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another terrorist group! see what PKK is

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posted on Apr, 8 2006 @ 03:44 PM
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Please pay some attention and use your time to see the real face of PKK (bloody terroist organization). Some tries to present them as freedom guarillas, but Kurds has never had a homeland (like gypsies) so it is very nonsense to fight for freedom or for a NEVERLAND HOMELAND! Here is some info about PKK and some pictures show how they are cruel.
ANATOLIA BELONGS TO TURKS AND TURKISH REPUBLIC AND CAN NOT BE SEPERATED!



• What is the Kurdistan Workers’ Party?
A Marxist separatist group that until recently sought to create an independent Kurdish state in southeastern Turkey and parts of neighboring countries inhabited by Kurds. (It’s known as the PKK after its Kurdish name, Partiya Karkeren Kurdistan.) During a rebellion that began in the mid-1980s and claimed some 35,000 lives, the group used guerrilla warfare and terrorism, including kidnappings of foreign tourists in Turkey, suicide bombings, and attacks on Turkish diplomatic offices in Europe. The PKK has also repeatedly attacked civilians who refuse to assist it.
A crushing Turkish military crackdown and the February 1999 capture of the PKK’s leader, Abdullah Ocalan, have led the group’s 5,000 fighters to withdraw to northernIraq and its leadership to renounce armed struggle and reconstitute itself as a political party. But the Turkish government, which does not recognize its Kurdish minority as distinct from other Turks, continues to regard the PKK as a terrorist group. The United States—one of Turkey’s NATO allies—lists the PKK as a foreign terrorist organization.
They got their Money to fight from drug trade. Most of the drug traffic from middle east and Afganistan to Europe and America is managed by PKK. They kill not only Turkish people but also western children.
What kinds of attacks has the PKK undertaken?
For more photos and info please visit
www.pkkgercegi.net


Mod Edit: No Quote/Plagiarism – Please Review This Link.


[edit on 8/4/2006 by Umbrax]




posted on Apr, 8 2006 @ 03:57 PM
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photos can be irritating

[ Mod edit - image removal]



Terms And Conditions Of Use

1a) Offensive Content: You will not post links to images or use avatars and signatures that are offensive, abusive, distruptive and/or hateful. You will not use images, avatars or link to domains that contain gore, mutilation,pornography or illegal content.


[edit on 8/4/2006 by Umbrax]



posted on Apr, 8 2006 @ 08:06 PM
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Please stop the propaganda. The Kurds are a separate people and they deserve their own land.

Turkey has to do a lot of steps to reach western nations in many fronts:

1) you should remove white cells from prisons.
2) you should stop the occupation of Cyprus.
3) you should stop threatening Greece at every chance.
4) you should stop stoning-to-death young innocent girls.
5) you should stop the military from sizing control at each opportunity.
6) you should recognize the Armenian slaughtering.

I am not saying that Turkey should be split, but Kurds deserve their own country. It is not up to me to say where.



posted on Apr, 8 2006 @ 08:19 PM
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The Kurds are not even united and are divided along many boundaries. Plus, there a thousands of other ethnicities that do not have a homeland. Why should they be granted a homeland?


1) you should remove white cells from prisons.
2) you should stop the occupation of Cyprus.
3) you should stop threatening Greece at every chance.
4) you should stop stoning-to-death young innocent girls.
5) you should stop the military from sizing control at each opportunity.
6) you should recognize the Armenian slaughtering.


1. What are white cells?
2. Much of Cyprus is Turkish first. Second, I can name a few other Western countries who occupy other places.
3. Greece is threatening Turkey too. C'mon, this isn't one-sided. There is a territorial dispute between both countries.
4. The Turkish government is not stoning young girls.
5. The last time the government seized control was back in 1980. But, generally I agree the military has too much power even today.
6. I agree. Yet, again, people blow the extense of this out of proportion. Plus, this occurred under the Ottoman empire, not the Turkish Republic.

All in all, I do not see what your criticisms of Turkey have to do with the PKK using terror to meet their goals. As well, most of the Western countries that you are trying compare to Turkey have their own problems no less serious than these.

