Simple reason why I'm Anti-Secret Societies/Freemasonry

Originally posted by Seraphim_Serpente
Quote: "their nation's God"

What the F$#@! Nations have Gods? So you subscribe to the Ideology that Every Citizen of a Nation should ALL belong to the SAME Religion & Worship the SAME God? What about the Atheists - well I guess if you had your way you would take away their "Right to Life" - seeing how they refuse to recognize the "Nation's God" & all. So what would you do - have us go back to the Dark Days of the Inquisition again? Are you going to start to hunt for the "Witches & Pagans" - in order to Torture & Kill them because your God tells you too (Never mind their rights as fellow Citizens)?

Very well put. Most Christians are VERY naive about our founders and what our country was founded on and why we the founding fathers SPECIFICALLY put in separation of church and state! Also why they put in the constitution, and NOT the bible to try and push a SECULAR one world religion, but instead FREEDOOM of religion, and away form the tyranny and oppression Britain imposed with religious inquisitions and witch hunts for any person who went against the grain.

Since many Christians are driven by fear they mindlessly attack without much reason or logic behind it, but more like rabid dog scared to death and frothing at the mouth wit fear and anger, because all the source of their problems are "out their" (the devil etc) And so they look for scape goats since they can hardly handle personal responsibility.

THOMAS JEFFERSON ON CHRISTIANITY & RELIGION

www.nobeliefs.com...



dim.com...

The United States of America is not, in any sense
founded on the Christian religion

Bible, bringing about a self-fulfilling prophecy
of Armageddon

Bible "end times" self-fulfilling prophecy


"But That's the Old Testament!"

freethought.mbdojo.com...

It's Ok to Question

video.google.com...


www.gnosticvideos.org...


Sex: The Secret Gate to Eden

www.youtube.com...


BOOKS:



The Secular Bible: Why Nonbelievers Must Take Religion
Seriously by Jacques Berlinerblau (Hardcover


The End of Faith: Religion, Terror, and the Future of
Reason Paperback by Sam Harris


The Most Dangerous Man in America?: Pat Robertson and
the Rise of the Christian Coalition by Rob
Boston

The Separation of Church and State: Writings on a
Fundamental Freedom by America's Founders by
Forrest Church

Was the United States founded as a "Christian nation"?

Close Encounters With the Religious Right: Journeys
into the Twilight Zone of Religion and
Politics by Rob Boston


The Myth of Christian America : What You Need to Know
About the Separation of Church and State by
Mark Weldon Whitten

Kramnick, Isaac, "The Godless Constitution: The Case
Against Religious Correctness," 1997 The Fundamentals
of Extremism: The Christian Right in America Paperback
by Kimberly Blaker

The Baptizing of America: The Religious Right's Plans
for the Rest of Us Hardcover by James Rudin
Misquoting Jesus: The Story Behind Who Changed the
Bible and Why Hardcover by Bart D. Ehrman

The End of Faith: Religion, Terror, and the Future of
Reason Paperback by Sam Harris


The Bible, End Times & Prehistory $19.95

[edit on 4-12-2006 by PowerToThePeople]

Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by whaaa
And if you think that Masons in the banking community are absolutely powerless to control you at least in the economic sense; you are extremely naive.

But don't you see the fallacy in that sort of logic? You guys keep saying "Masons this, Masons that", insinuating that everyone who has ever done something wrong in their life is automatically some sort of covert Mason.

What about the NON-Masons in the banking community. Surely they outnumber the Masons a hundred to one at least, and therefore would have the power to cancel out anything a couple of Masons may want to do.

Same thing in government. Everything was hunky dory when the majority of government positions was filled by Masons. Washington, Revere, Hancock, Franklin, etc., all did a pretty damn good job. Isn't it at least interesting that it was only when the NON-Masons became the majority, that everything began to go to hell in a handbasket?

So Mote it be !

Cand: I, ____ __ ____,(candidate then repeats the obligation as ministered to him by the WM) of my own free will and accord, in the presence of Almighty God and this Worshipful Lodge of Free and Accepted Masons, erected to God and dedicated to the memory of the Holy Saints of Jerusalem, do hereby and hereon, solemnly and sincerely promise and swear, that I will always hele, forever conceal, and never reveal any of the secret arts, parts, or points of the hidden mysteries of Freemasonry, which I have received, am about to receive, or may be hereafter instructed in, to any person unless it shall be to a worthy Brother Entered Apprentice, or within the body of a just and duly constituted Lodge of such; and not unto him or them whom I shall hear so to be, but unto him or them only whom I shall find so to be after due trial, strict examination, or lawful Masonic information.

