Many Masons are quite simply in the dark.

a reply to: jayfosters
Uh huh…or maybe you need to get a new TV.

Freemasons are held under the law, same as anyone. Then again, this is all supposition and theory.

Oh yay. Another Non-Mason telling actual Masons that they don't know the truth about Freemasonry. Smh.

originally posted by: KSigMason
a reply to: jayfosters
Uh huh…or maybe you need to get a new TV.

Freemasons are held under the law, same as anyone. Then again, this is all supposition and theory.

So your TV being fuzzy the other day wasn't a sign?

Just like in any corporations, most of the people in the business really have no idea what's going on.

In a corporation, only the "C" letter level people and Board of Directors, as well as maybe a few department VPs really, really know what's going on.

I bet it's the same with the Masons.

a reply to: babybunnies
Having sat as a Grand officer and as a member/officer of the constituent levels, there are no real "secrets" kept at that level. For the most part, the "upper levels" are pretty transparent about the decisions made and the administration of that particular body or jurisdiction.

Comparing corporations to Freemasonry is comparing apples and oranges.

It works because of compartmentalization, where do you think the CIA and whatnot got it from? I'll bet that 97-98% of the 'Masons' don't have a clue, they are exactly what they claim to be, normal people. Why include them then? Because these people will then defend the organization from any and all questionings, and/or investigations FREE OF CHARGE! And they'll do it WILLINGLY. It's really quite brilliant. Too bad most at the top are seriously bad apples. They could do some real good, if they weren't too busy trying to run other people's lives, that is.

originally posted by: Chronogoblin
Too bad most at the top are seriously bad apples. They could do some real good, if they weren't too busy trying to run other people's lives, that is.

Who are these 'bad apples at the top'? If you have this much information, you must have names right? What level were you when you found the 'truth'?

a reply to: Chronogoblin
How is it "97-98% of the 'Masons' don't have a clue", but you presume to make such a statement as a non-Mason? Doesn't that seem weird?

It's not about defending against "any and all questionings", it's about sticking to facts.

Who at the top are bad apples?

originally posted by: KSigMason
a reply to: Chronogoblin
How is it "97-98% of the 'Masons' don't have a clue", but you presume to make such a statement as a non-Mason? Doesn't that seem weird?

It's not about defending against "any and all questionings", it's about sticking to facts.

Who at the top are bad apples?

All I have to say to you is, if you REALLY think, that as a NOBODY Mason, that you know what's up, your severely mistaken. You don't have to be an insider to understand how things work. Apparently, you just have to NOT be a Mason...

originally posted by: Chronogoblin

All I have to say to you is, if you REALLY think, that as a NOBODY Mason...

And what about us Masons who are actually not 'nobody' Masons?

originally posted by: network dude
Who are these 'bad apples at the top'? If you have this much information, you must have names right? What level were you when you found the 'truth'?

It's too bad you use your God-given intelligence for jokes. Any one with enough time and energy can see who the bosses are, only people with something to hide have something to fear.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

If you were a 'somebody' (highly doubtful considering), then you wouldn't advertise. The people with real power don't need to tell you they have it.

originally posted by: Chronogoblin
If you were a 'somebody' (highly doubtful considering), then you wouldn't advertise.

But I am on both counts.

My god father is a 33rd degree of the SFRM and he is one of the nicest men I know, certainly neither all powerful nor oppressive.

They have secrets, they don't share. Some of the members have done things outside of the masons that aren't on the up and up and there may be groups of members that have shared interests outside of the common cause. But with an estimate membership of 5 million of course you are going to have that.

I joke with him that he goes there to drink the blood of goats, but I have asked him seriously if there is anything nefarious afoot and his honest answer is no.

I think the idea that there is an upper echelon of nefarious masons is incorrect, there may be an upper echelon in society that is nefarious and also masons.

a reply to: Chronogoblin

Are you planning on answering the question or just telling us if we REALLY think about it blah blah

Who are the top, bad apple, Masons that I apparently am unaware of their doings?

originally posted by: Chronogoblin

originally posted by: network dude
Who are these 'bad apples at the top'? If you have this much information, you must have names right? What level were you when you found the 'truth'?

It's too bad you use your God-given intelligence for jokes. Any one with enough time and energy can see who the bosses are, only people with something to hide have something to fear.

So you have no idea who the "top masons" are? LOL, I didn't think. you could. Just an exercise in futility. I 'realize that I am either not high enough to "know" or I am lying to protect the "secrets". So either way, my words as a past master and 32nd Scottish rite mason mean much less than yours as a keyboard warrior (2nd degree).

a reply to: Chronogoblin
Who says I'm a "NOBODY Mason"? I'm somebody and I know exactly where I sit within the Fraternity. I don't claim to know everything about everything, but I do have a fair understanding about what goes on at various levels of Freemasonry.

What is apparent is your lack of understanding of the hierarchy and leadership of Freemasonry and how it all interconnects.

a reply to: Chronogoblin
We know exactly who our leaders are; it's not some hidden hand.

We don't have anything to hide, but we have the right to privacy.

a reply to: Chronogoblin
We never said we "had it", you've started out by saying none of us here have it. You don't know who we are and it is clear you have no real knowledge of Freemasonry. Your arguments thus far have been a combination of ignorant assumption and illogical arguments.

I highly doubt you have a clue about how the Lodges interact with one another, how they interact within a district/province, and how they interact with Grand Lodges; how Grand Lodges interact with one another; how the various concordant/concordant/side bodies at all levels interact with one another; and how the concordant/concordant/side bodies interact with the ~175 Grand Lodges around the world. I doubt you could explain how officers are selected, the authority of the officers, the legislative authority of the body at large, and so forth.

a reply to: circuitsports
SFRM? I'm not familiar with that acronym.

The Morality Clause... a thing for children... that's how they're in the dark.

a reply to: network dude

Your 'rank' means less than nothing. You know nothing, and never have. Otherwise you'd have a lot less to say.

a reply to: KyoZero

IF your question wasn't facetious, then perhaps I'd deign to answer. But, if your too lazy to look for yourself, then you have no one else to blame. Do your own work. Not like you or anyone else really cares what the answer is, you've already made up your mind, and are doing EXACTLY what I posted. Defending the organization with zeal, and mindless autonomy. Congrats, proved me right. Didn't take long either.