Faked moon landings on next Friday's show?

The point that your psychic reading of Il Papa was absolute tommyrot, twaddle, fiddlesticks, pish and poppycock... obviously.

Now don't go jumping down my throat, I already voted you WATS.

[edit on 7-4-2006 by Astyanax]

vitalij

I am sorry my disbelief has caused you so much anger and frustration.

Yes I did give a 1000 mile tolerance / accuracy but surely a human with your mighty powers would admit south of London a bit vague. Is not the South Pole south of London?? Please tell me that you didn't get the location from my flippant "slip" about "cockney sparrow"??

Regarding destiny and predictions: It was obvous from your post that you cannot give accurate information from my past. If you can't tell me about what has already occured you got no chance of telling me about what is going to happen. Unless you are claiming that you are living time backwards?

Sex change? Maybe thats where the confusion is. Your amazing powers are focusing on some ladyboy somewhere and they have had the traffic accident you mention. Not me.

No sex change. No crash. No brain damage...other than your nonsense doing my noggin in...

I will reach my destiny happily or otherwise without taking notice of cranks like you.

I accept that there is difficulty in the fact that English is not your first language and that has made some of your posting confusing.

As for approaching troubles. Well as all the other info was wrong, what do you think I think of your free unsolicited advice?? Yes correct. Bravo Sierra.

Look destiny is destiny. Its going to happen. If you really could predict the future what would be the point? If it is the future you cant change it can you?? If someone knew that they were to die on 6th July 2008 would their life be any happier as they got closer?? No...Just get on with life and live for today. I have known people who have died in their sleep. Your end, my end anyones end could be an hour away. Do I go to bed wondering if I will wake tomorrow?? No. Because I go to bed tired....totally knackered from living life hard today....well except for the time I waste reading certain nonsense.

You say you are just passing info as a conduit?? I would say the conduit needs some repair. Only you know if it needs a plumber, an engineer or a psychiatrist.

By the way you did not guess my initials or sex either.

One more thing:


What the hell do you mean?? I have no psychic perception of the world. There aint no psychic perception of anything. Something that doesn't exist can't have a perception!! IMHO. The whole psychic gig is dillusional and your little foray into it has proven it even further to myself.

You are so wrong about me, that I would have to have very large doubts about your statement about the fake moon landings IMHO. Bummer for you. Sorry......

But really does it matter. There are more pressing issues on this planet.

Live long my friend

From a school bullied, nail nibbling, mentally inferior, brain damaged, ladyboy, from the South Pole.

Dear Il Papa,

The gist of this my reply to you is one big “Thank you!” Thank you so much!

I didn’t even suspect which kind of effect the impudence you have shown in this social chat could possibly have on me. After your brazen letters I received so much power and confidence for future social occasions that I didn’t even expect, thank you so much! Prior to that, in communicating with other people I would normally stick to the role of rather unpretentious and modest fellow, to show some extra respect to the counterpart, regardless of whether he or she deserves it or not. But after your cheeky posts I am no longer that much shy and I can only express my sincere appreciation and congratulate you for the job well done! Thank you!

Even though I wasn’t really planning to discuss your idle curiosity requests, for such a special occasion I guess an exception can be made. So, briefly back to what has being discussed with you, purely to clarify some matters.

Your location. As your mental abilities often don’t allow you to cope even with simple tasks (and you get carried away to the South Pole), I will once again explain to you what “south of London” was supposed to mean in our conversation. Since you wanted 1000 miles accuracy, my answer would place you within southern part of a circle with radius of 500 miles and centre being London's central business district. No, I didn’t get that information from your “cockney sparrow” words. I didn’t bother looking at the map (for I know which one of the big cities is closest to you on a global map). If I would have a look on a fine scale map of the UK– and I had no intention to do so, I could have pinpointed your location precisely, but I already had enough data for the purposes of my message. I have mentioned previously that I don’t see any reason to dwell into details (like checking exact name on a locality map or figuring out precise geographic coordinates) that to merely satisfy your idle curiosity. People asking ESP-operator this kind of questions normally have to pay for these services, why do you think I would bother to check some local geographical names for free in your case? The same applies to stupidly repeated questions about your initials, and I have already explained that to you earlier: ask your neighbours, friends or relatives about your name if you don’t know it. I don’t think you can afford paying even an average psychic to figure out your initials - even for the sake of entertainment, let alone paying for my individually-tailored, ESP-based, exquisite services. Got it? Or it’s also too difficult for you?

