Third Retired General Wants Rumsfeld Out

New York Times

The three-star Marine Corps general who was the military's top operations officer before the invasion of Iraq expressed regret, in an essay published Sunday, that he did not more energetically question those who had ordered the nation to war. He also urged active-duty officers to speak out now if they had doubts about the war.

Lt. Gen. Gregory Newbold, who retired in late 2002, also called for replacing Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld and "many others unwilling to fundamentally change their approach." He is the third retired senior officer in recent weeks to demand that Mr. Rumsfeld step down.

The decision to invade Iraq, he wrote, "was done with a casualness and swagger that are the special province of those who have never had to execute these missions — or bury the results."

Looks like US Armed Forces Generals wants Rumsfeld OUT.

We Need More Generals Like That.

I wonder how many of them have to speak out and raise their voice until something really changes.

[edit on 10/4/06 by Souljah]

Originally posted by Souljah
Looks like US Armed Forces Generals wants Rumsfeld OUT.

We Need More Generals Like That.

I wonder how many of them have to speak out and raise their voice until something really changes.

First up: "we"? What do you mean by that Slovenian?

Secondly: Who is this guy? Maybe he was forced into retirement because he was a terrible general.

As usual Souljah, more of your singular agenda driven anti USA drivel. Try another topic someday...

Yes, I would like to know who this tin-star-general actually is, becuase he should lose his retirement. Perhaps even be brought up on treason in a time of WAR. We need more "pattons" and fewer politicians in the pentagon..............

[edit on 10-4-2006 by thermopolis]

Originally posted by thermopolis
Yes, I would like to know who this tin-start-general actually is, becuase he should lose his retirement. Perhaps even be brought up on treason in a time of WAR. We need more "pattons" and fewer politicians in the pentagon..............

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of Patton, but you do know that he was forced to resign because he stepped into political matters?

I wonder what he would have thought about debaathification.... If he were alive today chances are he'd be getting the boot from Rusmfeld like he got from Eisenhower.

And... wouldn't getting rid of Rumsfeld be one fewer politician in the Pentagon?

Don't really think he is a tin-star general, he was promoted by Bush himself.

Here is his bio:

www.usmc.mil...

Originally posted by koji_K

And... wouldn't getting rid of Rumsfeld be one fewer politician in the Pentagon?

Rummy is disliked among the DoD revolving door bunch becuase he keeps killing "pet" projects that various general staff have promised their defense contractor "pimps" so they have a 'cush" job after retirement. Same problem for certian members of congress.

Originally posted by thermopolis
Rummy is disliked among the DoD revolving door bunch becuase he keeps killing "pet" projects that various general staff have promised their defense contractor "pimps" so they have a 'cush" job after retirement. Same problem for certian members of congress.

But you could never accuse Rumsfeld of having his own pet projects now could we. As for "pimps" and "ho's", I feel the need to mention, but not get into detail the money that's flowing in to Haliburton from the federal govt. for this war.

Originally posted by skippytjc
First up: "we"? What do you mean by that Slovenian?

I speak as a CITIZEN of PLANET EARTH.

You have a problem with that, American?

Secondly: Who is this guy? Maybe he was forced into retirement because he was a terrible general.

He is a 3 Star Marine General - Are You?

I think he would just LOVE to tell you some stories about Bush administration.

And I think he could tell you War Stories from 'Nam also.

General Newbold served as director of operations of the Joint Chiefs of Staff from 2000 through the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks and the war in Afghanistan. He left military service in late 2002, as the Defense Department was deep into planning for the March 2003 invasion of Iraq.

"I retired from the military four months before the invasion, in part because of my opposition to those who had used 9/11's tragedy to hijack our security policy," General Newbold wrote.

His generation of officers thought it had learned from Vietnam that "we must never again stand by quietly while those ignorant of and casual about war lead us into another one and then mismanage the conduct of it," General Newbold wrote.

Try another topic someday...

When Hell Freezes Over...

Woh Skippy you ought to get those venom sacs milked once in a while. You can get real cranky when they back up. Should we all attempt to locate everyone on a map before we reply?

