Ever think that Al-Queda was working in conjunction with the USA? Seems to me there are alot of things showing that we had prior knowledge and just let it happen...if not helped out.

Originally posted by Griff
Ever think that Al-Queda was working in conjunction with the USA? Seems to me there are alot of things showing that we had prior knowledge and just let it happen...if not helped out.

Please clarify this statement.

Are you suggesting that

a) the USA and Al-Qaida have a working relationship?

or

b) the USA helps Al-Qaida without Al-Qaida's knowledge?

I was just brainstorming. I have no proof just speculation by me and this speculation really doesn't make much sense. I was playing devils advocate.

On another note. If he gets the death penalty, it will be public right?

Considering that he has already been trying for an insanity defense...

ummmm maybe he is insane...

or maybe he pulled a deal (that would be an interesting deep Rabbit hole)

Originally posted by Griff
I was just brainstorming. I have no proof just speculation by me and this speculation really doesn't make much sense. I was playing devils advocate.

The reason I asked is as follows:

There are 3 possible scenarios:

1) I outright reject the first scenario: Al-Qaida and the USA have a "working relationship". Al-Qaida and the USA "worked in conjunction" on 9/11.

It then follows logically that Al-Qaida supports the US led invasion of middle eastern countries. If this is the case, then Al-Qaida is not really Al-Qaida, but something else totally opposite of what Al-Qaida claims to stand for. In other words, Al-Qaida does not exist.

Do you see the contradiction in the notion that the USA and Al-Qaida have a "working relationship"?

2) The USA helps Al-Qaida without Al-Qaida's knowledge. Al-Qaida planned and carried out 9/11, but the USA knew of the plot and even ensured that the attacks were not thwarted.

If this is the case, then why is there so much evidence that suggests a US Military operation on 9/11?

3) Al-Qaida exists, but had nothing to do with 9/11, since the US goverment was solely responsible for carrying out the attacks.

If this is the case, then why is Zacarias Moussaoui condemning himself to death to protect a government cover-up?

That is the main question here... Things do not add up.

Originally posted by LazarusTheLong
or maybe he pulled a deal (that would be an interesting deep Rabbit hole)

Ahhhh... A deal as in: "If you give us the one piece of testimony that will ensure that you get the death penalty, we won't give you the death penalty?"

If he doesn't get the death penalty, in my mind this conspiracy will be absolutely confirmed.

I don't believe it, he's a loon. He reminds me of this local guy, early 20's, rather dim...his infant daughter is more mature than he is...he wanted to be a soldier like nobodies business tried the army, tried the marines, tried every single branchm no one would accept him, his IQ was too low...he's not retarded or anything, just a tad dim (prefect cannon fodder if you ask me but what do I know) anyrate, for about 2 years afterwards everytime you saw him he was in military uniform, army fatigues, Marine dress blues etc. and he was always telling ya how he had just come back from Korea or Iraq or Afghanistan etc...even though everybody knew he was just imagining. I have this feeling that either Moussaoui was either a plant to distract the authorities away from the real plotters, or he was turned down by Al Qeada and has been playing wannabe ever since....a rather fatal game but he wouldn't be the first one, or the last...when dreams lose meanings we grasp at whatever we can to give our lives meaning, even if they are themselves meaningless.

Originally posted by grover
I have this feeling that either Moussaoui was either a plant to distract the authorities away from the real plotters, or he was turned down by Al Qeada and has been playing wannabe ever since....

Interesting theory...

A) Moussaoui was a plant to distract the authorities away from the real plotters.

If this is true then it logically follows that Moussaoui probably had no specific knowledge of 9/11; Moussaoui was apprehended before 9/11. If you were planning 9/11, would you want someone in custody with foreknowledge of your plot?

If so, then Moussaoui is merely a patsy, and has been set-up by the real plotters.

If this is really the case, then again, why is Moussaoui condemning himself to death to protect those who set him up?

B) Moussaoui was turned down by Al Qeada and has been playing wannabe ever since.

If this is the case then the US goverment has no real proof that Moussaoui was an Al-Qaida member, since he wasn't one. Yet they have tried and convicted him anyway.

This leads to the fact that the US government is using Moussaoui as a cover-up for 9/11, which suggests that the US government is responsible for 9/11.

hmmm...

maybe it was the result of the constant torture by the US...

that is enough to get anyone to confess to anything

My personal feeling about this whole thing goes something like; elements within the US government, military, and intelligence community, not the whole shebang, but those with contacts with OBL from the Soviet Afghan War, and an agenda to take the US far to the right of democracy, were complicit in 9/11 and the Anthrax Attacks. So far their plan is working, but beginning to fall apart at the seams as the cognition of the American public kicks in and the good people who make up the bulk of this country try to foil the coup. Now we hear talk of a 'Civil War', over immigration reform, of all things. Another front is opening.