You are just somebody who came for freebies, and in your last message you again, without paying attention to my earlier message, dare to dully ask about your initials and sex. Wasn’t that clear from the fact that you were regularly bitten and shown disrespect since childhood? Think logically, who else would still be asking after that about his sex, if not someone after a sex change or merely a fool? No, it’s not some lady boy, it’s you I am talking about. I can get many things done, like solving unsolved crimes online and heaps of other things (privately, for money), but what makes you think that I am here to serve freebies for you, to satisfy your idle curiosity? In moon landing thread, where “cranks like me” express their point of view on the main subject of the thread: moon landing?

.../Part2

Next. Just think logically: would it be “safe or risky” for a “psychic” to tell a stranger on the internet that he has a cataract or something like that in his eyes? What are the chances for statistically average person in front of the computer screen on a popular internet forum to have such vision problems? Perhaps close to 100% in your opinion? And “old cockney sparrow” wasn’t impressed! – telling me something about getting left/right eye wrong. Does it matter for me? I saw a flea into the microscope and it had eye problems – that was enough to say for the occasion. But you didn’t appreciate that and continue flapping the gums. OK, I also occasionally watch entertainment programs.

The accident about 6 years ago. What was probed is what has been imprinted inside you (and therefore is directly related to your future). And even if “physical” impact on a car didn’t take place, this part of a second you were pushing down the brakes avoiding the collision into another vehicle (probably that of a public transport, like a tram) had such a profound effect on your brains (slightly turning them into scrambled eggs) that it’s affecting your life big time, back then you got scared and this fear is sitting inside you ever since. You may lie by not admitting it, just as you may deny having constant problems with the peers since childhood – it’s all up to you. (But again, a logically thinking reader may well think that you are simply not telling the truth…) And if you consider visiting a psychiatrist, that would also be a logical step – do pay a visit. (Even though I don’t like very much all the so-called doctors).

In fact if you really want to publicly show off, you may set up some kind of a trusted task force - a group of independent witnesses, who will be reporting here what was happening with you, your relatives and people close to you. And then, especially being in the centre of attention of internet audience, you may start realizing on you own experience how scenarios written for biorobots work. Perhaps then you will venture making different conclusions about ESP ‘mumbo jumbo’. And maybe then my free advise will be appreciated, when it will be sort of late. May be.

With Deepest Gratitude,

Vitalij

-----------
"Earth - the planet of biorobots"
www.godswhip.info...

Everyone needs to get back on topic and stop slamming other posters.

Vitalij

I note you added a two part reply. I have not read it. A quick speed read made me realise that it is more "clap trap" and need to comment no further. I refer all to our previous exchange. May I suggest that comments like my needing a psychiatrist etc. do not help your cause. You do not come across as a noble, stable, altruistic being. If I were cosmic consciousness I would look for another channel / conduit.

Also I have no intention of being the centre of attention of internet audience, but I suggest you have....type in vitalij into google and you will get many things maybe a recipe for fruitcake. Type in il papa and there will be nothing about me.
I am a shy, private human being. That is why I hide behind my "nom de plume" il papa. You took my disbelief in your "skills" as a challenge and failed. I knew there was no chance of you naming me or obtaining any personal information.

You a modest fellow? You sir are the one that has an upcoming net talk radio show, not I. Who really wants to be the centre of attention?? If you really are to be part of net talk radio then its time to stop listening methinks. Either way best of luck to you.

It is possible one of us needs a psychiatrist, our opinions will differ as to who that's all. If any of my posts has aided you in any way I am glad for you. However, the effect is not reciprocated.

