Gospel of Judas

en.wikipedia.org...



Basically, they just publically released the Gospel of Judas and have it all translated. It's been known about for ~30 years.
Many people argue it's like the Gospel of Thomas and can't of been written by the alleged author, etc, etc, but right now the real question isn't about those type of authenticities but rather if it was fabricated by someone.

The difference? The original Gospel of Thomas was written around ~250 years after the death of Jesus, therefore cannot be true.

Right now they know that the papers they have of the Gospel of Judas aren't the original writings because they date back 110-300 AD, and are written in greek.

If it is real, the gospel says that Judas was simply told by Jesus to betray him.

My take on it: It's a very beautiful situation, whereas Judas, to obey Jesus, had to betray him. So obeying Jesus was to betray him, total opposites, it's just so beautiful.

What're your takes on its authenticity/content/etc.

More Sites:

www.earlychristianwritings.com...
www.usatoday.com...
www.nationalgeographic.com...


Edit:

Here's the actual content of the gospel: www.graveworm.com...

[edit on 11-4-2006 by Vinci]

I'm not in a position to say whether it's real or not... but it seems a shame for people to automatically dismiss it just because it doesn't go with what is traditionally taught. That, in itself, is a horrible reason not to at least consider it.

I highly agree.

I'm a Christian and don't find it heretical(fake word?) at all, but rather a lot more "ahh" because it would explain a lot of unfufilled prophecies, and a lot of the dialects Jesus has with his disciples.

Edit:

The only "What the fish" section of the gospel in my eyes:

(7) Then Simon Peter spoke to them, "Let Mary leave us, for women are not worthy of life."

And Jesus replied, "I myself shall lead her in order to make her like Adam, so that she, too, may become a living spirit resembling Adam. For every woman who will make herself like Adam will enter the Kingdom of Heaven."

Sounds a lot more like some incorrect interpretation of the Qua'ran.



[edit on 11-4-2006 by Vinci]

There was already a thread abot this...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

but it was locked and moved here...
www.belowtopsecret.com...

...of course a thread like this perhaps deserves to be here and not in below top secret, as this topic in itself is conspiracy it nature. Not the fact that the book exist, but the fact that Christians have only had access to one aspect of Christianity for so long. (So in short, someone in Below Top Secret should move the original thread back here to post under.)

Gods Peace

dalen

Beautiful how so? The thing is, this book has the potential to disprove one of the biggest betrayals in history. That's right to disprove. Like you said to obey, Judas had to kill Jesus. However this does not mean that Judas betrayed Jesus, the definiton of betray that would be used in this situation would be "To deliver into the hands of an enemy in violation of a trust or allegiance" or "To be false or disloyal to." [Dictionary.com]

The unfortunate thing about this is, is the fact that this was a lose-lose situation for Judas. If Judas disobeyed Jesus, he would be thought of as a traitor, a man who disobeyed Jesus, a true betrayal in which a disciple betrays his master. However, if Judas obeyed, he would also be thought of as a traitor. A disciple to kill their master would be and is a great betrayal. So why didn't Judas ask Jesus for an alternative choice? Maybe perhaps it was because of this "You will exceed all of them. For you will sacrifice the man that clothes me." The Gospel states that Jesus said this to Judas, possibly meaning that Jesus wanted Judas to liberate his spirtual self by aiding him in his death. Obviously by doing so, Judas was looked upon as a traitor. Even though the other Gospels state that Judas did it because of money and the workings of satan, If the Judas Gospel is true, this all could have been a misunderstanding.

It is like looking at a wall from a different point of view, one side is red, the other is blue. It all depends on your point of view. The other Gospels aren't lies, merely a different perspective on what happened. If this Gospel turns out to be the real deal, it will be quite interesting hearing the story from Judas himself on how he merely helped his master and not betray him. Not only that, but this would be a giant impact on the Christian faith (as this is the basis for what is to come in the bible). Things in the world of Christianity might get a bit more interesting in a couple of months.

On a last note, it seems like Judas knew idea of betrayal would come into existance. The Gospel states that Jesus said to Judas "You will be cursed by other generations – and you will come to rule over them." Perhaps this adds to more reason why the Gospel was written and its possible authenicity.

And with that here is my final note

i64.photobucket.com...

[edit on 4/11/2006 by igigfufu]

Beautiful in the poetic sense;

Like: From creation comes destruction, from destruction creation.

To obey Jesus was to betray him, the beauty of it is that it goes beyond your dictionary.com definition. Maybe someone more artistic could understand my point.

Originally posted by Vinci
Beautiful in the poetic sense;

Like: From creation comes destruction, from destruction creation.

To obey Jesus was to betray him, the beauty of it is that it goes beyond your dictionary.com definition. Maybe someone more artistic could understand my point.

But he didn't betray Jesus in the eyes of Jesus. From the eyes of Jesus, this was merely an act of obiedience. From the eyes of the disciples, it was a betrayal. As I said in my earlier post it was a lose-lose situation either way for Judas. However, even though in the eyes of the people he would be a traitor no matter what, in the eyes of Jesus he would be a respectable man that followed his master to death.

Perhaps this is the bueaty you are trying to bring attention to.

[edit on 4/11/2006 by igigfufu]

You're over-complicating the definition of words, they're merely representations of emotions, and emotions cannot be defined and so, words are useless.

And so, the act of what Judas did was still a betrayal of Jesus, A government-hired-mercenary might blow up a building because he's fighting for peace, but never the less it's still an act of terrorism. Even if the definition of terrorism may vary.

Also, since you're being so anal over everything, dictionary.com is only one source of definitions, there remains Oxford and etc. It's a petty crime in the poetic world to use official definitions, and so I ask you make them not pertain to my metaphors.

As i understand it, it was a gnostic document. gnostic christians had a different view than orthodox christians. the gnostics beleived the physical world was corrupt, and they also beleived in different gods and above them a real god. most gnostics were declared heretics and there works hidden and detroyed. it appears this book is a gnostic writing, brought from judea and translated from greek to coptic.

Poetry? You can't just throw in oxymorons and call them poetic because of the situation. The bible itself seems a bit to bloody to be considered a poem all togather. The thing is, this was a truly tragic event for Judas more than anyone else in world.

In 180 AD the original Greek manuscript was denounced by Bishop Irenaeus of Lyon (present day france) as hearsay to mainstream Christianity. How this text got translated into Coptic around 300 AD is very interesting. It is possible it was translated by the gnostic christians (as that might explain why it was banned), however, this is currently not known. It is possible this Gospel came about like all the others, but that we do not yet know. Hopefully time will tell us the end of this tale about this gnostic document

[edit on 4/11/2006 by igigfufu]

[edit on 4/11/2006 by igigfufu]

Not the actual-...the situation is poetic not the actual...bah, I give up on you.

Give up? Did you ever believe? I'm afraid you're trying to portray something that makes no sense to me. The situation is poetic? How so? If anything it's tragic. As I've said before, it's a lose-lose situation, this isn't like Dover Beach, it's just plain sad and has created alot of hate towards the Jews, *cough* The Passion, *cough.*

[edit on 4/11/2006 by igigfufu]