We got flooded out and EVERYONE died!" statement.

Right...See immediately below.

lostinspace--Your list of Kings was good, but Oxford University Press published "Ancient Egypt" in 1997; it also includes this "pre-dynastic" list. All Dates are approximate & BCE (Before Common Era).
5000-4000 Badarian
4000-3500 Naqada 1 (Amratian)
3500-3100 Naqada 2 (Gerzian)
The above have no documented names of kings, but are described by the type of culture. The book describes the cultures is some detail.
3100-3000 Dynasty 0 (Naqada 3)
An unknown number of kings, including "King Scorpion" & ending with King Namer (possibly aka: Menes)


Originally posted by Byrd
Your theory also neglects the amount of information we have on each king... how many wives they had, who their sons were (and sometimes daughters) and which of their daughters and granddaughters they married (incest was common, remember.)

Well, among the royal family, at least. Many early nations intermarried among the family, but that was due mostly to religious or heritage (many royal lineages were passed through whoever married the king's daughter) & the practice continued through the European Feudal Age. Among Egyptian commoners, the indications are that they usually married outside the family...either for love or to establish different family-aliances. One thing that confuses the issue, in egypt anyway, is that many married couples referred to each other as "brother" & "sister"...But more in terms of affection & emotional bonds rather than bonds of blood.


Originally posted by Byrd
I think our education system is at fault because we focus on the history of certain parts of Europe and America and gloss over the rest of the world and the ancient world.

Sigh! Byrd, what are the schools teaching kids these days, anyway? Something called "critical thinking" is sadly lacking in the ciriculum.


One thing that's not "common knowledge" about Egypt; they did have a very precise system of mathematics & even some of the most advanced medical practices of the time. As far as the math goes, the advanced stuff was for the Priests & Pharoahs (who was also the Chief Priest over all others, BTW), but what is most commonly found is the "rules of thumb" & approximations in daily use among the majority of the population.

Egyptians had herbalism, contraception & even paternal medical practitioners! For example, they would have a woman urinate on a sack of barley & merely water another...If the urinated bag aprouted first, the woman was pregnant. This was actually tested in modern times & IT WORKS! It's the hormones in the woman's urine that triggered faster growth in the barely! The one major medical area where Egypt was behind though, was surgery; For religious reasons, they were more practiced at fixing deformaties & debilitating injuries before burial. They preferred to keep a living body as it was, but "fixed" it so that it would be perfect for the journey through the underworld after death.

Also, as much as modern Western Society was influence by the Classical Greeks, one thing they never teach in school is that those very same Greeks owe as much, or more, of their culture to Egypt!


Originally posted by Byrd
...use www.scholar.google.com...

This is a new one on me; maybe I can do even more research on my personally favorite historical subject now. Thanks for the new bookmark, Byrd.



Originally posted by Byrd
This was a lively civilization with many cities in a land that was divided into separate kingdoms several times (including the era of the Hyksos); a civilization that lasted for over 3,000 years.

Yep, even during the Intermeditate Periods between Kingdoms, when Egypt was under foriegn rule (Third Intermediate Period was ruled by their southern neighbors, the Nubians). All the way through the Ptolemic Dynasties (ruled by Greeks), until coming under Roman rule, Egypt & it's rulers have kept their own indigenous culture intact. Not even China can boast of that longevity.


Originally posted by Shane
The status quo is Cheop's/Kufu! With nothing more that a couple of scribe marks to encompass the complex theory satan has spun over the eons of time.

Would you also accept some graffiti scratched into the topmost of the stress-relief chambers situated above the "King's Chamber"? One of the workers left an inscription inside the stress chamber praising Khufu & expressing pride at being one of the many who built such a monument for his Pharoah's afterlife. *Time Life video series, named "The Great Egyptians" & hosted by by Mark Lehner...I taped it when it aired on The Learning Channel (I think it was) a few years ago. If you ask nicely enough, I can even get you the details you would need to order a copy of the series.