The crux of the moon landing issue is quite exquisite is it not? I cant prove the USA did land on the moon and you cant prove they didn't. So where does that leave us. Unsupported statements and conjecture? Your belief that the universe talks to you, my belief that it doesn't. I believe that whatever the truth there is a yin to a yang. Perhaps we need each other, not sure who is yin or who is yang though.

Despite all this "slamming" you still have not explained to a very simple human (me) how a non lunar landing would manifest as new plant species here on earth?

Wishing you well. Light, love and healing to you and your world.

From a school bullied, nail nibbling, mentally inferior, brain damaged, lady-boy, from the South Pole.


Nygdan

Yes boss. I could not agree more. The whole point of the thread is faked moon landings.
I merely indicated that I found the Vitalij evidence / conjecture / delusion incredulous. I offered the opportunity to prove their "powers" in a sceptical, admittedly flippant sense. I did not expect or ask for a "freebie" but the arrogance and self-belief of Vitalij meant that he offered up his advice / perceptions and has failed totally and completely to prove 'owt in my opinion. I think I am the best judge of what has or has not happened in my life, not he or his mumbo jumbo.
He then comes back with a two post essay.

Okay the only people that will know for sure that the USA did land on the moon will be the future generations, I doubt if any of us reading these boards today will know. That's not unsubstantiated mumbo jumbo but just an honest, humble opinion.

I am not sure I am interested anymore, anyhow. There is more important stuff out there on the planet of the bisexual-robots!!

Thanks for getting the thread back on track.

Back to faked moon landings. The methods of investigation I was referring to when claiming that a man has never stepped on the moon can be looked at as analysis of energetic fields around events discussed in this thread.

It is well known (to many scientists at least) that a man has energetic fields, like astral one. Any object, for example a piece of a furniture or a coin, inherits or has traces of astral fields of people who owned it or had something to do with it. Consequently, a sensitive enough “ESP operator” can identify the origin of a coin, or will know about people who owned it etc. Another example is paintings: there are many fake paintings shown in museums (in Louvre, for example) as the originals. However, one can fake the painting, but not the genuine astral field of the painter – this energetic fingerprint is unique.

Obviously, if one considers the whole spaceship clearly there were many people involved into preparations for the missions. It was stuffed with various astral fields and was occupying a significant spot in informational fields. (Just add here all the media fuss, apart from various engineering, accounting etc. tasks). Would human astral fields appear on the Moon, that would create a perturbation large enough that can be registered on the Earth. A moon is a massive object transmitting information to the Earth with high and low tides. The tides do not contain any information of a man stepping on the moon. Yes, people were in the outer space – but not on the moon.

It is also well known (even to a general public) that propaganda exercises are not uncommon in modern history (one may insert here the origins of war in Iraq for example).

vitalij

Very interesting notion. Surely mans energetic field would be an insignificant proportion of the total Lunar field, especially
given the distance? Do not all fields radiate in an inverse square sort of way?? I can see an arguement that the additional mass
of two men and machinery on the moon would increase its mass, thence its gravity. Theoretically, with sensitive enough equipment you could perhaps measure the difference. But I dont think were there yet.

I would see a similar problem with the method you state. Given the total amount of energy on this planet or perhaps just in your locale the minor perturbations would be hard to detect. Surely you would have to inspect the whole of the planet to find any changes? We are only finding now that many species of plant and animal die out every day. Could not the creation of new life here on earth be easily missed? Is it possible that it manifests as a species not dying out?

Supposing there is such a thing as psychic ability, ESP or whatever if you knew the energy signature of the relevant astronaut I can see you could, theoretically, trace his whereabouts on earth but surely the moon is too distant for such sensitivity?

Either way I still believe the USA got there. The radar reflector placed there, that is still used today to demonstrate that the
moon is receding 3.8 cms a year (if I remember right) and Jodrell Bank following the ships path there and back is enough for me, for now. I know many conspiracy theorists will find an arguement to prove these fake. But there is more proof if I need it. I would give some of the evidence of fake a little more credence if some of the main advocats of these theories were not making a lot of dosh, from there "evidence". I do not include you, vitalij amongst these.

