Iran unveils new aircraft - the 'Saeqeh'

Originally posted by shire19
Making sure an attack on their nation will recieve an costly response

Really?
You mean like Iraq did in the First Gulf War when they acquired all that tech and equipment from Russia, huh?
Remind me please, that war lasted how long again?




seekerof

[edit on 2-4-2006 by Seekerof]

Originally posted by Seekerof
And because of that, Iran, in "some ways," is a more open society that the US?

Hardly.

When asked about women's rights by a caller from Iran in a recent two-hour interview on satellite TV, he said, "Women's rights are human rights ... Under the clerics, however, the Iranian women have suffered the most by having been subject to the most humiliating social restrictions and laws".

IRAN'S CITIZENS CHALLENGES INTENTIONS OF HARD-LINE CLERICS

The son of the former shah of Iran, who has not visited Iran since 1979, may not be the most reliable source of information. Just my opinion.

Originally posted by SeekerofIn some ways, Iran is more open than the US?
Care to define "some ways"?
When you get an Iranian women to fly into space, let me know.

Although I completely agree with you that the rights of women in Iran are not upheld the way they should, even though there has been a lot of improvements since 1997, improvements spearheaded by figures such as the noble winner, Shirin Ebadi, some may argue that whilst the media of the west may at times taint the perception of women by presenting them as mere objects, the same cannot be said for Iran. An Iranian would not just look at the lady in the picture and view her as a "nun", but a professional who is good at their job. Just something to think about.



[edit on 3-4-2006 by Sep]

seekeroff

that article was from 2001 - AND as mentioned above , the interviewee is Reza Pahlavi who hasn`t been home for over 20 years.


the first Iranian astronaut:

en.wikipedia.org...

www.spacefacts.de...


and SHE will be a woman ; so not only will she be the first iranian woman in space , she will be the first iranian in space.

[edit on 3/4/06 by Harlequin]

Originally posted by Seekerof
Really?
You mean like Iraq did in the First Gulf War when they acquired all that tech and equipment from Russia, huh?
Remind me please, that war lasted how long again?

seekerof

Did I hit a nerve or something? Why take my reply out of context?
Iran's military is solely based on an defence doctrine and building up their arms effectiveness to avoid an attack is simply understandable.. Anyone else would've done it in their position..

And I'd think you'd know better than to compare Iraq to Iran, apples and oranges.

Originally posted by shire19
Btw, its normal for Muslim countries to have female pilots.. Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Iran etc

Women are small, pilots are supposed to be small, because cockpits are small. Therefore, women make good pilots. Women, goes the old wives tale, are able to withstand more pain, when it is expected, so perhaps that helps them to be good pilots also, because they can withstand the pressures and what not???

As far as Iran being an open society, thats a laugh. Its an islamic republic with a holy scripture as the basis of law. Not an open society, period. Women aren't caged to their stoves, thats not a surprise.

Iran is a rather modernized society, its not like afghanistan, where people have forgotten their last names and cities are fortified by mud-brick walls. Its modern, but not open.

An Iranian would not just look at the lady in the picture and view her as a "nun", but a professional who is good at their job.

And who had better cover up her female body or else must be some kind of immoderate whore who deserves to be stoned.

And I'd think you'd know better than to compare Iraq to Iran, apples and oranges.

Is it though? The iranians and iraqis fought each other to a standstill no? True enough, the iranian army has advanced since then, but then again, so has the US army.

[edit on 3-4-2006 by Nygdan]

Originally posted by kozmo

Originally posted by planeman

Originally posted by kozmo
Will make for very nice target practice, but little else. Hey, what's with the nun in the cockpit? Is she a pilot?

Nun? Stop the anti-muslim crap.

Anti-Muslim? What are you talking about???

I guess she must be a flying nun, eh?

stop being racist.

you REALLY need to learn about the culture before you insult the heck out of them.


stealth_spy


your only about a year behind the rest of ATS with this info

Mod edit...fixed quote

[edit on 3-4-2006 by masqua]

Originally posted by Harlequin
stop being racist.
you REALLY need to learn about the culture before you insult the heck out of them.

What? pardon me? REALLY need to learn about "culture"? before you insult "them" well pardon me for getting insulted >; >


What is this culture and who are these them that you talk about?

If she was there, dressed like that out of here own choice then I would tell her/you that what she was wearing was not suitable for combat and fighter jet flight!!!!

[edited quote code and reduced big quote, please try to use small quotes and to not use 'nested' quotes -nygdan]
Under the current Iranian Law/Regime if a woman does not wear a vail she will be lashed and imprisoned. Is this what you call "culture"?

am I "them" who is supposed to be insulted by a funny comment about a flying nun ??