Originally posted by Byrd
The Egyptians never worshipped Yahweh and the "chief god" depended on a number of things (some eras it was Horus, in some areas and times it was a blend of Horus and other gods, sometimes it was Amun, sometimes it was Osiris, etc, etc.) They continued this from the earliest kingdoms until fairly late (post Romans, which would be after 0 AD.)

Just a bit more detail:
The Egyptians considered Amun to be the Creator God, who self-created on the Primal Mound amidst the waters of Nun. From there, he created several other gods/goddesses who created everything else, from Amun's will & word. Most of the work of creation was handled by Ptah.

------------continued----------



posted on Sep, 2 2006 @ 05:53 AM
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---------Still going-------------
-(If you see a little pink rabbit hawking batteries, you have permission to shoot it)-

Osiris, Seth, Isis & others may have actually been mortal rulers, their confrontations & clashes becoming the stuff of legend & religion long after they lived. This is considered to be part of the "Osirian Cycle", when the tenants concerning rulership, concepts of Order & Chaos and the basis of their beliefs in Life & the Afterlife first formed. If the "Osirian Cycle" ever actually happened in ancient history (And there's none who can truly verify it), then these people must have been very influential indeed!

However, I have heard something about a discovery that may involve finding the Tomb of Osiris, but I don't remember much off-hand...Unfortunately, every time I try to find something on the internet, I run into a JSTOR page that says I don't have access to that info because I'm not an accredited scholar.


Originally posted by Shane
This is the difference I wished to note, since a simple read of the Bible implies exaclty what you have siad, but simple people gave us the KJV and lefts notes to the reader about difficulties.

Actually, the KJV was never intended to be a real scholarly attempt to translate scripture nor to honestly deliberate the context of meaning in the languages used to write it. It was originally meant to make sure that King James had "biblical justification" for the King's "divine right to rule". Since it's been a few hundred years, the KJV did go through some real scholarly corrections, but it's origin may still leave doubt about its accuracy. If you really want to know about scripture & why there's so many different Bible Versions, it may help to check out a book called, "The Mystery & Meaning of the Dead Sea Scrolls" by Hershel Shanks. It doesn't really address any specific differences between versions, but it does relate to how scholars approached the problems of translation & context of language as it fit into their time period.


Originally posted by Byrd
The verse is, however, perfectly consistant with a prophet yelling doom and gloom in the 800 BC era -- a time that is fun for historians to contemplate but one that must have been agnonizing to live through.

I would tend to agree; 800 BC was early in the Third Intermediate Period, when Nubians ruled Egypt....Still pretty fresh out of the conflict.


Originally posted by wild_cat
...they used that pink thing in our skull...

Usually referred to as "gray matter"...



Originally posted by wild_cat
Also, i realize that they did not have cranes or earth movers to construct the pyramid, but they have something close to it. Slavery.

Even if slaves were used to haul the stones, it was up to architechs & artisians to get the measurements done right so that the stone fitted so precisely as it does. Even so, a very high percentage of the labor was done by free Egyptian Citizens. You have to remember that most of the workforce available in Egypt was during flood season, when the farmers had nothing to do. Also consider that, during that particular Dynasty, Egypt was doing very well & had lots of extra prosperity, so those free laborers could even be payed wages (bread & beer, most commonly). I'd bet that those otherwise-idle people were glad to have work.


Originally posted by TheBorg
Add to that the fact that we, even now, cannot procure blocks of the caliber used in the pyramids and get them laid in the time that the Egyptians said they did, and you can begin to see the main problem with that line of thinking.

Actually, it is possible to duplicate all of those pyramids in modern times...It's just that no one wants to expend the resources & cost that it would take to do so. In short, it's possible, but not practical. Remember that Egypt was very prosperous at that time & Pharoah had to do something with all those out-of-work farmers during flood seasons.



Originally posted by phat_thef
whats intriguing is that there is no civilization in egypt and in a short period of time a hugly devoleped one emerges...

Perhaps you should read a bit about geology & how the climates change after an Ice Age...And the history of the area before you start believing in wild stories that have no basis in archeology. It was not "a short period of time"; It took hundreds of years for nomadic tribes to migrate, due to climatic pressures, to concentrate populations along the Nile. Get some "pyramid fact" under your belt before geting into pyramid theory.


