Pentagon Tells Bush - Climate Change Will Destroy Us

The possibility exists that the weakening gulstream could triger an iceage in europe. See CNN Source

"Without the influence of the Gulf Stream and its two northern branches, the North Atlantic Drift and the Canary Current, the weather in Britain could be more like that of Siberia, which shares the same latitude."

If I remember well, the weakening of the gulfstream could be triggered by melting ice. As this water is lighter than the seawater (salt) the flow of the gulfstrem could be stopped or driven more to the south.

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[edit on 30-3-2006 by Benevolent Heretic]

True loofoo - that's how it works. The melting ice cools the Gulfstream, stops it, and then Britain, Europe etc are cooled...

I just reread the article Alpha Grey - EXCELLENT.

Really good stuff. wow. ...So all those reports saying it's gonna hit much faster than anyone expected were downplaying the crisis.

This isn't the first time this has been discussed, and while some threads resolved that it was more hype than real... it does consider real science...

it is given in the light of "worst case scenario" though...
so dont start conserving urine yet...

here are some other threads that have talked about this very article.
thread
another pentagon climate report thread

The report is not debated, the source is not debated...
the outcome IS debated, the level of concern is debated...
thank you for playing,

in closing, if you are of the mindset that " this is bunk"
then you are more than welcome to keep your unhelpful comments to yourself...

it isn't bunk, in the mind and research of countless scientists.

Can't believe I didn't check the date!

The article was written in February 2004. LOL. It's still good.

OK guys here goes
www.stopglobalwarming.org...

And
images.google.com...

And
news.nationalgeographic.com...

People fail to realize that yes the planet goes through its cycles but, we are pushing the limits of what our environment can stand without stopping to actually look at the concequences of our acts.

Dont forget
www.worldviewofglobalwarming.org...

Unfortunately I have little to no faith in the governments of our world. The ones that do care dont have enough power to stop the major violators who continue to pollute like nothing will happen all in the name of profit.

I urge anyone who reads this post who cares about this subject to go to the first link and sign up for the virtual march.

[Mod edit - link shrink]

[edit on 11/4/2006 by Umbrax]

This is nothing new at all, we covered this almost two years ago, and btw it was never "secret", the government released this report and it is called "The Pentagon's weather nightmare scenario".

You can do a search on the forums and you will find plenty of information about it, and as another member said, this is a worse case scenario.

BTW, to whoever said that "we should be spending the money that we are spending in the war on terrorism, on building new levees, etc", you are obviously part of the problem, which is people keep building in the worse and most affected areas hit by hurricanes.

What people should be doing is getting the hint that nature is giving and move away from the coasts....more so if you live in an area which is below sea level, such as New Orleans...

No amount of money, or walls/levees, are going to save New Orleans, and parts of the south of the U.S.

This year is supposed to be as bad, if not worse than last year.

We have an unprecedented la Nina which has formed already and is already causing bad weather in several parts of the world.

If you live in New Orleans, or anywhere near where the hurricanes hit last year in the U.S. and if you have enough money to rebuild your home, think of your loved ones and move/build your home further inland.

Here is a link to the report, but if you want more information about it, search the forums.

www.monthlyreview.org...

Here is another link from MIT about this report, which was taken from Fortune.

web.mit.edu...

There was a link to the report from Congress, but now there are so many websites that deal with that report, that I am having a hard time finding it.

[edit on 30-3-2006 by Muaddib]

Anyways, here is a link from NASA about this report and others, as well as other information dealing with this topic.

March 5, 2004: Global warming could plunge North America and Western Europe into a deep freeze, possibly within only a few decades.

That's the paradoxical scenario gaining credibility among many climate scientists. The thawing of sea ice covering the Arctic could disturb or even halt large currents in the Atlantic Ocean. Without the vast heat that these ocean currents deliver--comparable to the power generation of a million nuclear power plants--Europe's average temperature would likely drop 5 to 10°C (9 to 18°F), and parts of eastern North America would be chilled somewhat less. Such a dip in temperature would be similar to global average temperatures toward the end of the last ice age roughly 20,000 years ago.

science.nasa.gov...

Now keep in mind that two years later, after that report was given, experts are now saying the thawing of the northern regions is going a lot faster than they anticipated.

[edit on 30-3-2006 by Muaddib]

Well, at least it doesn't get boring on this planet.

Thanks for the links infra-red.

Great info, analysis and links Mauddib.

Do you think the process has speeded up?

Does the worst case scenario look more plausible now?

Just read an article at Yahoo news today stating that the artic is warming faster than the rest of the world. It states that the artic is warming at .5-.7 degrees a decade while the rest of the world is warming at .1 degrees a decade.
h ttp://news.yahoo.com
[edit on 2-4-2006 by amisn1957]

[Mod edit - Link shrink ]

[edit on 11/4/2006 by Umbrax]

i wounder what bush said when this information was presented "if it aint a problem now deal with it later!"???! we all know how he responded with disaters like katrina...