Please before jumping in and telling others how to live fix yourself




[edit on 3-4-2006 by Nygdan]

Originally posted by Sep
An Iranian would not just look at the lady in the picture and view her as a "nun", but a professional who is good at their job. Just something to think about.

excuse me Seb. I am Iranian and I look at her as a nun. Wake up. it is your kind who makes assumptions about other Iranians!

He was just being funny!!! common read my previous post

[edited quote codes and reduced size of quote -nygdan]

[edit on 3-4-2006 by Nygdan]

Originally posted by Nygdan
[
Is it though? The iranians and iraqis fought each other to a standstill no? True enough, the iranian army has advanced since then, but then again, so has the US army.

Yes they did you are missing a little "minor" details though!!! here I list them here for your information:

~8 month before Iraq Attack there was a violent revolution.
Iran did not have an stable government
Army generals were executed
Iranian Army, Air force and Navy were disbanded
Most of the pilots were in jail
terrorist attacks were happening daily
some states were demanding independence
country was in kaos
Iran had lost its big brother(US) and it support (military , technology, etc)
Iran was under trade embargos
Iran was under militarty embargos
The rest of the world mostly was sided with Saddam and helping him


Cheers,

Zurvan

Originally posted by Stealth Spy
www.globalsecurity.org...
Looks to have borrowed things from the F-5

. An interesting development nevertheless.

I was just thinking the same thing, it looks like an F-5 with a twin stab tail.

[edited to reduce size of quote, try to use smaller quotes -nygdan]

[edit on 3-4-2006 by Nygdan]

Mod edit double post


[edit on 3-4-2006 by masqua]

Mod Edit double post

[edit on 3-4-2006 by masqua]

Originally posted by Nygdan
And who had better cover up her female body or else must be some kind of immoderate whore who deserves to be stoned.

Women don't get stoned in Iran if they don't wear the full-outfit Hijab. And I'd doubt the governmental system in Iran adopts that system let alone the general Iranian population..

Many westerners look at the Hijab and find it weird and wonder how women can wear it day in and day out without experiencing problems..
And this is a major issue because you won't be able to understand the Hijab and what it stands for when looking it at from an westerns perspective..
The Hijab has been part of the Islamic culture for quite some time now even though the Quran hardly talks about the Hijab or even enforces the wearing of it. The Hijab is simply an Islamic copied version of veils worn by previous religions and cultures..

Many women see it as an tradition and honour and respect themselves by wearing it, if this was not the case you would not see Islamic women wearing Hijabs in the West.

Originally posted by Nygdan
Is it though? The iranians and iraqis fought each other to a standstill no? True enough, the iranian army has advanced since then, but then again, so has the US army.

True but Iran is focusing its military on an defence doctrine though considering they haven't invaded an country for quite some centuries.. While Saddam on the other hand invaded 2 within 11 years.

Iran was not an Islamic country. It was force to become Muslim. You can debate history all you want but here is my case dont give me all this respect !#$.


A lot of Iranian do not want their women covered up. They like to be able to go travelling without having to first obtain permission of their father. Would like to go to the beach without having to wear a tent :<

How can we stop this muslims who want to enforce Hijab onto women and men?

Just like how your people 1300 years ago pillaged my country and killed thousands of men and took women and children to slavery.

How can we make your culture leave my people alone? we want to live life as we want it.


History of iran

Originally posted by shire19
Women don't get stoned in Iran if they don't wear the full-outfit Hijab.

Stoned, whipped, imprisoned, half a dozen of one, six of the other.

And I'd doubt the governmental system in Iran adopts that system let alone the general Iranian population.

The iranian government is run by the preists, called mullahs. The supreme leader of the state is a pontif, called the ayatollah, they rule over something like a congress and an elected president, who, right now, is one of the islamist student radicals that started the revolution and who's student organization kidnapped and held hostage the americans back in the day. This entire system is also over seen by an army called the Revolutionary Guard, an islamist radical group that the preistly class controls.

It is not an open society, it is not a democracy. It is a dictatorship of priests who maintain power through a brutal army. But, again, Iran is a rather modern country, its theocratic, but not really totalitarian, as I understand it.

Many westerners look at the Hijab and find it weird and wonder how women can wear it day in and day out without experiencing problems..
And this is a major issue because you won't be able to understand the Hijab and what it stands for when looking it at from an westerns perspective..

The 'hijab' was originally a word for 'modestlty', a person who 'wears the hijab' is dressing modestly. Only evil sluts don't cover themselves, or something. *shrugs*

The Hijab is simply an Islamic copied version of veils worn by previous religions and cultures..

Yes. You can find things similar to it amoung european women in the dark ages.

Many women see it as an tradition and honour and respect themselves by wearing it,

Brainwashed dolts, imnsho.

if this was not the case you would not see Islamic women wearing Hijabs in the West.

We also see women who have their labia and clitoris cut away because of their culture. What of it?

