It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.


Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.


Pearl Harbor Attack by Japan -- an American Strategy

page: 1
<<   2 >>

log in


posted on Mar, 15 2006 @ 08:54 AM
The americans already knew about the japanese plans of attacking pearl harbour , even before the pearl harbor attack. Their codes were traced well in advance and each of the japanese steps were monitored.


"...everything that the Japanese were planning to do was known to the United States..." ARMY BOARD, 1944
Japanese language version of this page
President Roosevelt (FDR) provoked the attack, knew about it in advance and covered up his failure to warn the Hawaiian commanders. FDR needed the attack to sucker Hitler to declare war, since the public and Congress were overwhelmingly against entering the war in Europe. It was his backdoor to war.

FDR blinded the commanders at Pearl Harbor and set them up by --

denying intelligence to Hawaii (HI)
on November 27 and later, misleading the commanders into thinking negotiations with Japan were continuing to prevent them from realizing the war was on
having false information sent to HI about the location of the Japanese carrier fleet.

Please visit the link provided for the complete story.

The President Roosevelt (FDR) needed a reason to enter the war against hitler. But the opposition from public and the congress was strong. He needed a strong reason to seal their mouths and to proceed with his motive.
The best chance nodded the door when the japanese codes to attack pearl harbor was traced. He used his strategy to his motive.

Related News Links:" target="_blank" class="postlink">ftp:

mod edit, all CAPS in title

[edit on 15-3-2006 by UM_Gazz]

posted on Mar, 15 2006 @ 09:30 AM
This is very old news. ...But you're catching on to how politics works.

IMO - FDR was a great president. I hate to see him demonized - and I do wonder why he is suddenly getting so much negative attention.

I have a sneaky suspicion he was killed because he was going to "out" the presence of a plague caused by WWI vaccinations.

This is the same plague that later mutated to cause Mad Cow and then bird flu.


posted on Mar, 15 2006 @ 10:24 PM
Killed, sofi, please

The man had polio, for God's sake. Admittedly, he battled and had some success in leading a "normal" life. People with polio don't live long lives do they?
I can go along with the possibility of mutations, but not that he was offed.

I'm sure he knew more about Pearl Harbor than he was letting on about

And, his greatness is truly debatable.

posted on Mar, 16 2006 @ 05:00 PM
The US knew the Japanese were likely to attack in December 1941 - but there was no real expectation of an attack on Pearl Harbor, the attack was expected in the Phillipines and other US territories further out in the Pacific. FDR knew a Japanese attack would bring the US into the war, but sacrificing the bulk of the Pacific fleet was a higher price than anyone expected to pay to do so.

At the time, no-one believed Japan was capable of such an audacious and effective attack, or that carrier air power could prove so devastating to a well-protected target like Pearl. Had they paid more attention to what the British did to the Italians at Taranto a year earlier, it might have come as less of a shock. Had the attack been prepared for, it still would have brought the US into WW2, without nearly so high a strategic cost. As it is the US entered the war in the Pacific with it's pants around it's ankles, a situation that FDR certainly didn't want... hence I think the "FDR knew about Pearl Harbor" theories are questionable at best.

[edit on 3/16/06 by xmotex]

posted on Mar, 20 2006 @ 03:07 PM

In June 1940 a New York Doctor* organized a voluntary blood transfusion programme to aid Britain and France. Money was donated to start the campaign and none of the doctors , nurses ,workers or eighteen thousand regular donors were paid salaries or fees. Out of this campaign came new methods of separating, freezing, drying and storing blood plasma. As a result 750 flasks of plasma powder had arrived inHawaii just six weeks before the attack and were ready for immediate use with the casualties.

*John Scudder of New York's Presbyterian Hospital, who worked for John Bush, president of the Blood Transfusion Association

Page 568 , "Blood, tears and folly", by Len Deighton

Well i found this reference a month or so ago when i was reading the book again but my attempts to figure out who this 'John Bush' is have not gone much anywhere just yet.

It's just another one of those striking coincidences ( and there are so many when it comes to PH ) that turns up when you investigate historic events.
Does anyone know how many other American installations received blood plasma in the same time frame?