Back to what the thread is really about...terrorism. I agree that the PKK are terrorists. They even terrorize other Kurds in Turkey to meet their goals. I don't think many people doubt that they are a terrorist group.

[edit on 8-4-2006 by Jamuhn]



posted on Apr, 9 2006 @ 12:26 PM
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you get some misinformation about Turkey! Have you ever been to Turkey?
we want 2 equal communities in Cyprus. and dont forget in 1919 Greece tried to occupy Turkish Land. we had a great victory over them and never mention it.
Kurds dont deserve any home land if so why dont your country give them some land to settle a country? Why should we? They are Just baby killers, if you support terrorists one day they will shoot you. and believe me in the future they are going to be a problem for rest of the world, if we cant stop those baby killers.



posted on Apr, 9 2006 @ 02:30 PM
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Originally posted by turkish_boydont forget in 1919 Greece tried to occupy Turkish Land.


Good point! I believe the English, Australians, Italians, French, and Russians also tried splitting up Turkey at this time as well. Good thing Turkey didn't succumb to the same European colonial aspirations that much of the rest of the Middle East fell too at this time.

[edit on 9-4-2006 by Jamuhn]



posted on Apr, 9 2006 @ 03:05 PM
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The PKK has been around in one form or another for at least 30 years to my memory - most likely much longer. I have heard them called everything from freedom fighters to "the eaters of children" - one thing's for sure they belive in their cause.
Too bad - file it under - history: Eastern, sub catagory: screwed-up. Ain't nothin' gonna change in Turkey anytime soon 'cept maybe some good-old-fashioned killin'. It must suck to be a Kurd in Turkey - kinda like an American contractor at an unorganized BBQ in Iraq.
If my life depended on a PKK fighter vs any Turk squad - I'd take my chances with the single Kurd. These folks are warrior-class believers with optimal survival skils and always do "more" with "less".
Sounds like Turkey is becoming paranoid - who could blame them? 'Like an Anglo at a Aztlan march?.



posted on Apr, 10 2006 @ 10:34 AM
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kaminski;
I dont know where you are from. please answer this question; If there is a terrorist group (they may call themselves "freedom figthers) in your country and if they want some part of your country which you gained with your blood, and if they kill your children,your civilians and your soldiers, do you feel same ?if yes; may God give you a bigger terrorist group to do same thing in my country.



posted on Apr, 10 2006 @ 12:22 PM
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Thank god Turkey doesn't become member of the European Union. Almost every signle member state fortunately doesn't want them to become.

You call kurds terrorists? Ever looked in the mirror?

Holocaust

Still denying the holocaust of the Kurds and Armenians? I have an Armenian friend, she has to flee because of the violence against her people.

No Freedom of the press

Orhan Pamuk


He is being tried for telling a Swiss newspaper in February that "30,000 Kurds and one million Armenians were killed in these lands, and nobody but me dares talk about it".

news.bbc.co.uk...

No respect for human rights


Recent Turkish history has been dominated by the Turkish state's failed experiment in maintaining security through repression. Successive governments have made some progress towards establishing parliamentary democracy and fundamental freedoms, but national security -- internal as well as external -- has consistently been left to the discretion of the security forces. They have treated international human rights standards and Turkish law with equal disdain.

As a result, the human rights picture in Turkey is bleak. Torture or ill-treatment have long been routinely inflicted on people detained for common criminal offences as well as on political charges. "Disappearance" and extrajudicial execution are new patterns of violation which appeared in the early 1990s and have since claimed hundreds of lives. Turkish citizens do not enjoy true freedom of expression. During the past six years scores of prisoners of conscience have served terms of imprisonment for expressing their non-violent opinions. Hundreds more, including writers and artists, are being tried in State Security Courts and threatened with imprisonment because they dared to express their political views.


www.derechos.org...

I know the US neither respects human rights, but now we're talking about Turkey. In my opinion it's wrong to call Kurds terrorists, then I assume you see Jews as terrorists as well? As long as the situation in Turkey doesn't change they'll never become part of the European Union.

Don't get me wrong I am not against Turkey or the Turkish people, but as long as the situation is like this you don't have the right to call other people terrorists, Even though I condemn the Kurdish terrorist attacks.




