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NEWS: N. Korea Suggests It Can Strike U.S. First

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posted on Mar, 22 2006 @ 02:54 PM
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We are a bloodthirstly bunch huh?

I hope this all just stays speculation...

Im moving to Brazil...jungles, beaches...nude beaches, cocktails, and pretty sunshine.




posted on Mar, 22 2006 @ 03:03 PM
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Originally posted by ShadowXIX

They can trace the Uranium used in any such bomb to its origin. Uranium has a isotope, U-234. Concentrations of that isotope vary widely among uranium deposits and mines around the world.

These bombs have fingerprints that can be traced back to thier place of Origin. It would take longer then if they just launched a missile but the response would be the same from the US once they found out this bomb came from N Korea.


you watch to many movies. what you saw in "the sum of all fears" isn't accurate.

there's several isotopes of uranium, infact you use 238 as a tamper to reflect neutrons back to the core (its missing in a neutron bomb)

you're not going to be able to tell who made the bomb after it was exploded

since NK uses plutonium as the core not much 234 would be in there. plutonium is the choice if you don't want to build enrichment facilities as its seperation from spent fuel is quite easy.



posted on Mar, 22 2006 @ 03:10 PM
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Originally posted by FlaminMo
North Korea may have a few nukes, but the delivery system will not work. Delivery is the key to mass destruction devices. North Korean will only justify our use of the best nukes and delivery sytem in the world.

Classroom maps will just show a big hole, where North Korean was.


they currently have a missle that can strike the western seaboard of the USA. the 3 stage missle that they fired back in the early 90's that splashed down in the pacific could have went into orbit had the third stage ignited.

this missle could have reached anywhere in the world and there was some debate after the launch if the third stage malfunctioned or if NK deliberately prevented it from igniting. back then they didn't have enough plutonium to make a bomb and that may have been the reason for the delay on the missle.



posted on Mar, 22 2006 @ 03:18 PM
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Originally posted by bigx01

you watch to many movies. what you saw in "the sum of all fears" isn't accurate.

there's several isotopes of uranium, infact you use 238 as a tamper to reflect neutrons back to the core (its missing in a neutron bomb)

you're not going to be able to tell who made the bomb after it was exploded

since NK uses plutonium as the core not much 234 would be in there. plutonium is the choice if you don't want to build enrichment facilities as its seperation from spent fuel is quite easy.


Im not a huge Tom clancy fan but the "finger printing" nuclear material plutonium or uranium is a proven method. The US does indeed have a data base of nuclear material from locations all over the world.

Nobody knows how advanced this technology is some people do indeed think the refinement of uranium would scramble the finger print . But nobody knows and it technically possible to trace back to source by using isotopic 'fingerprint'



posted on Mar, 22 2006 @ 06:27 PM
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like i said.... once the bomb has exploded you will not be able to tell where it came from. but that is how hollywood portraid it.


yes if you have the virgin material you can find out where it was made. but what people think is that after you have exploded the bomb they will be able to find out.

i don't want to go into the physics of a reactor but, u234 is also a byproduct when you irradiate u238, as is pu239, pu240

[edit on 22-3-2006 by bigx01]



posted on Mar, 22 2006 @ 07:22 PM
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Originally posted by ADHDsux4me
It burns my buttons that NK is left alone, like the angry short kid in gym class who says if you don't pick me for dodge-ball I'll slash the tires on your new 1985 pinto. All the while we (America) think hey let's go pick on the weird kids and take their lunch money (Middle East & oil).

America's nose should be in it's own business, if we spent a fraction of our new and ever expanding war budget on fixing our domestic crisises like homelessness, improved healthcare reform, unemployment, education, and revitalization of inner city and rural economies, we just might be the friggin utopia our forefathers imagined.

But no, let's ignore blatant threats hollow or not NK, and beat up on the weird kids, who later mass together with others who have felt the slight, and hurl stones at us while we duck and cover saying "We'd kick your butts if we could find you!"

True patriotism is supporting our country from bottom to top in that order, and our foundations are ever shakier, we have an ever dwindling middle class, an ever growing poor, and a few small but getting richer wealthy class.