[edit on 20-3-2006 by StellarX]

posted on Apr, 18 2006 @ 02:53 PM
FDR knew, why did he move out the carriers on silly not needed missions? he got them and the newer CA and DDs out the save them... sacrificed the oldered BBs and CAs and poor men and women to get at hitler

posted on Apr, 22 2006 @ 11:01 AM
I have a friend from Japan and she told me in school there they teach that the U.S knew full well in andavce about the atack on Pearl Harbor and they don't understand why it is taught that it was a sneak atack here in the U.S. The winners write the history.

posted on Apr, 22 2006 @ 11:21 AM
Of COURSE they knew!

There was a guy (I'll have to look into this more to tell you who the guy is) who was warning govt officials that Japan was going to attack at PEARL HARBOR! FDR had secretly agreed with Churchill that the US would get into the war. So, how do you get a country to go to war when most people don't want to? A nice terror attack/act of aggression will do! Then, everybody says "we got hit, git em!"

Sound familiar?

posted on Apr, 28 2006 @ 07:03 AM
I always believe that IMO - FDR is a very great president of the USA !
But if he really allowed Japan attacking us to promote Americans fighting with Japanese, I don't think this is a advisable plan.

Just think about the soldiers who unfortunately died in that intrigue,they also have the right to live ,why did they have to use their life to change a war?

posted on Apr, 28 2006 @ 08:22 AM

Originally posted by mgallun
FDR knew, why did he move out the carriers on silly not needed missions? he got them and the newer CA and DDs out the save them... sacrificed the oldered BBs and CAs and poor men and women to get at hitler

Roosevelt was once Secretary of the Navy. The chances of him doing anything to weaken the US fleet was negligible.
As for silly, not-needed missions, I would hardly call the delivery of fighters to Wake Island a silly mission, I would call it a vital one on the part of the Enterprise. Wake was on the firing line and needed every plane it could get. The orders to send it there came from Kimmel, not FDR. Same with Lexington, which was delivering aircraft to Midway, while Saratoga was on its way back to Pearl from the West Coast.
Lets remember that the importance of carriers was a minority view in the USN, not a majority view. Even in the Imperial Japanese Navy Yamamoto's views were NOT mainstream. I keep hammering this point home - we take it as read these days that carriers are more important than battleships, but in 1941 it was a heretical viewpoint! And even Yamamoto could get it wrong occasionally (Read "Midway - The Battle That Doomed Japan" by Mitsuo Fuchida and Masatake Okumiya to hear what they thought about Yamamoto's dispositions for Midway.)
Roosevelt's staff would have told him that battleships were the most important arm of the Pacific Fleet. He might have thought about Taranto, but the battleship theory was still the mainstream theory. He would NOT have risked that fleet, it's as simple as that.

And personally I think that FDR was the best president you've ever had. Beats the present one by several zillion miles.

posted on Apr, 28 2006 @ 08:44 AM
In my opinion Churchill knew more about the pending attack on Perl Harbor than Roosevelt. Read a book called "The Ultra Secret" by F.W. Winterbotham.

I have heard that the attack on Pearl Harbor ended up being a blessing in disguise for the US Navy. The logic behind this is surprisingly simple. The total number of those killed is right around 2400. Out of these over 1000 were from the USS Arizona alone. If the Japanese hadn't attacked at Pearl Harbor then the US fleet would have gone out against them after their attacks in the Phillipines and at Wake Island. At that time the US fleet was totally outclassed by the Japanese Navy and would have probably been wiped out in a confrontation. This would have resulted in a loss of life that would make the casualties suffered at Pearl look insignifigant. Use the loss of Prince of Wales and Repulse as examples. The other benefit from the attack on Pearl is that these ships were lost in relativly shallow water as a result all but a few were salvaged, overhauled and modernized. This is not counting that as a result the US Navy was forced to rely on its aircraft carriers and submarines to do the brunt of the fighting.

posted on Apr, 28 2006 @ 09:08 AM

Originally posted by JIMC5499
I have heard that the attack on Pearl Harbor ended up being a blessing in disguise for the US Navy. The logic behind this is surprisingly simple. The total number of those killed is right around 2400. Out of these over 1000 were from the USS Arizona alone. If the Japanese hadn't attacked at Pearl Harbor then the US fleet would have gone out against them after their attacks in the Phillipines and at Wake Island. At that time the US fleet was totally outclassed by the Japanese Navy and would have probably been wiped out in a confrontation.