Mod Edit: External Source Tags – Please Review This Link.


[edit on 10/4/2006 by Umbrax]



posted on Apr, 10 2006 @ 12:53 PM
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Turkey definitely needs to integrate Kurds and Kurdish culture into their national identity. By denying it, they are helping to create ill-will among the Kurds. But, this is like most countries, even those in the EU. Countries like Turkey and America do not readily admit they are wrong or try to fix what they are doing to promote terrorism. Instead, they show their arrogance by doing what they are, and even increasing it, to show they are not afraid of terrorists. It's a sad state.

Mdv, how can you compare Jews to Kurds? Or is the word "Jew" supposed to be the magical keyword that makes us all servile?

This thread stipulates that PKK are terrorists, not Kurds. There is a bid difference in nomenclature here.

As well, the Armenian issue during the Ottoman Empire was not a Holocaust. Once again, trying to equate Armenians to the Jewish struggle won't gain any sympathy points. What happened with the Armenians (during the Ottoman Empire, not under the guidance of the new Turkish Republic) was probably genocide, which involved much more relocation than actual killing, even though many were killed. This also denies many of the circumstances surrounding that event. Armenians were revolting against the Ottomans under Russian insistance and thus Turks responded as they did. While this event doesn't grant the Ottomans a free pass, it does put the event in perspective. The Turks need to accept their past though and reveal what everyone already knows, that their was an Armenian genocide.

As well, your tags of "No Freedom of the press" and "No respect for human rights" are highly misleading and exaggerated. In comparison to many countries, Turkey is very liberal on these fronts. But, in general, they really need to become more progressive. That is why the EU will probably be a good thing for Turkey, in that it will force them to become more progressive. And they have become more progressive as a result of EU negotiations.

Also, you'll find that the charges against Orhan Pamuk were dropped...

In 2005, lawyers of two Turkish professional associations brought criminal charges against Pamuk [1] after the author made a statement regarding the Armenian Genocide of 1915-1917 and the massacre of 30,000 Kurds in Anatolia. The charges were dropped on 22 January 2006.

en.wikipedia.org...

What's funny is that this taboo against speaking about the Armenian genocide is essentially the reverse of the taboo in many Western nations of questioning the Holocaust.

Also, your statement:

I have an Armenian friend, she has to flee because of the violence against her people.

How so?

[edit on 10-4-2006 by Jamuhn]



posted on Apr, 10 2006 @ 01:48 PM
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hey mdv2
how old is your girlfriend?
and why dont you get a rifle and join Kurdish Terrorists? and see what would happen to you.
dont indicate orhan pamuk he is seeking just fame that he couldnt find in Turkiye.
and where are you from? western countries should do their own laundry first. you are talking about human rights. what is the meaning of human rights for western countries. let me tell you ; if there is oil,gold mines or other mines in a country, there is no wrong to put human rights in a shelf. examples? Iraq, most of the African countries, South american natives, north american natives, india and many others.



posted on Apr, 10 2006 @ 02:33 PM
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Considering that the Kurds are of value to the US, and that the Turks snubbed the US in the iraq war, you can expect, perhaps not the PKK but other Kurd groups to have a better hand in things for the future. Maybe the turks should've helped the US, and then they'd have a backer against the PKK.
As it is, they might be facing an independant Kurdish Republic just across their border before long, one that might fund the PKK with kirkukian oil, and with the US too worried about stabilizing iraq to do anything about it.


Jamuhn
Good thing Turkey didn't succumb to the same European colonial aspirations that much of the rest of the Middle East fell too a
[
You mean back when they defeated the turkish empire and took away all its colonial imperial holdings?



Mdv2
Almost every signle member state fortunately doesn't want them to become.

Thats hardly true, there isa good movement to have Turkey included in the EU, this wouldn't exist if nearly everyone was against it. The Turks have a bloody, imperialist, rapacious, and violent history.
They will fit in nicely.



posted on Apr, 10 2006 @ 05:07 PM
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Originally posted by Jamuhn
The Kurds are not even united and are divided along many boundaries. Plus, there a thousands of other ethnicities that do not have a homeland. Why should they be granted a homeland?


Of course they should. Everyone is entitled to have a country.



