Can Muslims Be Good Americans???

Can a devout muslim be an american patriot and a loyal citizen??
politcally, NO because he/she must submit to the mullah (spiritual leader)
who teach annihilation of isreal and the destruction of america

geographically, NO, because his/her allegiance is to mecca , where he/she turns and pray's to 5 times a day!

Intellectually, NO because he/she cannot accept the american constitution since it is based on biblical principals and they believe the bible to be corrupt.

Socially,NO because his/her allegiance to islam forbids them to make friends with christians or jews..

therefore prehaps we should be very suspicious of ALL MUSLIMS in this country.
they obviously cannot be both good muslims and good americans.

The war is bigger than we know!!!

Considering your view point, I doubt me telling you how incredibly silly your theory is probably wont help, but in short don't confuse extremism with religion.

You make assumptions that quite frankly are based on fear and paranoia.

To assume every cleric or mullah (especially those living in america) feels the same way about "western people" that extremist muslims (terrorists) feel is not a very good way of combating the situation and in the end only makes it worse.

If you really think your average american-muslim is going to strike a blow for allah against america simply because his mullah or cleric or whoever claims religious leadership tells them to, then you are sorely underestimating the intelligence of your average american-muslim.

IMO of course, but man are you way off.

I will continue to give muslims the benefit of the doubt, but from now on I will certainly be wary of those claiming to be a sentinal of any sort who use fear as their weapon of choice.

In short, lighten up, they actually aren't all out to get us...you maybe but certainly not us.

Spiderj

Originally posted by Spiderj
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In short, lighten up, they actually aren't all out to get us...you maybe but certainly not us.

Spiderj

out to get US ......are you a muslim? ....if you are i would'nt expect you to agree with one word that was said. as for fear, there is no fear in truth!

Wait, wouldn't a Muslim agree with what you are saying if it is the truth?

But anyway, you obviously don't know any American Muslims otherwise you would not have posted this. Go meet some, you'll see that your prejudices have no substance in reality.

Actually I was raised jewish, but I'm not the most religious jew, I'm a pretty decent buddhist, but no not a muslim.

As for your truth, I don't see truth, I see an opinion coming from a place of fear.

That's my opinion. Unfortunately your task is to now prove that every american muslim is out to get us.

I am also a patriotic american by the way, I'm just not ready to start pointing my guns at every muslim I see.

Spiderj

Originally posted by the_sentinal
Can a devout muslim be an american patriot and a loyal citizen??
politcally, NO because he/she must submit to the mullah (spiritual leader)
who teach annihilation of isreal and the destruction of america

Muslims submit to Allah, not to mullahs.

geographically, NO, because his/her allegiance is to mecca , where he/she turns and pray's to 5 times a day!

It is just a direction of prayer, nothing more. It has nothing to do with any "allegiance" whatsoever.

Intellectually, NO because he/she cannot accept the american constitution since it is based on biblical principals and they believe the bible to be corrupt.

Not true, Muslims are required to respect the laws of countries they are in, so they don't have a problem with constitution, as you might actually see if you observe the real world once in a while.

Socially,NO because his/her allegiance to islam forbids them to make friends with christians or jews..

Now thats just bull feces . Your statement is not true. Observe the reality in America and you shall see.

therefore prehaps we should be very suspicious of ALL MUSLIMS in this country.
they obviously cannot be both good muslims and good americans.

Are you suspicious of all Jews too because of their "allegiance" to Israel?

The war is bigger than we know!!!

Only in your head.

Originally posted by the_sentinal
Can a devout muslim be an american patriot and a loyal citizen??
politcally, NO because he/she must submit to the mullah (spiritual leader)
who teach annihilation of isreal and the destruction of america

You Preach it Brother!!!!!

Since you got a list going:

[sarcasm]
Can't trust those peopel from SE Asia either
Germans...... Yup that whole WWII thing
The British???? Hey its been almost 300 years but can't trust them as well
Australia??? hey its a former prison colony right?
Don't get me going on the Canadians eh?
[/sarcasm]

This kind of bigotry is such a slippery slope you soon shall find yourself (Just you) holed up in some cabin in a remote location ala the Unibomber :shk:

Can Muslims be good Americans? How about this Muslim guy that came to the US in 1956. Studied civil engineering at the Universit of Kansas. WHo worked for the US Navy and had a security cleareance. Who did stuff at China Lake and other bases to this day he cannot and does not talk about. Can he be trusted? Can my FATHER be trusted? Bet your 6 o'clock he can be

i mearly stated that PERHAPS we should be more suspicous not aim guns at>>
you know like a person of interest!

Actually this is a good topic, can conflicting ideologies work?

Id almost have to say that in order for a muslim to become a loyal citizen, Country, then God would have to come first...

If they were willing to do that....ok, if not?.......your a the weakest link....goodbye.

Actually what you said was perhaps we should be suspicious of all muslims in this country stating your opinion that "they obviously cannot be both good muslims and good americans"

Then you make a reference to the war being bigger than we know.

Spying on your fellow citizens, especially for a simple difference like religion is always the first step before you start rounding people up and shooting them on the side of the road.

Or are you saying you are against these things. if you are against these things then you may want to rethink your tactics for fighting the true war on terror which is fear.

Yes I know you don't think your scared but trust me you are.

How about we just make muslims wear something on their clothing so we can know they're muslim at a glance. That way they cant hide, something like a patch maybe..wait that sounds familiar...never mind.