I agree. I think that the Orange plans were complete madness. Sortying out to meet the IJN at the start of the war, when the IJN's pilot base was at its most powerful, and before the first counter to the Zero had even been designed, let alone built, would have led to a slaughter. Kimmel never had the chance to prove himself in battle but it would be fair to say that his fleet was not equipped with the right tools, let alone the right tactical doctrines to stand much of a chance.

posted on Apr, 28 2006 @ 12:35 PM
American History Books are Wrong, what else is new?

Of course they knew. America Blockaded Japan. Japan has no 'natural' resources to speak of. They were not alone. The ABCD net as it was known back then was comprised of American, British, Chinese and the Dutch.

The paste below is from :

"""Japan Under Economic Blockade Japan needed to have sources for petroleum and negotiated with Holland which occupied Indonesia. However, Holland refused. Thus Japan was surrounded by the ABCD net formed by America, Britain, China and the Dutch.

In the spring of 1941, in order to open up the deteriorating American-Japanese relationship, the two sides began discussions in Washington DC. Japan wanted to avoid war, and therefore counted greatly on these negotiations. But the Americans had broken the secret communication code of the Japanese and knew what they were thinking. The Americans directed the talks towards what favored American interests the most.

In July, the Japanese army and navy decided to enter southern Vietnam and take over Saigon. Saigoni became the strategic base from which they can attack American possession Philippines, British possession Singapore and Dutch possession Indonesia. The threatened Americans frozen all Japanese assets in the United States and imposed a total ban on petroleum exports to Japan. Britain and the United States held talks on the Atlantic and issued the Atlantic agreement to express their common views with respect to war. They agreed to delay the war against Japan by two to three months.

But Japan already had the intention to make war on the United States, even as if continued to conduct diplomatic negotiations with the United States. In November, U.S. Secretary of State Hull issued a strongly worded proposal (the Hull document) that demanded Japan to withdraw unconditionally from China. The Japanese government believed that this demand wanted Japan to surrender to the United States, and therefore decided to go to war.

Initial Victories At 7am on December 8, 1941, """

posted on May, 5 2006 @ 10:22 AM
*This post removed due to violation of terms and conditions of use.*

[edit on 5-5-2006 by dbates]

posted on May, 5 2006 @ 10:53 AM
Hello all,

I was 8 years old when Pearl Harbor was attacked. And just like the movies, we all played war games, and shot at the B-24's with our toy machine guns as they flew overhead (piloted by woman fliers) on their way from the Bomber Plant in Ypsilanti, Michigan, to New York.

In those days we'd line up in the halls at school in the morning, and we'd turn to the flag and give our Pledge of Allegiance.

(along with my wife) I still consider it an honor to Pledge my Allegiance to the flag.


posted on May, 5 2006 @ 06:00 PM
Oh, for crying out loud :

Lets deny some ignorance here

The Americans already knew about the Japanese plans of attacking pearl harbour

No they didn’t – there was intel that the Japanese planning “ something “ , but there was no credible threat to pearl --- the Philippines were seen as a far more likely target

Their codes were traced well in advance

No they were not – the CONTEXT of the winds message was not known , the US knew it was a threat , but not what , when or where it referred to .

You should read up on the history of MAJIC and the differences between the naval and diplomatic codes .

and each of the Japanese steps were monitored

No they were not , please do not make crap up , just because you want it to be true

There was NO r/t transmissions from the attacking force – the Japanese logs and allied intercepts demonstrate this

The only radio intercepts made by allied listening posts DO NOT correspond to any positions / dates combination occupied by ships of the attacking force

The chief radio op of the AGAKI was deliberately left behind – as his “ fist “ was so distinctive [ likened to a mule kicking his key ] and he along with others created radio traffic to create the impression that the fleet was in the inland sea

The destroyer WARD was the first USN unit to report a sighting of the Japanese – when she sighted a submarine off Hawaii

FDR knew, why did he move out the carriers on silly not needed missions?