1. What are white cells?


Prisons with white cells are prohibited by international law. Being imprisoned in a white cell can make one mad.



2. Much of Cyprus is Turkish first.


No. Long before Turkmenides came from the east, Cyprus was occupied by Hellenistic tribes.



Second, I can name a few other Western countries who occupy other places.


That is no excuse.



3. Greece is threatening Turkey too.


No, Greece does not threaten Turkey. Every day Turkish fighters invade Greek borders; and lots of them. Last week Turkish fighters threatened a civilian aircraft.

Turkey has a population of 67,000,000 million people. Greece is only 11,000,000 million. I see no threat over Turkey.



C'mon, this isn't one-sided. There is a territorial dispute between both countries.


No, there is no territorial dispute. International agreements have set all disputes between Greece and Turkey. It is Turkey that does not accept that Greece can have a 12 mile subsea floor strip, just like any other country.



4. The Turkish government is not stoning young girls.


Its citizens do, though. Culturally Turkey (the east side of it) is much far back from Europe.



5. The last time the government seized control was back in 1980. But, generally I agree the military has too much power even today.


In Turkey, the Chief Of Military Operations has higher authority than that of Chief of State.

All decisions must be signed by military commanders.



6. I agree. Yet, again, people blow the extense of this out of proportion. Plus, this occurred under the Ottoman empire, not the Turkish Republic.


Small difference. The Armenian slaughtering happened in the start of the 20th century, a few years before the Turkish republic was born.

Kemal Attaturk was half greek, do not forget that. He was born in Thesalloniki.



All in all, I do not see what your criticisms of Turkey have to do with the PKK using terror to meet their goals.


It is simple: PKK is no more terrorist than, let's say, IRA.



As well, most of the Western countries that you are trying compare to Turkey have their own problems no less serious than these.


Not really.



Back to what the thread is really about...terrorism. I agree that the PKK are terrorists. They even terrorize other Kurds in Turkey to meet their goals. I don't think many people doubt that they are a terrorist group.


The real damage from Bush's quote "you are with us or with the others" is that it painted the world black'n'white: either you are with us, or you are a terrorist. Anyone fighting a war of liberation is labelled a terrorist!



we want 2 equal communities in Cyprus.


You have brainwashed to believe that in Cyprus the Turkish community was equal to the Greek one. Let me tell you something: it was not. Cyprus had a few thousand Turks, and a few HUNDRED thousand Greeks, which were living in harmony BEFORE TURKISH INVASION. Turkey invaded Cyrpus in order to play the big bad wolf in the area. After that, they kept sending people from main land by the thousands.

Right now the occupied houses of Greek Cypriots are being sold to the British. Actually, it is not your fault...we all know the good ol' Brits and the role they played...



and dont forget in 1919 Greece tried to occupy Turkish Land. we had a great victory over them and never mention it.


Ok, let's mention it. But let's also mention that the Ottoman Empire invaded and OCCUPIED GREECE FOR almost 400 years; from 1453 to 1821!!!



Kurds dont deserve any home land if so why dont your country give them some land to settle a country? Why should we? They are Just baby killers, if you support terrorists one day they will shoot you. and believe me in the future they are going to be a problem for rest of the world, if we cant stop those baby killers.


Oh man! I just do not believe there are so immature people that say that other people do not deserve a home! get over it: we are all equal, we are all the same, and we all deserve a home!

There are lots of deserted areas in south eastern Turkey, along the border with Iraq. It is the ideal place for a Kurdish state.



posted on Apr, 11 2006 @ 09:45 AM
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can you tell me where are you from?
what is your nationality?



posted on Apr, 12 2006 @ 02:34 PM
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Originally posted by masterp
It is simple: PKK is no more terrorist than, let's say, IRA.

Right, its simple: they're terrorists.

Anyone fighting a war of liberation is labelled a terrorist!

Anyone targeting civilians is a terrorist.

there are so immature people that say that other people do not deserve a home!

What does it matter if they 'deserve' a home? The only people that deserve land are the ones that can take it and hold on to it. The Kurds can't do that, therefore, they are part of Turkey, not an independant kurdistan. ANd because they are targeting civilians in a campaign of terror, rather than fighting a war, they aren't going to get anyone to come in on their side.