I believe all evidence should be freely available for peer review. I will always be suspicious of anyone who asks for money upfront before revealing the evidence. I think we all know who I mean.

Many thanks

OK, so if the whole thing was staged, wouldn't NASA get actors that would act excited and animated the way you would expect? Any TV movie has people being believable enough... it's not hard to find actors to play parts. Also if the whole thing was done on a movie set they could have made it look a whole hell of a lot better! In 1969 I was 12, and I watched every minute of TV coverage on the moon missions...

There's actually a LOT of weird information about the moon that NASA can't explain, but made available to the public. Some scientist think the moon is hollow... which makes no sense from the standpoint that it is a natural planetoid. To test some of this NASA recorded the seismic reading when they dropped the LM back to the moon. The moon rung like a bell for up to an hour. Why would they even publish such stuff if they hadn't been there? The last thing they want is info they have to debunk! Read "Alien Agenda" by Jim Marrs for a good recounting of the hollow moon.

(from Moon Facts )

The moon’s mean density is 3.34 gm/cm3 (3.34 times an equal volume of water) whereas the Earth’s is 5.5. What does this mean? In 1962, NASA scientist Dr. Gordon MacDonald stated, "If the astronomical data are reduced, it is found that the data require that the interior of the moon is more like a hollow than a homogeneous sphere." Nobel chemist Dr. Harold Urey suggested the moon’s reduced density is because of large areas inside the moon where is "simply a cavity." MIT’s Dr. Sean C. Solomon wrote, "the Lunar Orbiter experiments vastly improved our knowledge of the moon’s gravitational field . . . indicating the frightening possibility that the moon might be hollow." In Carl Sagan’s treatise, Intelligent Life in the Universe, the famous astronomer stated, "A natural satellite cannot be a hollow object."

On November 20, 1969, the Apollo 12 crew jettisoned the lunar module ascent stage causing it to crash onto the moon. The LM’s impact (about 40 miles from the Apollo 12 landing site) created an artificial moonquake with startling characteristics—the moon reverberated like a bell for more than an hour. This phenomenon was repeated with Apollo 13 (intentionally commanding the third stage to impact the moon), with even more startling results. Seismic instruments recorded that the reverberations lasted for three hours and twenty minutes and traveled to a depth of twenty-five miles, leading to the conclusion that the moon has an unusually light—or even no—core.

This, and other anomalies, is why we went to the moon.

Now if the astronauts seemed nervous, just read up on some of the things they (and others after them) supposedly saw, and think about them being debriefed and coached about what to say and not say! All the Apollo missions were paid for, yet they canceled the program before the end. Why is that?

According to whom?

That's the biggest load of double talk I ever heard! Sheesh! No logic at all there.

The moon sends no information in the tides. That's just gravitational pull. And I suppose you, and only you, can talk to the tides?

And who tells you man was in space? Dust?

And actually the more interesting facts is the large amount of rocks brought back to Earth from the moon don't make any sense to scientist. They are too old. Figure that one out!

The moon is far older than previously expected. Maybe even older than the Earth or the Sun. The oldest age for the Earth is estimated to be 4.6 billion years old; moon rocks were dated at 5.3 billion years old, and the dust upon which they were resting was at least another billion years older.

If this was all faked then all the information brought back would fit into the script, and would agree with what science already thinks is the facts... not a bunch of stuff they can't explain that makes them look bad!

NEXT!



[edit on 10-5-2006 by DavidRavenMoon]

[edit on 10-5-2006 by DavidRavenMoon]

Exactly. Surely the aura (the proper name for the "energy field") of every living thing on Earth would over whelm three human energy fields 15 billion inches from Earth!

And how do we know that the moon is 15 billion inches from Earth? Because there were five Earth-based telescopes firing laser beams at mirrors placed on the moon's Earth-facing hemisphere by three teams of Apollo astronauts and by one of the unmanned Soviet Lunakhod missions. The telescopes are located in Texas, Hawaii, France, Germany and Australia.