True but Iran is focusing its military on an defence doctrine though considering they haven't invaded an country for quite some centuries.

On the other hand the country is run by a religious cult that beleives that the devil is at work in the world and must be destroyed, and that the US is officially the devil.

While Saddam on the other hand invaded 2 within 11 years.

All dictatorships in the middle east will be invaded and/or pressured to reform democractically during this re-organization of the region. The borders that exist now are the product of in part ottoman rule of the region and arbitrary british-european divisions in the post-colonial era. That previous organization of the region is now being undone and a new organizational basis is being substituted.

I read about this horrific country called England whos ruler is also a religious leader with millions of followers worldwide. She is married to the admiral of the fleet, ie leader of the Navy and her son is the Colonel in Chief of the Army! Its very easy to make a country sound like a fascist theocracy if you want to.

Although Iran may not have equivalent human rights of countries in the west, it is largely misunderstood and many people make assumptions based on inaccuracies.

Now can we please get back to topic??!!

-George

Originally posted by Nygdan
The iranian government is run by the preists, called mullahs. The supreme leader of the state is a pontif, called the ayatollah, they rule over something like a congress and an elected president, who, right now, is one of the islamist student radicals that started the revolution and who's student organization kidnapped and held hostage the americans back in the day. This entire system is also over seen by an army called the Revolutionary Guard, an islamist radical group that the preistly class controls.

There is no proof that it was the President in that hostage situation infact I remember the CIA mentioning it was not him I think.

The Basij militia is used to "over-see" the country and not the IRGC, and the IRGC a radical group? Thats new to me.

Originally posted by Nygdan
It is not an open society, it is not a democracy. It is a dictatorship of priests who maintain power through a brutal army. But, again, Iran is a rather modern country, its theocratic, but not really totalitarian, as I understand it.

Nonetheless it's their country and their system. The mullahs are bad news imo but if the Iranians wanted a regime change or a different system they would take care of it themselves, afterall they've done it once before.
So that makes me led to believe that either the majority of the Iranians accept this or the current crosshairs on Iran is pushing the public more towards the Mullahs to form an united front.. For the sake of their country.

Originally posted by Nygdan
The 'hijab' was originally a word for 'modestlty', a person who 'wears the hijab' is dressing modestly. Only evil sluts don't cover themselves, or something. *shrugs*
Yes. You can find things similar to it amoung european women in the dark ages.
Brainwashed dolts, imnsho.
We also see women who have their labia and clitoris cut away because of their culture. What of it?

Evil sluts or something? Brainwashed? You believe thats the reason why the Muslim women wear the Hijab? If so then I'll just leave the Hijab subject at that, if you wanna learn more about it, its up to you.

The more I read about Iran and it's ambitions the more I support them, I don't believe they are a threat to any other country BESIDES the parasite nation of ISRAEL.

i'd fully support that country becoming a smoking crater since they are screwing up the US with forcing them into wars.

Before you brand me an anti-semite, forget it, i'm not, i'm anti-israel.

The way I see Iran's stance is like this:

Imagine a home, with some violent neighbors around you that contantly fight with each other, wouldn't want a gun to protect your self? that's essentially what their nuclear ambition is.

Don't think I support terrorist either, terrorist are cowards, but Iran is not a threat.

Originally posted by shire19
There is no proof that it was the President in that hostage situation

What you are thinking of is the photo that was used to claim he was personally there and personally doing it. That was disputed by many people, including him. What isn't disputed is that he was one of the student radicals who founded the group and headed it. He didn't personally and physically hold a gun to anyone's head (maybe), but he was one of the active student radicals.

the IRGC a radical group? Thats new to me.

DO they or don't they serve to prop up the ruling elite priests?

Nonetheless it's their country and their system.

So?

The mullahs are bad news imo but if the Iranians wanted a regime change or a different system they would take care of it themselves, afterall they've done it once before.

Who cares what the iranians want.

Brainwashed? You believe thats the reason why the Muslim women wear the Hijab?

Yes. Most enculturation is a form of brainwashing. Muslim women that wear hajib are brainwashed just like mmenonite women who don't show their ankles are brainwashed and just like (some) fundamentalist christian women who only wear "plainclothes" are brainwashed.

ground zero
wouldn't want a gun to protect your self? that's essentially what their nuclear ambition is.

Imagine a neighborhood where the biggest guy on the block points a bazzoka at you and says 'if you buy a gun, i will effing murder you'. Would you buy the gun?



[edit on 3-4-2006 by Nygdan]

Originally posted by gfad

Although Iran may not have equivalent human rights of countries in the west, it is largely misunderstood and many people make assumptions based on inaccuracies.

Now can we please get back to topic??!!

-George

Well said... there is also the 'demonization' which always occurs prior to some political/military action.

...and the topic is the 'Saeqeh'
.