New Humvee ATS'er wishlist thread

As some of us know one of the programs that appears to be stillbirthed in some DOD think tank is a replacement for the hummvee, which has proven itself to be a tuna can ripe for splitting by IED's.

The purpose of this thread is to engage the best and brightest of ATS's duitiful weapons forum followers to give their own personal wishlist or pet design exposure. While this isn't a darpa feeder program or anything of the sort, I'd just like to see what my fellow ats'ers come up with to replace our magnificent but flawed primary light transport vehicle.

The Humvee was never meant to be a tank or APC standing up to IEDS its a light military truck. It was made to replace the Jeep and does a fine job of that.

Its really the gold standard in light military trucks. Can you name a better current light military truck on the planet?

Did I say my point was to name a better light military vehicle?

NO I SAID MY POINT WAS TO GET AN ATS'ER WISHLIST FOR THE NEXT HUMMVEE.

Which as I said earlier and can be confirmed is a project already stalled at some point in the DOD budgetary pipeline.

TO be BLUNT if you can't be constructive don't contribute.

THIS IS NOT A WHO IS BETTER THREAD

Plain and simple I don't care whose flag you want to wave and say yaya go team for I want a real discourse on what we can do to make current equipment better.


Edit: On a more reasonable note... I am not going to retract the statement above. However I will say this

It is unconscionable for us to delay the development of a new vehicle when the current one is weekly costing lives on the ground in the name of developing other less currently useful projects. The whole thread was about this, and while I don't support the war they are fighting now that they are there I would never advocate cutting a single penny of spending that could cost a soldier his life. I am sorry if I made people think otherwise, however I started this thread as a sort of offshoot of the ATS aircraft project type thread to see if we as relativelly smart individuals could brainstorm up something safer better etc.

Some of the single most life saving and capabillity enhancing hummvee accessories have came from concerned citizens. including the SAW top mount in the turret hull and sent from home supplemental armor for hummvees. I started this thread in continuation of the concept of human ingenuitty and compassion for our fighting men being a key driver in life saving technology.

[edit on 31-3-2006 by astral_ice]

ShadowXIX is correct, the Humvee was never intended to be an armored vehicle, and is "thin skinned".

Can you name a better current light military truck on the planet?

No, and hence the reason I drive a 1979 Jeep Cherokee sport.

As for creating a better "primary light transport", I am willing to give a go and a replacement. Even if this was a DARPA fishbowl.

astral_ice
As for flaws, can you name any other than the opinion already stated, of yours. Because the Humvee is in the DoD works for some time.

First change I would make, would be that all future military vehicles be standard multi/alternative fuel capable.
Second change, is a new model design for frame and body.
Something like the Aliens (the movie), APC. I like what Battlefield 2142 did, but it needs to be smaller than a LAV/Stryker.
Third, the concept would combine the Bradley Fighting Vehicle
roadwheel/track mobility. This ability to use wheel and or tracks improves advantage of maneuver warfare.

For electronics packages, it would have FLIR, and thermal. Allowing it or those mounted within to "see".

All further details are classified and require need to know.


[edit on 31-3-2006 by ADVISOR]

But whats the point of replacing something that is arguably the best at what it was designed to do. You ripp on it for "has proven itself to be a tuna can ripe for splitting by IED's" They dont need a better light truck they need to stop using a light truck as if it was a APC.

If you want something that stands up better to IEDs your not looking for another light truck. There might be something needed to fill the role between what a light truck is suppose to do and a tank and light truck.

But isnt that what the Stryker was for?

Originally posted by ADVISOR
First change I would make, would be that all future military vehicles be standard multi/alternative fuel capable.

Thats a really good concept IMHO the Humvee don't exactly get great MPG. Thats a real issue with it while staying in its designed role.

Perhaps even a Hybrid option could be looked at, If you could run soley on Electric power some of the times that could be very handy as it could drasticaly cut down on noise and thermal signature. Plus you get great MPG

Thanks advisor for getting the ball rolling.

ANd shadow yeah I acknowledge there is only so much protection you can pack in a light truck. However there is always a way to make it better and it is listed as a current DOD project.

Like I said all along this is a wishlist thread man. it's our chance to exercise our brains a bit and see if we can either predict the future of light combat transports or maybe even help the breed of vehicle evolve.

Edit: the hybrid electric angle has alot of benefits especially in our current modus operandi of low intensity conflict where the front line is an outmoded concept for sure. Being able to run stealth mode would be invaluable to crews facing guerrillas even deep in friendly territory.

[edit on 31-3-2006 by astral_ice]

I apologize if I was derailing your thread that was not my intention.

A lower profile might be another good option to consider. That could make them less of a target and easier to transport. But you might have to make some trade offs in ground clearance.

Unless if you used something like a airbag uspension to raise and lower the ride height at will. Keep it low to the ground when cruising Iraqi streets but raise it up if your off roading.

just to clarify,


All in all I think the hummer is doing as good of a job as we can expect it to in alot of ways. However this has nothing to do with the stalled replacement program, and the ways modern engineering could design a better vehicle.