Moussaoui is a pawn, and will be used as a feint to distract/divert attention and confuse the issues as much as possible. Even if he gets the death penalty, it will be years in appeals and he may never be executed.

[edit on 27-3-2006 by Icarus Rising]

Originally posted by openfire

Originally posted by grover
I have this feeling that either Moussaoui was either a plant to distract the authorities away from the real plotters, or he was turned down by Al Qeada and has been playing wannabe ever since....

Interesting theory...

A) Moussaoui was a plant to distract the authorities away from the real plotters.

If this is true then it logically follows that Moussaoui probably had no specific knowledge of 9/11; Moussaoui was apprehended before 9/11. If you were planning 9/11, would you want someone in custody with foreknowledge of your plot?

If so, then Moussaoui is merely a patsy, and has been set-up by the real plotters.

If this is really the case, then again, why is Moussaoui condemning himself to death to protect those who set him up?

B) Moussaoui was turned down by Al Qeada and has been playing wannabe ever since.

If this is the case then the US goverment has no real proof that Moussaoui was an Al-Qaida member, since he wasn't one. Yet they have tried and convicted him anyway.

This leads to the fact that the US government is using Moussaoui as a cover-up for 9/11, which suggests that the US government is responsible for 9/11.

Bingo...If he was a plant, the only way if would have ever worked was if he was convinced he was part of an actual plot and was strung along, remember shake whatshisname, the "mastermind" behind 9/11 says moussaoui was not part of the plot, even though he says he was...somebody is lying and I would wager that its whatshisname.

As for the second part, that he was playing wannabe.....All governments need scapegoats, especially if they were caught with their pants down and bending over and in Moussaoui they have the perfect one since he has deluded himself that he was a player BUT your last assumption does not necessiarly follow...they don't need to cover up they were involved, they need to act like they are engaged and actually doing something to hide the fact that they aren't (or weren't). Duplicity does not neccessiarly mean guilt, it can also hide cowardness, inaction, corruption or stupidity all of which have flourished under this administration.

Why nobody considered the possibility of faked news? WHat is the evidence that Moussaoui said what they told us what he said?

The court was private so that no record of what happened in there exists. We are only told that "Moussaoui said" and "Moussaoui testified" , but we didn't hear the testimony ourselves.

IMO, news could be easily fabricated if no audio/vedio/offical_documents exists to supports them.

After the faked BinLaden Confession vedio why would we trust U.S media anymore?

Show me the evidence before we start the discussion.


[edit on 27-3-2006 by Deep_Blue]

Deep_Blue, that had dawned on me too. Also, aren't jurors forbidden to read the news until the case is over? If so they wouldn't be able to speak up until it's over.

Though if indeed the gov is behind 9/11, I would think the surest way to get a scapegoat to actually admit to something like that, would be either:

A - Threaten to kill his family.
or
B - Mind control techniques to actually make him believe that he did it.

Who said Al Qaida didnt have something to do with 9/11? I always assumed the general conspiracy debate was if the government knew it, and intentfully declined to do anything to stop the attacks, in order to gain a political edge, and ofcourse, more power.

Originally posted by WolfofWar
I always assumed the general conspiracy debate was if the government knew it, and intentfully declined to do anything to stop the attacks, in order to gain a political edge, and ofcourse, more power.

Nah; most people here believe it was all just an inside job. Al Qaeda operatives may have been used as patsies, but most here believe US factions had quite an active role. Look at WCIP's poll.

It is really suspicious that it has taken so long to get him on trial...

for those that dont remember, He originally told the media that he could prove that all of 9-11 was a lie... who sponsored it, who caused it, and who acted in it... and it was going to expose the US governments lies...

anyone else remember these rants? or was that only on Oklahoma news?

anyway... then we didn't hear anything more forever...
then we hear that they are going for an insanity defense...
then we hear he confessed...

that doesn't ring like logic, that rings like a cracked bell...

Originally posted by Kruel
Also, aren't jurors forbidden to read the news until the case is over? If so they wouldn't be able to speak up until it's over.

Good point. They aren't even allowed to speak with anyone other than other jurors. So, how did we get this imformation if the case is closed to the public and the jurors can't speak? This is starting to sound like falsified information to me.