In the experiment, laser radiation launched toward the moon from one of the telescopes on Earth bounces off one of the lunar mirrors and returns to the same telescope about 2.6 seconds later. Scientists determine the moon's distance by measuring as precisely as possible the time it takes laser pulses to make the round trip. This is called laser ranging.

So how was that accomplished when no one was on the moon to place the mirrors?

I think it would be possible by some psychics... but that's as it was happening. I haven't heard any psychics (including myself) come forth and say it didn't happen.

I have good senses for these things, and I watched it happening, at the time, and I felt it was real.

Now the question is for someone to prove it didn't happen. I haven't seen anyone do that. I've read all the stuff by people who are not scientist and try to explain why it makes no sense to them... yet we can go and handle some moon rocks, and have them independently analyzed as not having come from the Earth.

That's concrete evidence! Pun intended!


[edit on 10-5-2006 by DavidRavenMoon]

Bull pucky... the moon is NOT a natural object and has no relationship to the Earth.



Now why would such a thing happen? It wouldn't. The moon has nothing to do with plants, and isn't even alive. Plus, we don't even know every plant on this planet, do we?

There are plants and animals that humans have never even seen. This was just demonstrated recently with the discovery of new plants and animals on a remote mountain.

So are you going to tell me you know about every single plant on this great world? There could have been a hundred changes and we would never even know.

Get real. If you are that good, tell me what color shirt I am wearing.



Well saying things are this way or that, and not being able to demonstrate it.... how convenient!

And you are wrong.. that's not how things are at all. We are all of the same energy field. The difference is just an illusion. Not only that, but this physical realm is only the tip of the iceberg. But unfortunately we humans have been rendered unable to see the rest...

Go see the movie "What the Bleep Do We Know? (Down the Rabbit Hole)" and then come back and talk to us.

So much drivel on the internet...

[edit on 10-5-2006 by DavidRavenMoon]

Where did you get that from? Il Papa, try to analyse your own requests. You don’t even bother trying to understand what others are saying, let alone all the grammar mistakes in your messages. Difficulties doing mental exercises? Or you were so obsessed with seeking public support to expose this "nutcase" Vitalij? Man on the mission, I understand…

After all the impudence you have demonstrated addressing me, do you also expect me to address your “smart “ statements a la “Do not all fields radiate in an inverse square sort of way??” I do have a Physics degree from a top university, do you?

One fool may produce so many questions that one thousand sages will be unable to answer them.

I have already mentioned that you will get your (individual) evidences, and in fact I was suggesting to make them “freely available for peer review”. I hope you survive and learn something in biorobot technology. All the best!

Vitalij

PS Vitalij is a common Russian name, if you couldn’t figure that out even after numerous google searches.


[edit on 5-11-2006 by Vitalij]

DavidRavenMoon, you are missing a keyword ‘man’ in my messages: a man has never stepped on the moon, not even once. Yes, unmanned missions like Lunokhod did take place and the samples of lunar rocks were brought back to Earth, and so forth.


I wouldn’t suggest you making idle curiosity questions, it is not a good practice from spiritual safety point of view. You can, though, ask me a couple of personalized questions, for example you can ask me to make a remote medical diagnostics of your friends or relatives. It will be free. Under condition that it will be on the internet radio (or in the thread I have started) as a free “Psychic reading”.


David Icke (see a neighbouring thread made prior to his latest interview on nettalkradio.co.uk), saw a former British prime minister turning his eyes into reptile-style black, and he felt it was real. You probably will agree that other people may sense things you don’t sense, for example the comet of Nostradamus in 1999. Did you sense that? Can you agree that it might be possible that someone can sense something that you (now) can not?

Vitalij

[edit on 5-11-2006 by Vitalij]

repeated post oops

[edit on 11-5-2006 by Il Papa]

Vitalij

Do you actually read your posts??

I must admit some here are having trouble knowing what you are on about but I must confess that I did not include you amongst them.

From page 2 first post in answer to a query from Kruel:


and then page 3 post 14:



It is no wonder an unintelligent simpleton like me cant get it?? Derrrr....

