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Thesis: Contactees are unwitting disinfo agents for aliens.

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posted on Mar, 8 2006 @ 02:50 PM
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I searched and couldn't find any indication that this has been discussed on ATS before.

I've been wondering why contactee accounts and experiences seem to have some dramatic differences, yet some elements that are nearly identical.

Some contactees appear to be repulsed by aliens and want little to do with them, others accept them and want to spread the word. Some accounts are that the aliens are here to help and guide us, other accounts are that they could care less about us and manipulate us as they wish.

It finally dawned on me.

Could extraterrestrial intelligence be aware of and use disinformation?

Is it possible contactees are unwittingly being used to spread alien disinformation in order to obscure their reasons for visiting?

NC




posted on Mar, 8 2006 @ 03:09 PM
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Good question.

The thing you have to take into account is that the entire "experience" is very subjective. I believe those who truly encounter such experiences, are truthfully telling what they encountered; however one has to understand how subjective the experience is to start with.

The "beings" if in nothing else that we know, are apparently able to alter our reality, or should I say our perception of it. Going on that sam line of thought, I personally believe the "abduction" experience to be a multi-layered one. It's entirely possible to me, that it's a screen memory on top of...on top of...etc.

So, the question ultimately becomes, what is the true experience. In my own case, whatever is behind the "alien" face, doesnt want me to know what it is, and/or layers on the "alien" experience. Either they do it, or we do it. I dont know which, and ultimately I dont believe anyone does.

So, the question isnt what "abductees" say, but what the core experience is.




[edit on 8-3-2006 by jritzmann]



posted on Mar, 8 2006 @ 03:34 PM
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The 'core experience' is exactly what I want to dig up.

But is it a question of 'Schrodinger's cat'? Does the perception of the experience automatically cause the alteration of reality because the human mind simply can't conceive the actuality? Is it so far beyond our understanding that the abductees alter their own reality?

Or do the aliens implant the confusion?

NC



posted on Mar, 8 2006 @ 06:30 PM
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Maybe both?

The core experience may have little to nothing to do with "aliens" as we know them. Many people ascribe a "spiritual" connotation to the experience, others view it as nearly or equal to rape.

My guess has always been that there is no alien genetics program, no alien/human hybrid program, but that there's something alot deeper going on, that isnt us.

I think you'd do well to do what I did. Look at the people effected by the experience, before and after. NOT the experience so much itself, but what it did to the experiencer.

You'll find some interesting results.



posted on Mar, 8 2006 @ 07:18 PM
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It's a very good question.

The aliens could be planting information in the contactee as you said.

Or the abductee or contactee, gives their own spin on details, accoridng to personal or sprirual beliefs. Or reads books and other abduction cases about it and begins to add things in, from what they read.

Other possiblities I also wonder are:

There has not been any alien contact or abductions and i.e the government or any group of conspirators, goes about planting the idea of alien abductions out there.

Or, abductions by aliens are very real, but the abductee does not reveal the true facts, because they are silenced. This could be by way of hypnosis, threats, and mind control.and the abductee isn't really aware of iit. This would be done to the abductee by human intervention. Whether or not humans ar working alongside or against the aliens is unclear.

If aliens do "bad" things, they may not want those details known. The best test of this would be to tell those things, and see what happens. If anyone is coercing you do undergo hypnosis, or talk about it, "erase it", and you refuse that, see how far they go then. Very few people will succeed in telling you aliens do not have our best interest at heart. Do you think someone could go on about their "bad" experience for 73 pages on ATS?



posted on Mar, 8 2006 @ 07:42 PM
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I am not a disinfo agent of aliens and by the way, they dont even want to spread disinfo.
All they want is to be known to and seen by the people of Earth, because only being known by the governments of this planet didnt work out as well as they've hoped.



posted on Mar, 8 2006 @ 07:45 PM
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I think I get what youre saying Violet, I have often wondered about "Mind Control", but more in the vein of psychotronic weapons testing. I dont think it accounts for all of the events (and after events) within the experiences, so I have to disregard it.

Hypnosis, I dont feel is any real viable way to retrieve any missing time instances. It's been talked about for years that it deals with an area of the brain used for "fantasy" or "nightmare" type senarios, and not true memory. I feel alot of these "hypnotherapists" are literally changing people's memories by virtue of the "alien abduction", and couple that with media contamination, and you get where we are now.

My own experiences have been during waking hours, and in a few instances, in front of others. I have never "needed" to recall anything I didnt already know, or remember....and what I dont...I dont want to anyway. There has to be a reason I dont.

I walked a path that felt right to me, and that I'd find an answer...I walked it and found it, in a matter of speaking. Most of my experiences culminated in a physical manifestation of a symbol, which appeared on a mirror one night after some serious experiences.

Not everyone gets that, and I'm gratified that I did. But it set me onto another path I couldnt walk, and I left the in-depth field for 10 years because of it.

Was the core experience "real" as we know it? I think so. But due to the visitors ability to alter perception, I'll never be sure.

There's only one thing in all of it that was constant and could be counted on:

Ambiguity.



posted on Mar, 8 2006 @ 09:11 PM
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I think the problem is that there are different craft, different races, and offcourse, we humans are all different.