My single biggest complaint is the slab side construction of the vehicle. Which is much more prone to an uncontrolled explosive blast than a more modern shaped hull.

Otherwise on the note of hybridizing... the big flaw in that plan is having to up armor extra components necessary for hybrid drive.


Edit: that's exactly what i'm thinking shadow if we lower the profile and make it more resilient to IED type weapons what shape would we end up with? and how would we make it a viable and cheap enough to produce massivelly product.

[edit on 31-3-2006 by astral_ice]

Humvee replacement?.............



What about this?. road side assitance and 5 year warranty. add a machine gun and your set
external image

Certainly more stylish advisor....

And I bet the ergonomics kill versus the 3/4 inch foam pad seats of todays hummvee.... but somehow I doubt they are cost effective.

Other wise yer off your computerchair/rocker mate.

Ok, this isn't an exact plan, just a rough concept.
My prior as stated above specs, take precedance over the following visual.
Being solely used to represent integration of (CROWS).



Considering future prototypes for CROWS is an obvious, I leave that open as appropriate.

Also I would like to point out this article, Up-Armored HMMWV, because it has alot to do with this thread.

yep advisor I alluded to the up armored hummvee and the civilian rush jobs that were donated awhile back when the kits were scarce in my earlier post.

Like I said, I am not complaining about the stout old girl. She is performing and field refitting better than the original jeep ever would have for sure.

The Crow thing is interesting however and thx for the heads up I'll look it over and respond after I sleep.

My real question is if you could go hog wild and spare no expense what would you do to make the average boonie hopping soldier's ride a safer and more efficient first contact machine?

As a former soldier yourself you gotta have a wish list advisor.

Originally posted by astral_ice
My real question is if you could go hog wild and spare no expense what would you do

Use ALOT of Titanium A N D Kevlar ceramic composites.
That is my personal opinion, people may complain Titanium would break or snap, like they have when used as masts for sailboats. I counter with saying, just add flexable but firm reinforcement. For example ballistic plateing would have kevlar ceramic composites, or that new fluid being developed for kinetic absorbsion. While any metals or cases used would be Titanium cored.

Also I'm a firm backer of the Telescopic Sight Unit w/FLIR, & thermal. There should be no excuses, considering it would be useful.

A first contact machine though, is not what I would prefur for "the average boonie hopping soldier's ride". Average boonie hopping soldiers, so to say,
should be properly supported with organic heavier armor.

Now as to the arguement of what can be done to improve the Humvee, for improved "first contact". I would have to say, install a high powered chemical laser. The operators of the vehicle would be able to literally light up anything suspicious.
For heavy armor, even just lining them with fragmentation vests, aka kevlar. That would be beneficial if doubled up, and more so if combined with modern tech.

If cost wasnt a issue I would go with the CROWS system but with some slight changes. Instead of a 15-inch color monitor I would have it use a 180 degree display of screens for the gunner. I heard they tried a system like that in the M1A1 but 360 degrees and the younger troops what they called the "nintendo generation" took to that very quick.

Looking at a single screen you dont really get that same situational awareness you would get from sticking your head outside. Perhaps even some type of VR helmet to operate the Crows to give you a view as if you really were up there.

Originally posted by ShadowXIX
some type of VR helmet to operate the Crows

That would be a good future plan.


Finally, I found the article on what I mentioned above, about Liquid armor for Kevlar vests.
It can be found after scrolling just past half way down.

Just because something is better then all currently existing alternatives (or some thing it replaced in the past), doesn't mean it can't be improved.

With that kind of attitude, why do anything different now when no past alternatives were better? So if you ran the world, it would stay the same for ten-thousand years.

Here's a wishlist for ya.

- Acoustic sniper locator system that ignores allied fire
- Drive-by-wire systems with built in IR/DL camera's to give the pilot a turnable 180 degree perspective of the terrain without exposure to enemy fire, this is contingent on the next mod.
- Better bullet proof glass comparable to light armor(not sure if this is available yet, but it will be)
- Shotgun position gunnery control station, controlling a variety of built in weapons systems such as: grenade launchers, mg's, *ahem* MINIGUN (Yeah right, but still heh)
- Oh yeah, the last, replace everything in the Hummer with stronger and lighter materials as they become available, therby lowering consumption.
- H2 Fuel Cells for silent idle(I've heard that the M1A2 may get something like this in the near future)

I'd say a low silhouette, heavilly armored wheeled vehicle would be the best choice.

Pretty much the vehicle from Aliens, that CROWS stuff sounds kinda funky as well.

Perhaps an upgrade kit for the HMMWV would be a good idea as well.

Cover the windows with armor and have the outside projected on a screen to simulate a window you can view through, this will prevent snipers from shooting through glass, the armor should be composed of definitly some ballistics absorbing material, how far is that nano-tube technology coming along?

how far is that nano-tube technology coming along?

Not far enough as of this moment to my knowledge. Expect far more rapid progress in Robotics in the near future. The need for lighter, stronger, and tougher in those applications will definately trickle down through all aspects of the military. Some of them are frightening ttytt.