Furthermore: I do promise and swear that I will not write, indite, print, paint, stamp, stain, hue, cut, carve, mark or engrave the same upon anything movable or immovable, whereby or whereon the least word, syllable, letter, or character may become legible or intelligible to myself or another, whereby the secrets of Freemasonry may be unlawfully ob-tained through my unworthiness.

To all of which I do solemnly and sincerely promise and swear, without any hesitation, mental reservation, or secret evasion of mind in my whatsoever; binding myself under no less a penalty than that of having my throat cut across, my tongue torn out, and with my body buried in the sands of the sea at low-water mark, where the tide ebbs and flows twice in twenty-four hours, should I ever knowingly or willfully violate this, my solemn Obligation of an Entered Apprentice. So help me God and make me steadfast to keep and perform the same.

I don't get how you could take a oath like this and sleep at night. This is very disturbing indeed. If I would have to swear a oath such as this I would leave no questions asked. To me this is very dangerous to take a oath with a sword piercing my skin drawing blood. I just don't get how this is going to make me a better person or enlighten me in some way.



[edit on 4-12-2006 by Andy Warhol]

Since many Christians are driven by fear - they mindlessly attack without much reason or logic behind it, but more like a rabid dog scared to death and frothing at the mouth with fear and anger, because the source of all their problems are "out there" (the devil etc) And so they look for scape goats since they can hardly handle personal responsibility.

don't get how you could take a oath like this and sleep at night. This is very disturbing indeed. If I would have to swear a oath such as this I would leave no questions asked. To me this is very dangerous to take a oath with a sword piercing my skin drawing blood. I just don't get how this is going to make me a better person or enlighten me in some way.

The Penalties are Symbolic BTW. It is meant to get across the importance of not revealing the Secrets of Freemasonry to the UN-Initiated. If you were a part of the Fraternity you would understand the reasons why this needs to be upheld. However if you do reveal the Secrets (& are caught doing so) - you will NOT have your "throat cut across & tongue torn out" - at minimum you would be Reprimanded & perhaps Shunned by your Brothers & at most you would be Expelled from the Fraternal Order.

Are you part of the crowd that thinks that FreeMasons are some kind of Diabolic Murderers - huh Andy Warhol?

[edit on 4-12-2006 by Seraphim_Serpente]

[edit on 4-12-2006 by Seraphim_Serpente]

[edit on 4-12-2006 by Seraphim_Serpente]

[edit on 4-12-2006 by Seraphim_Serpente]

Seraphim_Serpente why is it so important not to reveal secrets? The reason many people look at freemasonry with a weary eye is because of the secrets. When you keep secrets it usually means you are doing something that your not supposed too. So why even have the oath in the first place? Because it's traditional? But if you want to go around and say secret passwords and secret handshakes go ahead
But I myself have given that up when I was...9. Huh and no I don't think that all masons are murders. That's just a odd oath and who the heck would want to belong to something that say I will have my throat cut for spilling the beans about freemasonry.

Well if they were truly the secrets of a Perfect God (i.e. Universal), as the masons and other secret societies believe then the secret would either keep itself or it wouldn't be dangerous to give to other people.

Yes - you have a point Spatacus. Perhaps this is the case & perhaps it wouldn't be dangerous if the people who shouldn't know (because they would use the Power gained for Malevolent purposes) - actually DID know the secrets - they just didn't realize their Importance or how the Puzzle Pieces actually fit together.


Andy Warhol - do you know what the word "Profanation" means? Can you honestly tell me that you never had to PROVE yourself to anyone else in your life? To get a certain Job maybe - or the
Key to the Store - or that Promotion you wanted or that Marriage Proposal?

[edit on 4-12-2006 by Seraphim_Serpente]

The two people I have to prove anything to is God and my boss. That's it. I have nothing to prove to masonry or any of that. You said,"Un-intiated." So in other words I'am unworthy of the secret because I'am not a mason. Boy that makes me want to join the "club." So if I'am not a mason I'am unworthy. Well I guess 100's of others including myself are just stupid and unworthy.Thanks

Originally posted by Off_The_Street
Eudamoia, let me ask you a few simple questions, please:

What is your true name?
What is your home address?
What is your telephone number?
How old are you?
Are you a registered voter? If so, what party, and please list your voting record.
What is your sexual orientation?
What is your marital status?
Please list all your sexual encounters from adolescence onward, including autoerotic activities. Use extra pages if required.