Those “ SILLY “, and “ NOT NEEDED “ missions , were infact VITAL ferry missions to midway and wake , the 3rd carrier was underway to san Diego for refit

And besides why – in your fantasies Do you credit FDR with the ability to foresee the the pre eminent role of the carrier , when the BB was still regarded as king in USN circles

Read up the “ fleet problems reports “ for the 30s , they are very interesting and show clearly what the USN thinking of carrier ops was

Lastly – ENTERPRISE was returning to pearl – and delayed by bad weather , she should have made it back by the 6th ,

And of course , it was not FDR who ordered the movements of the carriers – it was the navy chiefs – and these movements were , as shown required for operational needs , not

he got them and the newer CA and DDs out the save them.

What ???? come on , fess up – you are making this up as you go

Please cite which cruisers and destroyers were absent t pearl – and why ?

This ORBAT for the USN pacific fleet details where EVERY ship was on 07 , DEC 1941 :" target="_blank" class="postlink" rel="nofollow">fleet_orbat

The bottom line is :

If the US knew of the attack in advance , then meeting the attacks with a robust and vigorous defence would have have been justified and STILL been seen as Japanese aggression and treachery . There is no logical reason for “ sacrifice “

The US losses would have been lighter , and the Japanese losses far heavier

As for the Germans and FDRs desires for war – it was the GERMANS who actually declared war , on dec 10th – how the hell did FDR “ force “ Hitler into war at his bidding ???

Conspiracy theorists credit FDR and Churchill with decisions they has no hand in , the ability to “ force “ their enemies to do their will and mystic insight into matters they had no means of divining

posted on May, 7 2006 @ 05:44 PM
Of course the USA gov. knew Japan would attack PH. We left them no choice but to do so when we barred their way from reaching vital petroleum reserves. We had no need to break their codes, we had broken their supply lines.

As for FDR being a great president, he certainly was if you're a communist or socialist. He did more to socialize the USA than any other single president, and not coincidentally came into power at just the moment when the cold, hungry American people were ready to accept anything that promised survival. His #1 bag-man, Alger Hiss, presided over the giving away of half of Europe to Communist slavery and was later found out to be a spy and traitor. Hiss also wrote the UN charter BTW.

I recommend that everyone interested in the subject read Curtis B. Dall's "FDR, My Exploited Father-In-Law".

posted on May, 8 2006 @ 06:09 AM
Sigint did their job, the approach route of Kido Butai was known to oni, or whatever they were called in the day.

The coincidences are mind boggling, first the pac fleet was ordered to PH (from the west coast), where they were ordered to conserve fuel (=stay in port), while the airforce received a sabotage warning only days before the attack, which meant crowding all aircraft into easily observable spots - ideal to thwart commando ops, but easy target practice for strafing and bombing attackers.

Source 1

Source 2

PS: these guys basically KNEW that carriers were enough to win the war, contrary to popular belief. the part of the axis powers remains to be adressed though, their blunders remain inexplicable and if cross-ties via money are well known, why not investigate their strategy, too?

posted on Apr, 6 2009 @ 07:54 AM
reply to post by StellarX

The Hawiian Medical Association had a webpage up refuting this myth. The plans for medical emergencies were mostly "home grown", not directed by Washington, and had been going on long before the attack.

posted on Apr, 6 2009 @ 07:56 AM
reply to post by Long Lance

"Sigint" never detected the Kido Butai. The Japanese proceeded until total radio silence. If they needed to talk to another ship they used flags or blinker lights. The transmit keys for the shipboard radios were locked in safes. The keys on the air planes were wedged open with wads of paper. (They didn't lock up the plane keys because they might have to go into battle at any point on the trip.)

The Japanese have repeatedly confirmed that they didn't transmit, so any theory based on radio detection is still-born.

top topics

<<   2 >>

log in