I don't care if this general was drummed out or not, there is a concept in law called a preponderance of evidence and Rumfeld is guilty as sin. If the evidence isn't enough for then so be it but i think Souljah has a very good case and a right to make it.

[edit on 10-4-2006 by polanksi]

USA Today

Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and his top military leader on Tuesday issued their strongest rebuttal to date of recent comments by retired generals criticizing Iraq war planning and calling on Rumsfeld to resign.

In particular, Rumsfeld said he didn't recall retired Lt. Gen. Gregory Newbold raising any objections to the war planning when he was working in the Pentagon for the Joint Chiefs of Staff.

"He never raised an issue publicly or privately when he was here that I know of," said Rumsfeld. "An awful lot of people around here were not shy about giving their views. ... But in terms of why he would come up with this now, I just can't speak to that."

Well, what Else did we expect.

And here comes yet Another General:

New Military Offensive Against Rumsfeld

The latest demand for Rumsfeld's resignation came Wednesday when Maj. Gen. John Batiste, who commanded the First Infantry Division in Iraq, called for a "fresh start in the Pentagon."

"We need a leader who understands teamwork, a leader who knows to build teams, a leader that does it without intimidation," Batiste told a CNN interviewer.

Batiste's remarks, which follow highly public demands from three other top generals for Rumsfeld's resignation over the past several weeks, came as public confidence in the policies of the administration of President George W. Bush both in Iraq and in the more general "war on terror" has dwindled to all-time lows.

Retired US Iraq general demands Rumsfeld resign



A recently retired two-star general who just a year ago commanded a U.S. Army division in Iraq on Wednesday joined a small but growing list of former senior officers to call on Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld to resign.

In recent weeks, retired Marine Corps Lt. Gen. Gregory Newbold, Army Maj. Gen. Paul Eaton and Marine Corps Gen. Anthony Zinni all spoke out against Rumsfeld. This comes as opinion polls show eroding public support for the 3-year-old war in which about 2,360 U.S. troops have died.

"Screw these Generals - Let's Invade Iran!"

One More:
Colin Powell Criticizes Rumsfeld on Iraq

[edit on 13/4/06 by Souljah]

It should be noted that Rumsfeld was never very popular among most military people. He has been pushing transformation on all the services, something they have flat out rejected, but also something that observers have noted has been needed in the US Military since the end of the cold war.

While Iraq is the pretext used by generals to attack Rumsfeld, and I think there is some merit in the basis of those specific attacks, there is no shortage of generals that want Rumsfeld out, and much prefer weaker Sec. of Defense people who the military can tell what to do, instead of people like Rumsfeld who do it the other way.

I'm not really advocating one side or the other, but keep in mind, Rumsfeld is who pushed for items like the Stryker, while the army has been pushing for Future Combat Systems (FCS), which while neat on paper, has only produced a single vehicle used by the US Army to date.... the Urban Combat Skateboard.



www.defensetech.org...

I bet it costs too much.

Rumsfeld won't resign, at least not under heavy pressure. It is clear transformation won't get as far as he would like, but at least he gave it a good try. Hopefully the next Sec of Defense can try harder, and get the serviecs to recognize the cold war is over.

sorry already covered

[edit on 14/4/2006 by Sauron]

I predict Rummy is going to get the boot


[edit on 14/4/2006 by Sauron]

New York Times

The widening circle of retired generals who have stepped forward to call for Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld's resignation is shaping up as an unusual outcry that could pose a significant challenge to Mr. Rumsfeld's leadership, current and former generals said on Thursday.

Maj. Gen. Charles H. Swannack Jr., who led troops on the ground in Iraq as recently as 2004 as the commander of the Army's 82nd Airborne Division, on Thursday became the fifth retired senior general in recent days to call publicly for Mr. Rumsfeld's ouster. Later in the day, another retired general, Maj. Gen. John Riggs, joined in the fray.

"We need to continue to fight the global war on terror and keep it off our shores," General Swannack said in a telephone interview. "But I do not believe Secretary Rumsfeld is the right person to fight that war based on his absolute failures in managing the war against Saddam in Iraq."

Hey - the Fifth US General is calling for resignation!