Ohh goody I wanna answer!

What is your true name? What U KNO 6
What is your home address? KNO Sector HPD & MC Alpha Complex
What is your telephone number? Whats your security clearance citizen?
How old are you? 30 yearcycles
Are you a registered voter? If so, what party, and please list your voting record. What is your security clearance citizen?
What is your sexual orientation? What is your security clearance citizen?
What is your marital status? What is your security clearance citizen?
Please list all your sexual encounters from adolescence onward, including autoerotic activities. Use extra pages if required. What is your security clearance citizen?

I am so good at tests YEA Me!

LOL

Sorry truthfully your right people have the right to privacy and Secret Societies are private organisations that don't have to tell everyone everything. Thats the fun of being in a secret society.

On that note I would like to add

Membership, suspected membership, and relations with suspected members of secret societies is treasonous punnishable by summery exicution. thank you for your cooperation.

I have nothing to prove to masonry or any of that. You said,"Un-intiated." So in other words I'am unworthy of the secret because I'am not a mason. Boy that makes me want to join the "club." So if I'am not a mason I'am unworthy. Well I guess 100's of others including myself are just stupid and unworthy.

Good. Then don't join! I am sure that they would be Happy NOT to have you!

It is the Secrets of the MASONIC ORDER!!! If you are not a FreeMason then what Business do you have knowing them? Does that make sense to you?

BTW - Stupid? NO, Probably not. Unworthy (from what I have seen so far) = YES!

Temper Temper there's no need to yell. As I can tell by your banter you are just looking for a fight. Sorry not going to happen here. Their are many people who will fight with you. I'am not one of them. If you are a mason which I don't think you are by the way you are acting. I have many discussions with masons on here and you are the first one to act like a little kid. And why not tell us some secrets? What are the masons really hiding? If I had any secrets I would share them. I will never meet anyone on this board and have no idea what anyone here looks like. If you are a mason you have represented your faternity very well

Originally posted by Andy Warhol
And why not tell us some secrets?

Um, then they wouldn't be secrets?

If I had any secrets I would share them.

OK, then answer the questions above then. Your REAL name, address, occupation, place of business, etc.

And why not tell us some secrets? What are the masons really hiding?

At this point I will redirect you to the meanings of the words: A)"Profanation", B)"Vulgarians" & C)"UN-Initiated"!

BTW remember this:

I have Nothing to Prove

Well I have Nothing to Prove to you! If you are such a "Self-Actualized Genius" then figured them out for yourself! What do you need me for?

[edit on 4-12-2006 by Seraphim_Serpente]

[edit on 4-12-2006 by Seraphim_Serpente]

[edit on 4-12-2006 by Andy Warhol]

Real name Trent...

31
No not a registered voter
I'am straight
Single never been married
Let's see lost my virginity at 19 yrs old I have been with six women. Since becoming a born again christian haven't been with a women in a long time
Is their anything else you would like to know. That is my real name and adress. I could careless. What some masons or anti-masons going to come hunting Proably not because the masons I have met on this board are nice people.

[edit on 4-12-2006 by Andy Warhol]

Edit: Someone's personal info removed.

[edit on 4-12-2006 by intrepid]

Originally posted by Andy Warhol
Real name Trent

May I ask, are you posting from the computer you registered with ATS?

Edit: Someone's personal info removed from quote.

[edit on 4-12-2006 by intrepid]

Yes sir I'am go ahead and check it if you want.

Originally posted by Andy Warhol
Yes sir I'am go ahead and check it if you want.

Already did and Hudsonville is an hour and a half's drive from where your IP shows up.

Yeah the closet number is Holland so that's about right. Why?

For ANYONE interested in ANYTHING secret.

ALL Secret Societies are different forms of Nagualism... ancient nagualism.. nahual

I suggest you seriously check that out..

[edit on 12/4/2006 by PuRe EnErGy]

Are you talking to me. I don't have any problem with masons at all. Most of my friends are masons. I'am not. I just the whole secret thing. I don't like. I'am a very honest person. If you have a question ask I will answer it.