On that note we need to raise the minimum wage to $10/HR the realistic amount needed for even poor class americans.

I'm tired and I may have rambled.

-ADHDsux4me


If you would like for us to keep our nose in our own business... then perhaps you would be for drilling for oil offshore the U.S. mainland, and in Alaska. Nevermind the imports we receive daily from other countries around the globe. The simple fact is that the world is far too advanced for the U.S. to "keep it's nose in it's own business." Besides, look at what happend before when we followed the policies of "Isolation" set forth by James Madison and the other founding fathers. World War I and II. That's what.

Our forefathers never meant for this to be a utopia... not that they didn't want it, but because they are smart enough to know that it isn't possible. A utopia can only exists if it's citizens are perfect. Sorry to say, but NONE of us are perfect. Also, I'm unaware of the "unemployment" problem you are talking about. Last time I checked, our unemployment rate was lower than it ever was in the 70's, 80's, and the 90's.

Also, allow me to give you a quick lesson in basic economics. An unemployment rate is NECESSARY, in a HEALTHY economy. Why? Because if we did NOT have the unemployed, businesses would have no where to turn to hire NEW people, meaning they would have to raise their wages and salaries, and in order for them to continue making a profit, they would raise the prices on the goods and services they provide. I.E. INFLATION!

Lastly, raising the minimum wage would do absolutely nothing. Refer, to the new word you just learned, "Inflation" above. If you force businesses to pay at LEAST $10/hr to their employees, they in turn are going to jack up their prices accordingly in order to ensure that they still can make a profit. The only other way to ensure that they could still make a profit would be to CUT employees, which would RAISE the unemployment rate to an unhealthy level, ultimately gutting our economy.



posted on Mar, 22 2006 @ 07:28 PM
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Originally posted by bigx01
like i said.... once the bomb has exploded you will not be able to tell where it came from. but that is how hollywood portraid it.

yes if you have the virgin material you can find out where it was made. but what people think is that after you have exploded the bomb they will be able to find out.


Nuclear explosions leave an isotopic signature.

example:


Scientists matched fallout in them to specific nuclear tests conducted in the 1950s in Nevada, US, confirming the tests did in fact contaminate Europe.

Finding the fingerprint

It used mass spectrometry to measure levels of the radioactive elements plutonium, radium and caesium in the samples.

The researchers were able to tie plutonium in the Rothamsted samples to tests conducted by the US military in the Nevada desert in 1952 and 1953.

"Each weapons test has a characteristic signature of different isotopes; in this case it is two different plutonium isotopes, but it could be two different uranium isotopes," said Professor Keith Goulding of Rothamsted told the British Association's annual meeting.

The new mass spectrometers at Southampton enabled them to look at the ratios of the different isotopes in the Rothamsted samples and then compare those with the samples they have from the tests.

Nuclear fallout from tests at Bikini atoll in the Pacific and from the reactor meltdown at Chernobyl in the former Soviet Union can also be detected.

"By doing that, they were able to detect which tests produced which fallout," said Professor Goulding. BBC




Maybe you better post your source of information,
or I will remain thinking your full of beans.

Tracing the Source: Nuclear Forensics & Illicit Nuclear Trafficking -IAEA.org








[edit on 22-3-2006 by Regenmacher]



posted on Mar, 22 2006 @ 09:20 PM
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Originally posted by ShadowXIX

Originally posted by Bhadhidar

And then what do we do? "Glassify" South Korea? Blame Al-Queda? Try to prove that it was NK, while the rest of the world goes "But the terrorists were mostly Suadi"s..." ?


They can trace the Uranium used in any such bomb to its origin. Uranium has a isotope, U-234. Concentrations of that isotope vary widely among uranium deposits and mines around the world.

These bombs have fingerprints that can be traced back to thier place of Origin. It would take longer then if they just launched a missile but the response would be the same from the US once they found out this bomb came from N Korea.


Afraid I started a bit of a dust up here!

My point, before was NOT! whether or not NK would be able to nuke the US without being identified/ and punished.

My intended point(s):

1.) The North Koreans could Deliver a nuclear device to the US mainland, without it being detected/destroyed in transit, and detonate it in virtually any US port city.

