Originally posted by ButterBricks
I just do not agree that that connection alone would be enough to make that statement.

Well, my statement is not solely based upon the idea of the wife sitting at the right hand of the husband. It is fundamentally based on what I know. From personal, first hand, experience.

“ John the Baptist...the son of man?
He was also Elijah, in another lifetime. And remember that Elijah didn't die but was taken up in the fiery chariot, witnessed by Elisha.”


…What ?

John the Baptist was the reincarnation of the prophet Elijah from the OT.

Originally posted by queenannie38


Well, my statement is not solely based upon the idea of the wife sitting at the right hand of the husband. It is fundamentally based on what I know. From personal, first hand, experience.




John the Baptist was the reincarnation of the prophet Elijah from the OT.

Where did you get that info from? Are you saying you're married to Jesus?

[edit on 12-12-2007 by Shawn B.]

Jesus is God

The Woman is God's Spirit which is his bride also known as Aphrodite or the God Mother.

Paul who is sitting in the picture sticking his finger up is The Son of God.


That is the hidden secret behind the Da Vinci code..

This interpretive artwork is a rendition of the same history and belief systems displayed over and over. It also represents actual Truth in the Divine Order of this material world.

[edit on 12-12-2007 by Raphael]

The upturned finger is known as the "John Gesture." The pictures Raphael posted are good depictions of it. In another of Leonardo's paintings "The Adoration of the Magi" - the finger emerges from behind a Carob tree, which is a symbol of the Baptist, also. And the very last painting Leo did was for himself, and it was a portrait of John the Baptist, with the finger again pointing up. He died gazing at the Mona Lisa and his portrait of John the Baptist.

In the Last Supper, it is Thomas whose finger is pointed up. Some interpret it as menacing, but the picture itself depicts the exact moment when Christ reveals Judas as the betrayer.

For myself the Da Vinci Code is a fantastic movie - but I see it for what is - a movie made to sell. Brown was able to take all sorts of Gnostic principals and weave them with Leonardo's paintings and it sold.

For instance, the girl in the movie, her name is Sophie. If you've read any of the gnostic texts then you are familiar with the "Pistas Sophia." Sophia means "wisdom" and in gnostic thought it is the aspect of God in the feminine form - to them she is the Holy Spirit. Also, in the movie, Sophie is able to put her hands on Dr. Langdon's head and heal his phobia of closed spaces - being able to heal is a direct gift from God via the Holy Spirit.

There are so many gnostic themes in Leonardo's work, that he probably was a closet gnostic. He was in cahoots with the Medici family, who collected ancient texts. And let's not forget, that two Popes came out of this inner circle. I can't say for sure, but I would bet good money that Leonardo had access to texts such as those found in the Nag Hammadi library, during a time when such texts were labeled heresies. It's also possible Leonardo was a practicing alchemist (which I believe he was).

Next to Christ, John the Baptist is my most favorite person and anything I find about him I read. Jesus said he was Elijah, though John himself said he was not. This could mean he was reincarnated if you favor more gnostic themes - or it could mean that he just had Elijah's spirit!





[edit on 12-12-2007 by Myrtales Instinct]

… Just wondering what your sources are ‘Myrtales Instinct’, [Not doubting you here or anything.]

Particularly for the ‘john gesture’, I have heard this sign/gesture called the same thing before but I don’t know of any hard facts stating that it refers to john. [Maybe you have come across it in Da Vinci's mss ?]


Oh and do you know anywhere I can read these Gnostic texts ?
[Any chance your Gnostic or something of the sort ?]

Originally posted by ButterBricks
… Just wondering what your sources are ‘Myrtales Instinct’, [Not doubting you here or anything.]

Particularly for the ‘john gesture’, I have heard this sign/gesture called the same thing before but I don’t know of any hard facts stating that it refers to john. [Maybe you have come across it in Da Vinci's mss ?]


Oh and do you know anywhere I can read these Gnostic texts ?
[Any chance your Gnostic or something of the sort ?]

The "John Gesture" was first introduced as such in the 90's by the two men who authored The Templar Revelation, which describes much of the symbolism in Da Vinci's work and possible theories for it all. One of the most prominent of these being the "John Gesture", or the emphasis of his right finger in many works of art. The most popular idea seems to be that Da Vinci was making a recall of when John used his right index finger to identify Jesus as the Son of God. Sort of a "Remember what I did?" kind of a thing. This has been used many times since in similar scenarios where Jesus is depicted, perhaps just as a way of showing that others in the painting recognized Jesus for what he was.

Originally posted by Myrtales Instinct
There are so many gnostic themes in Leonardo's work, that he probably was a closet gnostic. He was in cahoots with the Medici family, who collected ancient texts. And let's not forget, that two Popes came out of this inner circle. I can't say for sure, but I would bet good money that Leonardo had access to texts such as those found in the Nag Hammadi library, during a time when such texts were labeled heresies. It's also possible Leonardo was a practicing alchemist (which I believe he was).

Leonardo wouldn't exactly need to have access to secret texts, as the Corpus Hermeticum (prompted, I might add, by the Medici family) was first printed during his lifetime.

And if he was an alchemist (is there a source for this?) he would be entirely acquainted with Gnostic beliefs, as the language of Alchemy is the primary vehicle by which Gnosticism survived into the Renaissance.

Originally posted by Eleleth

Originally posted by Myrtales Instinct
It's also possible Leonardo was a practicing alchemist (which I believe he was).

And if he was an alchemist (is there a source for this?) he would be entirely acquainted with Gnostic beliefs, as the language of Alchemy is the primary vehicle by which Gnosticism survived into the Renaissance.

It is a well known fact that Da Vinci had little taste for court practitioners or "magicians", as many alchemists would make self proclomations to be; often peddling cheap potions or cure alls on anyone who would listen. Take this quote:
"The false interpreters of nature declare that quicksilver is the common seed of every metal, not remembering that nature varies the seed according to the variety of the things she desires to produce in the world."

Da Vinci observed nature in his practical application of the sciences, he did not try to alter them in any way. He respected nature for what it was, not what he could create by fiddling with it. Alchemy went against everything he represented in his work.

If Da Vinci was a practicing alchemist, Henry VIII was a one woman man.