Your continual vilification and abuse of myself does you no good on a public forum.
I do not need to have a mission to discredit the "nutcase" as you put it, because you sir, are doing a good enough job on your own....or is the cosmos helping you.

If you really believe you are a conduit for the cosmological consciousness then I would stop it for your own mental health. It is telling you porkies.

You gave the world my life story. I did not ask for this but you done it. You were wrong, period. Totally. You then predict or threaten (which is it Vitalij??) me with a car crash. Well based on your performance so far, I reckon I could drive on the wrong-side of the expressway with a blindfold on in perfect safety.

Yes I know Vitalij is a common name but not "translator of the Earth Planet of the Bio Robots" and godswhip. I trust the name does not translate as village idiot??

I hope you are keeping well. Ever thought of a career in stand up?? I will be your agent but I want more than 10 per cent.

Oh and please write, the cosmic consciousness knows the address. If they let you use something sharper than crayons that is.

Basically you are saying the USA did not land on the moon because a voice in your head told you so.

I say they did because a bloke down the pub told me so.

Oh and the telemetry is a good guide, too.

Oh it has just occurred to me. Is the motive for your denying the USAs efforts regarding the moon just because they beat your countrymen there??? Surely not?
You cant be that emotionally immature? Oh wait there a mo, looking at your posts regarding me, I may have a point..MMMM!! *Thinks really hard for a simple plebe*

Your friend

il papa.

DavidRavenMoon

Nice info. I forgot about the bell ring thing.

Yes I too remember the event, on tv of course.

I will be looking into "What the Bleep Do We Know?". Yes the moon is indeed a puzzle.
It is sometimes pointed out about the many coincidences of its size and position allowing many of the processes and cycles that led to the environment, thence to life. Was it by chance or by design?? (If design, whose design?).

Regarding the landings. The detractors will always come up with alternative realities. The laser reflectors were perfectly placed and aligned remotely by robots e.g.
The problem is some of these people wouldnt believe in it even if you took them there. "Oh it was a clever movie set". Of course some of todays sophisticated effects may cause some to believe that we could simulate the effect of such a journey, theme park style, anyway.

All we have is data and photos and the human mind has to interpret this, like all info. This I see as one of the major problems with humanity. Our grasp of reality is all in the mind, obviously. Reality, spiritual or physical..if either or both exist... depends on our positive belief in these realities. For some people, the realties of their time can be evidenced by the technology of the time, for others not so. I am thinking here of the Victorian ectoplasm photos. To me now, I think that they look like bits of muslin in the mouths of the subjects. But the ignorance of the time and the belief of spiritualty meant that people believed..well some. We dont know what they actually photographed. But our own experiences bias our subjective views. Objectivity is a avoided much these days,IMHO.
I will not say whether it was knowledge of photography or experience of ectoplasm that biased my view here, but it serves as a kind of example of where I am going....I think!!!
I was aware of the energy field being called aura. I have turned away from that kind of thing thats all.

Interesting point about the moon not being a natural body. Any ideas how to validate this??? Physically or spiritually??? I must put more thought to this. Well as much thought as a simple plebe can give anyway.

Thanks

Il Papa, you missed a spartan keyword ‘If’.

"If such contact indeed took place" (that is, if a man stepped on the moon, at least once) … "either new plants would appear, or some old plants would undergo informational changeover".

Q: How a non lunar landing would manifest as new plant species here on earth?
A: A non lunar landing would not manifest as new plant species here on earth.

Still too difficult for you? Or you also expect others to formulate your questions for you as well, let alone answering them?

All the best!

Vitalij

-------
“Earth – the planet of biorobots”
www.godswhip.info...

Looks pretty simple to me:

You said:



He said:



Looks like he was asking you how it would happen, not if it did.. Don't be pedantic because of an obvious typing error.

So how does it happen, hypothetically speaking of course?

Oh, and how do you know it didn't happen? People are discovering new species and mutations all the time, so I guess that's proof then?

[edit on 12-5-2006 by AgentSmith]