The Sepecat Jaguar and its roots

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posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 11:12 AM
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It is fairly well accepted these days that the Jaguar emerged from a British requirement for a tactical attack aircraft and a French requirement for an advanced trainer. In fact in the very early days this situation was completely the opposite. The first British moves towards what became the Jaguar centred on AST 362 which was issued in 1962 and called for a replacement for the Gnat and Hunter advanced trainers.

France’s first move came the following year with a requirement for a light tactical aircraft to replace such as the Mystere IV in the ground attack role. It was noted however that despite the different roles the size and performance objectives called for were the same and so in 1964 it was announced that a joint project for a light strike aircraft and advanced trainer was to be developed for the French Air Force, RAF and Royal Navy.

BAC tried to revive its VG work with its early proposals by at first designing a scaled down single seat version of the Vickers 589 (see post above on VG) and later the BAC P.45, while in France Breguet fell back on its experience with the 1001 and 1100 Taon family light fighter prototypes in its design of the Br 121.

Here is the original swing wing BAC P.45 proposal which clearly infuenced the later Tornado more than it did the Jaguar.


Meanwhile here is the Breguet 121 which clearly relates to the Jaguar and also Hawker Siddeley’s attempt to muscle in on AST 362 with its attractive HS.1173 design


BAC then dropped its VG proposals when it appeared the AFVG would satisfy that need and designed a new agile supersonic combat wing and tail for the P.45 based on its TSR 2 work.
After several visits between Warton and Villacoublay a format was reached whereby the new wing and tail of the BAC P.45 were to be matched to the fuselage of the Br 121, in this form the new aircraft was named Jaguar and is seen here as proposed in 1966-67. This is the starting point for the actual Jaguar we have today.



A short while after this the Royal Navy withdrew from the Project and the RAF requirement began to shift toward a strike aircraft to replace the F-4 Phantom and Hawker Hunter. As the weight and complexity of the Jaguar grew in response to this change of requirement both Britain and France launched completely new trainer projects which later emerged as the BAe Hawk and the Alpha Jet and this aspect of the Jaguar was forgotten about with all 2 seat Jaguars subsequently being conversion trainers for the single seater variant. The British version of the Jaguar also became more complex and acquired systems such as LR/MTS and RWR which gave the UK Jaguar S version a distinct visual appearance by comparison with the simpler French Jaguar A model.

Original Jaguar A;


Jaguar GR.1 (S) in RAF service;


Despite the RN withdrawal the French Navy maintained an interest in the type with the Jaguar M, this version finally being cancelled in the early 1970’s.

The Jaguar International was an export model developed by BAC from the RAF Jaguar and was the first version to sport the overwing missiles later adopted by the RAF. This was the model initially supplied to India, who has since developed upgrades for the type indigenously.





posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 11:53 AM
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external image

Jaguar M-05 about to take off from the bow catapult of CV Clemenceau.





Jaguar M-05 prototype approaching CV Clemenceau.


both taken from here


[edit on 9/3/06 by Harlequin]



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 12:15 PM
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Why did the French drop the Jaguar-M and instead go down the route of Etendard which is clearly a less capable platform with far less potential.



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 12:20 PM
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For some reason, The Jaguar reminds me of an F-4 Phantom probably becouse of the rear half of the airframe.

I sat in one back in the wirral show in 1995(Probably a Mock Up), Decent aircraft, Would compare it with an F/A-18 Hornet since it is a Medium Fighter/Attacker.

I heard on the news a couple of months back the Jaguar is to be phased out of service this year.

I suppose the French made a daft decision about dropping the Jaguar M and using the Etendard, Maybe its becouse they had the Vought F-8 Crusaders that were the FNs fighters up to 1999 and the Etendard is more of an attacker.

[edit on 9-3-2006 by Browno]



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 12:29 PM
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Another note in the Jaguar story is the Mitsubishi T-2/F-1 design, which is based on the Jaguar, albeit a completely new airframe.

When the JASDF was looking for a supersonic trainer, the Jaguar along with the T-38 Talon were promoted in Japan. The JASDF nearly brought the Jaguar (as a trainer) but ultimately opted for the nock-off Mitsubishi T-2.

The T-2 bears an obvious resemblance to the Jaguar but is noticeably longer and generally less well performing. It was developed into the single seat F-1 strike fighter which is still in service today (as are some T-2s?)
[img] i2.tinypic.com...[/img]



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 09:53 PM
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I know this has been done to death, but since we're jagging...
The Jaguar will remain in service with the IAF for some time..
I've seen the Indian Jaguars up close and they are a sight for sore eyes..
Unfortunately they are at the same AFB as the Su-30MKIs and so they are kind of eclipsed in the eyes of the public.