Spiderj

In response to the original post - yes - muslim Americans can be good citizens and loyal Americans. Most of these people came here to escape the kinds of tyranny and extremism that you question. You have a few extremist christians also, blowing up abortion clinics and federal buildings and such, but 95% are normal, tax paying, harmless, family oriented folks. The other 5% are insane and misguided. Just the same with muslim people. 95% are good, average people, probably a lot like everyone else. They want to worship in peace, scratch out a living, have a family. The other 5% of radical jihadist fanatics get all of the press and they are a disgrace to true muslim people. I have worked with many Persian and middle eastern people, most of them muslim, and they were all friendly, well adjusted people. They only show Islamic extremists on the news because that is what the powers that be really want you to see and thats what sells.

The muslims allegiance is to allah,the moon god of arabia
we americans declare "one nation under god" the christian god, a loving god.
while allah is never referred to as our heavenly father. nor is he ever called (love) in the Quran. how can they pledge allegiance to america??


a good american would pledge allegiance to his country. i cant see a devout muslim doing that!

I did'nt ask weather an american muslim would commit a terrorist act as some have implied !

[edit on 21-3-2006 by the_sentinal]

Can a devout muslim be an american patriot and a loyal citizen??

Hmm...I had no idea that American's only practiced one religion. Oh, hold on, they don't!

Let me answer your question with another question. Can Mormans be loyal citizens?

But their still christians right? What about the Armish? who teach their members to live in isolation?

Well?

Originally posted by the_sentinal
The muslims allegiance is to allah,the moon god of arabia

Allah is not a moon god. Read up on that.
There is no "allegiance" to Allah that prevents muslims from living in America. They can live just fine in a country whos laws allow them to worship freely the God they believe in. They can pledge allegiance to that. Last time I checked America was a free country and not a christian theocracy. (we shall ignore the attempts of christian fundamentalists to turn it into one for now here, so we don't go off topic )

we americans declare "one nation under god" the christian god, a loving god.
while allah is never referred to as our heavenly father. nor is he ever called (love) in the Quran. how can they pledge allegiance to america??

So are you saying that ONLY Christians can pledge allegiance to America?

Originally posted by the_sentinal
The muslims allegiance is to allah,the moon god of arabia
we americans declare "one nation under god" the christian god, a loving god.
while allah is never referred to as our heavenly father. nor is he ever called (love) in the Quran.

Arabian moon god? Where did you hear that?? That's nonsense, I can assure you.

As for other names Allah is referred to, have a look at this:

Asma al-Husna - The Most Beautiful Names of Allah

[...]

Ar-Rahman - The All-Compassionate
Ar-Rahim - The All-Merciful

[...]

As-Salam - The Source of Peace

[...]

Al-Ghaffar - The Forgiving

[...]

Al-Ghafur - The Forgiver and Hider of Faults

[...]

Al-Karim - The Generous

[...]

Al-Wadud - The Loving One

[...]

Al-Muhyi - The Giver of Life

[...]

Al-Barr - The Doer of Good

[...]

As-Sabur - The Patient One

Altogether there are 99 names. Educate yourself before making such false and misleading statements.

Related Internet Link:
Jannah.org: An Explanation of the Perfect Names and Attributes of Allah

[edit on 21-3-2006 by Beachcoma]

of all the names you stated none were the names i stated!!

You only mentioned 'Heavenly Father' and 'Love'.

Muslims do not think of God or Allah (they mean the same thing) as Father or Son, because that would imply being born or being able to father. God is a creator. He creates.

As for 'Love', are you saying that none that I posted refers to love? What about the one I put in BOLD?

I'm not sure why I'm arguing with you, because so far from all your posts in this thread it's clear that you've already made up your mind. But no matter, my posts are for the benefit of those who wish to deny ignorance, not embrace it by making up their minds before the discussion starts and therefore closing their minds.

Originally posted by XphilesPhan
Actually this is a good topic, can conflicting ideologies work?

Id almost have to say that in order for a muslim to become a loyal citizen, Country, then God would have to come first...

If they were willing to do that....ok, if not?.......your a the weakest link....goodbye.

Can you name one religion, where a country comes before God? The USA before Jesus?

Some Christians take their cues from Rome, can they be good Americans?

Some Jews even have dual citizenship, can they be trusted?

Japanese-American Shintoists?

Don't go picking on the brown people. Either none of the religions can be trusted, or all of them can be trusted.

Originally posted by paperclip

we americans declare "one nation under god" the christian god, a loving god.
while allah is never referred to as our heavenly father. nor is he ever called (love) in the Quran. how can they pledge allegiance to america??

So are you saying that ONLY Christians can pledge allegiance to America?

If he is I guess there was no allegiance to America prior to the 1950's when the phrase "under God" was inserted.

Well I can't speak for America because thankfully I don't live there, but I can certainly say that there are lots and lots of GREAT Muslims here in Australia, who are PROUD to call themselves Australian Citizens, as well as being Islamic.

They are people just like everyone else, they have families, just like everyone else, and guess what, most of them even work for a living. Things like the Sydney Race Riots absolutely disgrace Australia, and they are not representative of us as a country at all, most of the people there were a bunch of drunken nazi yobbo's anyway, but guess what, they have the RIGHT to EXIST and practise whatever they want as well.

Did you know that Melbourne is the most succesful muliticultural city on Earth? Things like that make me Proud to be an Australian, and guess what, there are plenty of Muslims in Melbourne.

Posts like this are disturbing, and its not like you can say that its a sign of the times, because there have always been closed minded idiots who write such ridiculous, and biased propaganda, I believe the terminology is "Rednecks."


PS - 9/11 was a Government job, they are the real enemy.