2.) Given the current world situation, vis-a-vis international economic and political inter-relationships, should such an event occur, the US response would likely be far more muted than most, at least in this forum, are likely to find acceptable as "justice" (ie., vengence).

As I attempted to point out in my original posting, even though most of the 9/11 hijackers were from Saudi Arabia, it is Afghanistan and Iraq (and perhaps soon to be Iran?) which have suffered the brunt of our American wrath.

Even if the isotopic remnants of the blast could be traced back to NK, would the world (beyond US allies) believe our findings? If ground zero turned out to be a South Korean or perhaps a Japanese or Chinese cargo ship, could the US argue convincingly enough that the North Koreans were to blame?

And even if such an arguement could be made, beyond sheer vengence, to what greater purpose would that arguement be made? If we nuke the North, the South, our allies, get poisoned.

Shall we march in as "Liberators" once again, depose a cruel and dangerous dictator once again, hoping, once again, to be hailed as Saviours and Bringers of Democracy... once again?

Would it work? This time. Amid the radioactive after-glow?



posted on Mar, 22 2006 @ 10:15 PM
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Ok I'm just going to give my honest opinion. I think that if North Korea launched a pre-emptive nuclear strike, I doubt that anything less than a nuclear retaliation is just wishful thinking.

Just put yourself in the US president's shoes for a moment. The situation is that you've just been informed that Los Angeles and San Franciso have just been vaporized. Millions of US innocent civilians have just been murdured in cold blood by a dictator with a bad hair style and no regard for human life. The entire nation is going to know what just happened in about five minutes. The American public is going to be screaming for blood when that happens.

Now you could authorize conventional strikes. You could have airstrikes starting in about ten minutes, however the DPRK will have probably prepared for a conventional war, seeing as they just nuked you. This means that NK forces are likely to annilate Seoul with artillery, and then march countless soldiers across the border in a blitzkrieg not seen since the invasion of Poland in 1939.

On the otherhand you've got thousands of warheads ready to go. You could vaporize any target in North Korea just in time for the press conferance. Remember, the American public will be wanting revenge.

If getting nuked is so horrible then why should we just sit back and let North Korea do it to us?

Ladies and gentlemen, part of playing the nuclear warfare game is the knowledge that if you nuke somebody, they'll drop ten time's as many (or their entire arsenal) of their nukes on you. The nuclear game is all about M.A.D., which basically states that if you start playing hardball then the travel agencies are going to have to reconsider labelling your nation as "a nice place to visit".



posted on Mar, 23 2006 @ 04:08 PM
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Originally posted by Regenmacher

Originally posted by bigx01
like i said.... once the bomb has exploded you will not be able to tell where it came from. but that is how hollywood portraid it.

yes if you have the virgin material you can find out where it was made. but what people think is that after you have exploded the bomb they will be able to find out.


Nuclear explosions leave an isotopic signature.

example:


Scientists matched fallout in them to specific nuclear tests conducted in the 1950s in Nevada, US, confirming the tests did in fact contaminate Europe.

Finding the fingerprint

It used mass spectrometry to measure levels of the radioactive elements plutonium, radium and caesium in the samples.

The researchers were able to tie plutonium in the Rothamsted samples to tests conducted by the US military in the Nevada desert in 1952 and 1953.

"Each weapons test has a characteristic signature of different isotopes; in this case it is two different plutonium isotopes, but it could be two different uranium isotopes," said Professor Keith Goulding of Rothamsted told the British Association's annual meeting.

The new mass spectrometers at Southampton enabled them to look at the ratios of the different isotopes in the Rothamsted samples and then compare those with the samples they have from the tests.

Nuclear fallout from tests at Bikini atoll in the Pacific and from the reactor meltdown at Chernobyl in the former Soviet Union can also be detected.

"By doing that, they were able to detect which tests produced which fallout," said Professor Goulding. BBC




Maybe you better post your source of information,
or I will remain thinking your full of beans.

Tracing the Source: Nuclear Forensics & Illicit Nuclear Trafficking -IAEA.org








[edit on 22-3-2006 by Regenmacher]

that doesn't tell them where it was made at. it just tells them which bomb made the fall out



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