Originally posted by KrisFromGenk
You hear a lot about sea levels rising when the polar ice melts and so on, but I've been thinking, and this may be a stupid question, but, water is the only matter that expands when it goes from liquid to solid right? Shouldn't the sea level drop, or more or less stay the same when all the floating ice melts? It takes up more space in frozen state then in liquid state.

I guess the greatest threat for rising sea levels is all the snow and glaciers that are not allready floating at the moment. Now, how much could this be?

its the other way arround

Originally posted by motionknight

Originally posted by KrisFromGenk
You hear a lot about sea levels rising when the polar ice melts and so on, but I've been thinking, and this may be a stupid question, but, water is the only matter that expands when it goes from liquid to solid right? Shouldn't the sea level drop, or more or less stay the same when all the floating ice melts? It takes up more space in frozen state then in liquid state.

I guess the greatest threat for rising sea levels is all the snow and glaciers that are not allready floating at the moment. Now, how much could this be?

its the other way arround

Erm. No. motionknight is correct. Watrer expands when it becomes solid - ice.

Why does water expand when it cools?

Water is "locked" in ice, often on land. When the ice melts, it becomes water and flows to the ocean adding more water. It's a quantity thing.

If all the glaciers and polar ice melted then sea level would rise about 30 feet (I think).

.

How much can the white house do to save the world? Everybody has to do what they must to reverse the effects not just GWB. Why is everything that is wrong with the world blamed on him?

In regards weather change, there is being observed by NASA changes on the other planets too right now. So how much is this change man made and how much influenced by our own solar system's effects we don't know yet.

Originally posted by soficrow
If all the glaciers and polar ice melted then sea level would rise about 30 feet (I think)

According to the latest Time Magazine on Global Warming, if Antartica & Greenland where to melt, this will raise the ocean level by 72 m (220 ft).

They also confirm that if North Pole where to melt, this will not change the level much, since that ice is already floating.

Soficrow is correct in saying it will rise about ~30feet. While that is a source it is not a reliable one. For all the floating ice when it melts it lowers the sea…and it is simple math is there enough ice in just Antarctica and Greenland to make 2/3 of the earths surface to rise 220 feet….there is just not enough ice to make it do that.


I don’t know why people blame things on the president…he is the leader for the military that’s it….if he doesn’t sign a bill the house and the senate can easily go over his head…….get it together! It is the house and the senate that can do anything….. political bs



For this part^


[edit on 14-4-2006 by engenerQ]

Originally posted by PopeyeFAFL

Originally posted by soficrow
If all the glaciers and polar ice melted then sea level would rise about 30 feet (I think)

According to the latest Time Magazine on Global Warming, if Antartica & Greenland where to melt, this will raise the ocean level by 72 m (220 ft).

They also confirm that if North Pole where to melt, this will not change the level much, since that ice is already floating.

Thank you PopeyeFAFL.

GREAT article. It costs at Time but I found the full text at truthout. Here are a few tasty bits.

...glaciers, it turns out, can move with surprising speed, and so can nature. What few people reckoned on was that global climate systems are booby-trapped with tipping points and feedback loops, thresholds past which the slow creep of environmental decay gives way to sudden and self-perpetuating collapse.

..."Things are happening a lot faster than anyone predicted," says Bill Chameides, chief scientist for the advocacy group Environmental Defense and a former professor of atmospheric chemistry. "The last 12 months have been alarming." Adds Ruth Curry of the Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution in Massachusetts: "The ripple through the scientific community is palpable."

...Icebergs don't raise sea levels when they melt because they're floating, which means they have displaced all the water they're ever going to. But ice on land, like Greenland's, is a different matter. Pour that into oceans that are already rising (because warm water expands), and you deluge shorelines. By some estimates, the entire Greenland ice sheet would be enough to raise global sea levels 23 ft., swallowing up large parts of coastal Florida and most of Bangladesh. The Antarctic holds enough ice to raise sea levels more than 215 ft.

By Any Measure, Earth Is At ... The Tipping Point

[edit on 14-4-2006 by soficrow]

Originally posted by worksoftplayhard
i wounder what bush said when this information was presented "if it aint a problem now deal with it later!"???! we all know how he responded with disaters like katrina...

It wasn't president Bush's job to order the governor and Mayor of New Orleans on how to do the evacuation.

The ones who should have responded faster, and the same people who were responsible for what happened during Katrina are, the Mayor of New Orleans, and the governor or Luisiana, who did not follow the procedures they have had for years, in how to evacuate people in such a disaster.

The president even requested to allow the military to go help, but the Governor of Luisiana refused to do this. The only thing president Bush could have done is take control by force of Luisiana to make sure as much help as possible was given during that crises....

Then again if he would have done this I am pretty sure the same people who blame him now for what the governor of Luisiana and the Mayor of NO did, would say he is a dictator for taking the power from the Mayor/Governor of NO/Luisiana....