Some nice high res pics of the J-10.

Originally posted by GrOuNd_ZeRo
Weren't there rumors of trust vectored engines on the J-10?

Those alleged "rumors" remained rumors being there is no thrust vestoring engine readily available for service in the J-10, nor will there be anytime soon, despite what aeronautics.ru and other similar sites wish to speculate wishfully upon.

Wait for the 'Super-10s' and the AL-31FN M1s.





seekerof

[edit on 18-3-2006 by Seekerof]

The AL-31FN is the AL-31FN M1.

Somebody closed that thread where we were discussing the TVC capabilities of the Su -30 MKI.
I feel this is the right place to close the issue rahter than open a new thread on it or tick it in some irrelevant thread

CW you said it was 2D and you qouted some para from this link, but look again carefully:

I think this is what you quoted:

Al-31FP builds on the Al-37FU with the capability to vector in 2 planes i.e. thrust can be directed side-ways also. The nozzles of the MKI are capable of deflecting 32 degrees in the horizontal plane and 15 degrees in the vertical plane. This is done by angling them inwards by 15 degrees inwards, which produces a cork-screw effect and thus enhancing the turning capability of the aircraft.

This clearly indidcates that the Al-31FP can vector in 2 planes. That IMHO IS 3 dimensional TVC in TWO planes as the planes are mutually perpendicular to each other, while the AL-31FU gives 2D TVC in 1 plane.


Consider a normal 3 axis cartesian system with the Y axis extending from the origin towards your right, the Z axis extending upwards and the X axis protruding right out of your monitor from the origin towards you.

For reference:

Cartesian System

Now as per the above quoted section, the AL-31FP provides 15 degrees angular vectoring capability in the vertical plane, i.e. in this case the X-Z plane.
It also provides 32 degrees angular vectoring in the horizontal plane,which is the X-Y plane here.

Although from the pics on this site I think its the other way around:

32 Degrees in the vertical X-Z plane and 15 degrees in the horizontal X-Y plane, because vertical vectoring(that's what the F-22 has) is visibly/logically simpler to engineer than hort. vectoring.

Whatever be the correct figures, the point is that the each nozzle of the AL-31FP can thus swathe a solid elliptical conic(of above mentioned angular dimensions) independant of the other nozzle.

Although I am still unable to envision the 'corkscrew effect' they were talking about..

Now since thats settled, lets talk about the the rumored TVC on the J-10..


[edit on 19-3-2006 by Daedalus3]

3D TVC is the ability to move 360 degrees. Whilst the MKI engine does sway inwards like you said it only does it up and down eg 2D.


And its not the rumoured AL-31FN TVC its the confirmed one. here is a visual



EDIT: Damn html codes

[edit on 19-3-2006 by chinawhite]

Originally posted by chinawhite
3D TVC is the ability to move 360 degrees. Whilst the MKI engine does sway inwards like you said it only does it up and down eg 2D.


[edit on 19-3-2006 by chinawhite]

3D is is the ability to swathe solid angles which I just proved..
Up and down(vertical plane), and side to side(hort plane)
15 degrees in one plane and 32 in the other..
Now whether the hort angles(presumed to be 32 degrees) are +/-16 degrees or just -32 degrees or just +32 degrees is not clear but it is cdefinitely movement along the hort plane.
Couple that with movement in the vert plane...
Thats 3D alright.
Solid Geometry 101.
AL-31FP is a 3D vectorable engine..

360 Degrees doesn't mean 3D.
You can vector 360 in one plane (2D) also but that would be an engineering impossibility(also disasterous I might add )for any conventional fixed wing a/c.
Independant 360 degrees rotation in two mutually perpnedicular planes is the true sense of '3D' which would give a soild angle swathe of 4Pi but in the realm of a/c TVC that is a obvious impossibility..

Thrust Vectoring Controls.....


It doesn't mean move coherent to the actual plane but refers to the movement on the nozzel. eg 2D refers to a movement of up and down. while 3D refers to the ability to move in all directions. like the different dimensions.


The article even says that by stating the cork screw effect. The engines are angled inwards so it seems to screw in like a cork

eg


The blue lines represent the only movement capable of the MKI engines and we call that a 2D engine.

hmmm..maybe you've got a point, but still the axes you outlined definitely give more manueverability than an engine with 'up-down' movement only and that too is 2D.

Your model could also portray the +/- 32 deg and +/- 15 degrees ability, but then even at 'level' position the nozzles would point inwards and that would be unwanted.
Maybe we should get more inputs on this..
new thread..