I'm ashamed to say that for a while I was one of those ignored the Jags cause of the Su-30MKIs, but I've seen some Indian versions of those "low-flying" Jag videos and boy that is somehing..
Plus I've always found the wing-top mounted missile concept very cool


IAF Jags



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 10:20 PM
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Very good! Waynos, you did a good job again!
It remends me of IAR-93, Mitsubishi T-2/F-1, also infunced by Jaguar design.
I also start to wonder why Franch equiped two kind of fighter-attacker Jaguar and Mirage F.1 at the same time? Both them are in closer specification, closer purpose, I can image why British need Jaguar, but I couldn't image why Franch equiped Jaguar, maybe Franch repented of they equip Jaguar before so insist on developing Rafale independently?



posted on Mar, 10 2006 @ 02:59 AM
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The Mirage F-1 was an awesome a/c too..



posted on Mar, 10 2006 @ 06:06 AM
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The French politics behind the Jaguar story would probably provide enough material for a lengthy book.
The original French competition was to provide a replacement for their Fouga Magister and Lockheed T-33 in the training role, as well as their Super Mystere B2, Republic F-84F and North American F-100 Super Sabre in the strike/attack role. Because the training aircraft would be operated by their Ecole de Combat et Appui Tactique (School of Combat and Tactical Support) it was given the abbreviation ECAT. Both Dassault and Breguet submitted designs and Breguet won with their Br121 design, powered by twin Rolls Royce RB 172-45 engines. The Br121 design was an update on the BR1001 design that lost out to the Fiat G-91 in the NATO trainer/light fighter competition.
However, Marcel Dassault was annoyed that his company had lost the competition and, despite already having the Mirage F1 on the drawing board, he decided that he wanted a bit of the Jaguar action as well and he took over the Breguet company. The Dassault conflict of interest between the Mirage F1 and the Jaguar would plague the Jaguar project from this point on. In essence, Dassault were not interested in promoting sales of the Jaguar in preference to their Mirage F1, particularly export versions. Eventually in 1980 BAe obtained from Dassault full rights to export the Jaguar, but this was usually done in direct opposition to the Mirage F1 and with the usual French practice of adding in 'back-handers' to sweeten the deal. This 'double dealing' by Dassault has left a bitter taste in both BAe and the British government about the 'benefits' of future Anglo-French aviation projects. In my opinion, the French are only interested in a joint project if they can have primary control over the design and the build and they don't give a stuff about their partners.

Heimdall
www.spyflight.co.uk



posted on Mar, 10 2006 @ 06:26 AM
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Indeed..
The F1 Mirage was a close contender along with the Jaguar when the Indians were looking for a successor to the Hunter/Marut.



posted on Mar, 10 2006 @ 06:39 AM
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Indeed it was and the Indian deal was probably the bitterest fight between the two there was. Will it be repeated for the Indian MRCA contract?



posted on Mar, 10 2006 @ 08:42 AM
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Originally posted by Heimdall
Both Dassault and Breguet submitted designs and Breguet won with their Br121 design, powered by twin Rolls Royce RB 172-45 engines. The Br121 design was an update on the BR1001 design that lost out to the Fiat G-91 in the NATO trainer/light fighter competition.

Does another have any more info on Dassault's proposition for what became the Jaguar? Pics please, lol.



posted on Mar, 10 2006 @ 10:50 AM
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I only have one picture of the rival French proposals but, if it helps, the names of these proposals were the Potez P.92 and Dassault Cavalier.

This shows the two stages of Cavalier design, first with the Pegasus and then with separate lift jets.





[edit on 10-3-2006 by waynos]



posted on Mar, 10 2006 @ 01:05 PM
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The F-1 does resemble the jaguar but it differs from having a Vulcan Gun

www.avions-militaires.net...

www.franknoort.nl...

www.aeronautics.ru...

www.globalsecurity.org...

Well nicer than the F-16 looking F-2s that may replace it, The F-1 is more of a medium fighter/Attacker and also has two engines.

I guess this is a 'Single Seat F-4 Phantom'.



[edit on 10-3-2006 by Browno]



posted on Mar, 10 2006 @ 06:19 PM
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Ho
The Dassault Cavalier reminds me of Etendard, where is the Potez 92 is a big mission.
Waynos, The top two picture has found by some Chinese fans, but I am sure these two they have never known, but only could be found by book not website.



posted on Mar, 12 2006 @ 12:57 AM
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Originally posted by waynos
Indeed it was and the Indian deal was probably the bitterest fight between the two there was. Will it be repeated for the Indian MRCA contract?



Well the main reason for choosing the Jag over the F1 was the fact that the Jag was going to bt used in a maritime role as well, and well 2 engines are always safer than one aye?





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