It is the ideal place for a Kurdish state.

So what? Why should the government of Turkey give up that land and give it to the Kurds, especially when there are a lot of Kurdish groups rampaging around and murdering civilians (ie, engaged in terrorism)????

Also, what exactly would the Kurds use that land for anyway? Roasting Kababs? Or funding separatists within Turkey and Iraq?? What if the land isn't suitable to living on? Have the Turks now commited a crime by relocating them to, effectively, a reservation? Do the Kurds then have the right to attack the Turks, again, in order to demand money and food and equipment?


Turkish_boy
can you tell me where are you from?
what is your nationality?

What does that matter? Why do you ask that rather than address any of his points?



posted on Apr, 12 2006 @ 03:18 PM
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Turkish-boy. Listen, I'm just an ignorant, self-absorbed, well paid, well educated male WASP sittin' in a corner office 3 floors from the top of the tallest building overlooking Scarbough ON Canada with a polish net monicker and half a dozen letters after my real name - I do not wear a suit! Heh, heh. I'm one of those weird long-haired "leftys" who rides a bike to work and hires people based on how useful they are. 'Guess I'm the enemy. BTW: I'm a Libertarian/Socialist - don't ask.
Most folks with real grunt lives here in North America don't particularly care or not care about what's going on in Turkey or anywhere else that isn't in their backyard - and believe me there's plenty going on in the backyard both North and South of the 49th Parallel! Canadian Idol draws more ink.
I'm sorry if I offended you or anyone else.
So what's your goal? Empire? Ethnic cleansing? War? Eugenics? Nazism? Kill all Kurds everywhere? Expropriation? What is your final-solution-du-jour? Seems you feel that the PKK are a threat to you? Am I right?
So far I'm not sure whether I'm hearing bragging or complaining - please illucidate.



posted on Apr, 13 2006 @ 01:58 PM
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I am glad that you are weel-paid and well-educated man and you have an office.In Turkiye many (you cant imagine how many) people dont have a chance to find a job (I dont say well_paid) because of economical problems that PKK creates since Turkish government pay too much to fight these terrorists. And , especially in eastern Turkiye people dont have chance to get education because PKK militans kill the teachers to stop education over there. You are very luck. take what you have for granted.
I know nobody really cares about what is going on in my country.
What my aim is to inform people about that bloody terrorists, if you have read the other comments you can see that many people hate TURKs and think we torture kurds. I just want to take your attention.
Only solution (with peace)is this people must stop to support this terrorist group.
we dont want any ethnic cleaning or killing the kurds ( We could have done it easily after we won our independence war.) TURKs are not that kind of people.



posted on Apr, 13 2006 @ 09:11 PM
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I'd link to remind everyone in this WOT thread to keep the discussion on topic. Personal, off topic remarks belong in the u2u


Please take the time to read this thread by Springer!!
Mod Note: WOT Posting Conduct – Please Review Link.



posted on Apr, 14 2006 @ 12:05 AM
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Originally posted by turkish_boy
TURKs are not that kind of people.

www.unitedhumanrights.org...

The Turks killed MILLIONS of armenians, and slaughtered untold numbers of greeks. Clearly a mass murder of the Kurds is a possibility. Turkey has made a lot of advances since those evil days, but your statement is absurd. ALL HUMANS are capable of any human evil.

You said the Turks want peace with the Kurds. Fair enough, what has your government recently offered to the PKK to have peace for?



posted on Apr, 16 2006 @ 06:28 AM
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before to discuss please wee read the history. only about 1000 armenian died during the world war I we didnt slaughter anyone if we hd wanted we could have done it easily while Ottoman Empire was ruling the world, and nobody could stop us. but we didn't do it. Today why dont you attach Americans who are killing thousands of people in Iraq or in afganistan you cant express your objection because all you are afraid of americans or you are the dogs of BUSH. you dogs or let me say (SoB) just watching the tragedy in middle east and support that #ing terrorist group. Look at the mirror before discuss this. I hope one day terrorism will take one of your loved ones and you can understand us. (pray God they dont kill your son or daughter). because they will do it one day you cant get rid of it.



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