Originally posted by wild_cat
So yes the wheel WAS invented when the great pyramid was constructed.

But wheels sink when you use them on sand...

The Egyptians would be more likely to use sledges or rollers (if not logs, as Hatre noted, perhaps carved from stone) under the stone to move them around. Another possibility would be to use water to make mud to slide them around too. Very inventive people, they were...



Originally posted by TheBorg
We just need to find out when Moses was chased across the Red Sea by the Egyptians.


Originally posted by 1spookychick
This is my simple but humble theory about the pyramids of Egypt: The Jews built the pyramids while in slavery to Egypt. That is what they were doing when Moses walked up and said "Let my people go".

Even this isn't known for certain; it's not easy to tie in events such as the Exodus with known Egyptian history. However, the best indications seem to point to Ramses II as Pharoah at the time of Exodus. If so, then the pyramids were around long before Moses & Ramses. There's the Armana letters (unearthed by archeologists in the 1880's), written by various princes to the Pharoah...One of them states:
"The king's whole land, which has begun holstilities with me, will be lost. Behold the territory of Seir as far as Carmel: It's princes are wholly lost...Now the Habiri are occupying the king's cities...Let the king take care of his land...And send troops...If no troops come in the year, the whole territory of my lord the king will perish."
(Emphasis in bold is mine; I have no real external source to quote)

If it was the Hebrews mentioned above, then the Hebrew conquest would have been during the reign of Amenhotep IV, about 1380-1360 BC. By the Bible's account, Exodus was about 40 years before this (about 1420 BC or so).
If you know about that particular time period in Egypt, Amenhotep is the Pharoah was the "heretic Pharoah", who proclaimed that there was only one god, Aten & changed his own name to Akhenaton!
A few points to consider: coincidence, or did Akhenaton influence Moses? Or vice versa? The Egyptian court was crawling with foreigners & foreign ideas around that time, so maybe Nefertiti herself?...


Originally posted by TheBorg
It's been said that the Great Pyramid took some 20 years to make, and that there were around 100,000 slaves working on it.

This was what Solon the Priest told to a visiting Greek, a few hundred years after all three major pyramids were built...Even during the time of Ramses II (Middle Kingdom, 18th Dynasty), the Pyramids at Giza were an awe-inspiring wonder & a source of national pride. Besides, after such a long time, what would you tell the tourists?
I've already given my accounting about the amount of resources & manpower available at the time.


Originally posted by OuterSpaceMasterFor instance, a geologist says the Sphinx was made in 7,000bc or before, yet nobody will accept that because of the history current day man has laid out...

Actually, since he based his theory on the erosion of the Sphynx, he did have enough background in geology to formulate his theory. However, he had no background in Egyptology & never considered other evidence that had been found by Egyptologists. That would be like a civilian Security Guard trying to jump into being a fully certified Police Detective job when he had no training in the skills needed for observation of evidence & deduction for probable cause.
I'm a person who has taken Egypt as a personal hobby, so I've collected a number of books that approach Egypt from numerous directions...From "new age pyramidology" to actual scholarship. I've studied various aspects of life in ancient Egypt, from religion , eschatology & theolgy, to their sciences & technologies, from daliy lifestyles & forms of entertainments. Byrd is a long-standing member at ATS & I've yet to be able to find much evidence that would contradict what I've seen her research.
Personally, I find "The Spaceships of Ezekial" to be handled with more scholarship skill than "Chariots of the Gods".



Originally posted by TheBorg
If the calculations on the numbers of blocks is correct, that would mean that there would have to have been a block laid every two minutes for the entire time that the pyramid was under construction. If that's so, how could they have quarried all of the rock, cut it so finely that a piece of paper can't even fit in between them, and placed them, all within the very limited time constraints that they had?

Even using such calculations (and there's no proof that these caluculations are correct), it wouldn't be hard to imagine that there were teams of workers & barges constantly streaming from quarry to pyramid-site. It may have taken some time to get a constant stream of stones quarried & cut for fitting, but once the flow got going, it could be maintained constantly. You know...The ol' assembly line method.
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