Does that make the Fifth Column already?

Originally posted by polanksi
I don't care if this general was drummed out or not, there is a concept in law called a preponderance of evidence and Rumfeld is guilty as sin. If the evidence isn't enough for then so be it but i think Souljah has a very good case and a right to make it.

Wow, that was some nifty talking there concerning that "preponderance of evidence" against Rummy.

Hey, I tell you what, how about you, Souljah, those 6 ex-generals, and whomever else get together, gather up all that "preponderance of evidence's" take it before a judical court or military court and see what all that "preponderance of evidence" gets ya? Your "preponderance of evidence's" are conjectures and assertions, amounting to nothing in any legal sense. As such, that would make what you, Souljah, and these 6 generals are saying what....criticism worthy of insignificance, slight merit, or headline coverage from the likes of MSNBC, the Today Show, or CNN?

Personally, the headlines should read: More Generals retired by Rumsfeld call for his resignation.






seekerof

[edit on 14-4-2006 by Seekerof]

This kinda reminds me of the old "Admiral's Revolt" back in the late 1940's. Background: the fledgling USAF was doing a good job of convincing congress that they could single-handedly win any next major war through nothing but air dominance and atomic bomb warfare from strategic aircraft - all at a price that was way cheaper than the kinds of units the Navy was calling for.

A large number of naval officers basically "sacraficed" their careers to go public and start a big PR campaign against this strategy. It was brave, and it ultimately proved to be correct.

The big difference today is that these generals apparently lack the properly-issued military cohones to voice their displeasure and concerns while they were still in uniform and standing a watch. Kinda reminds me of the co-worker who kisses up to the boss, until he retires or get a new job and starts unloading "pearl harbor" e-mails and phone calls......it speaks volumes about the person and their motivations.....

This has been going for quite a while, more and more soldiers are becoming very vocal about their dissatisfaction with Mr.Rumsfeld.

What it surprise me the most is the growing support by Retired military high ranking personnel that are also voicing their dislike of Mr. Rumsfeld.

Why retired?

Because so far any high ranking military that has been vocal against the way thing are run when it comes with Iraq has resign.

[edit on 14-4-2006 by marg6043]

Hey, I tell you what, how about you, Souljah, those 6 ex-generals, and whomever else get together, gather up all that "preponderance of evidence's" take it before a judical court or military court and see what all that "preponderance of evidence" gets ya? Your "preponderance of evidence's" are conjectures and assertions, amounting to nothing in any legal sense. As such, that would make what you, Souljah, and these 6 generals are saying what....criticism worthy of insignificance, slight merit, or headline coverage from the likes of MSNBC, the Today Show, or CNN?

Wow Seekerof, that's called impeachment, you know, and we all been there under VERY similar circumstances, so be careful what you wish for.

It's really time for you to pull the rip cord, cause that whole Nixon impeachment reality is coming up (again) real fast. You know, you have all those ATS points, you'll have re-register, all that stuff, why not get it over with now and skip all the hassle? Just my two cents.

I speak as a CITIZEN of PLANET EARTH.

You have a problem with that, American?

I do, unless your an american keep the royal "we" out of it....since you obviously detest us in the first place.

Zinni has never been a proponent of Bush and I find this interesting that the retirees are in fact not being misquoted to a large degree. Rumsfeld obviously stepped on the wrong four star d%#k. The decoder rings are singing in tune.

Originally posted by iskander
Wow Seekerof, that's called impeachment, you know, and we all been there under VERY similar circumstances, so be careful what you wish for.

Apparently, you need to re-read what I said, because when you do, I think you will find that my reference was concerning Rumsfeld and not Bush.
Your wetting yourself for nothing in this applied case and topic.

It's really time for you to pull the rip cord, cause that whole Nixon impeachment reality is coming up (again) real fast. You know, you have all those ATS points, you'll have re-register, all that stuff, why not get it over with now and skip all the hassle? Just my two cents.

Your in fantasyland or maybe you saw a shooting star and made a wish?
Wishful thinking is so unbecoming of one such as you.
Your other commentary is simply insignificant, especially coming from you.
Just my two cents....






seekerof