One guy might # his pants while another might enjoy it... we all experience it on a different way..some encounter evil races, other encounter peacefull races..

I think that is why encounters all are so different...so it might seem like a hoax or a disinfo..

That is, by the way, why i dont tell all my (great and wonderfull) contactee experiences, not one! people just get confused, they say you are a liar, they dont understand it, or they just ridicule you...


And, i dont like the word abductee...you have contactee's and you have abductee's, it is totally different.
A contactee (in my case) enters the craft and/or has a ride with them at his or her own free will, an abductee on the other hand has his/her free will violated, and everything that is done to them is not out of free will.

an abduction is frightening, and in the case of a contactee it is magical, joyus and wonderfull..



[edit on 8-3-2006 by Dutch_Rick]



posted on Mar, 8 2006 @ 10:22 PM
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Originally posted by Dutch_Rick
I think the problem is that there are different craft, different races, and offcourse, we humans are all different.

One guy might # his pants while another might enjoy it... we all experience it on a different way..some encounter evil races, other encounter peacefull races..

I think that is why encounters all are so different...so it might seem like a hoax or a disinfo..

That is, by the way, why i dont tell all my (great and wonderfull) contactee experiences, not one! people just get confused, they say you are a liar, they dont understand it, or they just ridicule you...


And, i dont like the word abductee...you have contactee's and you have abductee's, it is totally different.
A contactee (in my case) enters the craft and/or has a ride with them at his or her own free will, an abductee on the other hand has his/her free will violated, and everything that is done to them is not out of free will.

an abduction is frightening, and in the case of a contactee it is magical, joyus and wonderfull..



[edit on 8-3-2006 by Dutch_Rick]


And one could just as easily say there are no different races, just the ones we perceive. Face face of an "alien" may have no different a "mask" then we put on it. Again, the question is, do they do that, or do we.

"Will" in either instance may have no bearing whatsoever on the experience other then how it's perceived, and therefore the entire experience gauges from that.

I personally see no connection to anything extraterrestrial as we think of it, nor do I believe personally that there is different races or such. I dont expect too much from my own perception of them, knowing how easily it has been manipulated before.

It's always seemed much more deep then little green men from planet X.



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 12:15 AM
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Well, for me, it was no matter of alice in wonderland, other perceptions, other state of awareness or whatever.
I was just experiencing that the same way as i experience normal everyday life, i have no reason to think they were disguised by fooling my perception.

And ofcourse their are other races, there are trillions of races out there, the universe has no end and its teeming with life everywhere, why shouldnt races be different...

It is out of the question, to me, that we all are the same but that they just are fooling our perceptions.
By the way, the ones i have experiences with are like humans, only larger and they have more muscle...how do you call that, muscular?
If i talked to them at a party i would never have noticed that they are not from earth..
I have never seen little green or evil grey man... altough they do exist, thats what ive been told..

Ofcourse people will encounter species that do such things like changing our perception, "putting on a mask" and all the other things but with me it simple wasnt the case, it was just like normal day life...

[edit on 9-3-2006 by Dutch_Rick]



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 01:16 AM
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You dont sound too clever in my opinion. First you make the mistake of assuming that they are visitors. Where is your proof of that? That would be disinformation in my opinion. See my point? You start off by spreading disinformation and then you claim that someone else is spreading disinformation. It is what they call in psychology projection. Unless you can give some real good reasoning or evidence to back up your assertions then it just looks like projection to me and that you are here to spread disinfo.



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 02:44 AM
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Sure, an extra terrestrial intelligence would use disinformation and be aware of it. I've looked in to contactee stories and I think very few if not zero tells you the complete truth. Once you get on the subject of the ETs origins then it quickly becomes obscured or improbable. The reason behind it can be that the ETs don't want to disclose their location because we here on Earth might be able to reach it within a few hundreds years and knock on their doors. Lets not forget that we here on Earth have tribal warfare as one of our main occupations, as Stanton Friedman put it. Why would you invite such a people to your 'house'?
But I also think that their are more serious deceivers out there then those of the 'white lie' category. I suspect some even are outright manipulators and rather have us confused and fighting amongst ourselves then progressing as a planet. Those ETs would try to steer you by mixing lies in with the truth while counting on the weaknesses of the individual.



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 03:19 AM
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Such excellent thinking. I always enjoy reading your posts TerraX. The second category are the really scary aliens. But still it is hard to put aliens into catagories at all just by their very deceptive nature. You can never conclude that they are really good or bad. Keeping people confused about them and their true nature is what they do and they do it quite well. They do not wish to be studied or understood by us. And for this reason they keep themselves away from us. As one has once said to me, "A wise man will never reveal his true self."



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 03:45 AM
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Before my abduction back in 1998 I had one of the most horrible experiences in my life. The only more horrible experiences were a few days later when I actually got abducted. But I ran into some being I think other people see. They call them shadow people. This was the most disgusting excuse for a life form. Pure evil in my opinion. One minute he would flatter you. The next he would be insulting you. You can actually see that this being is behind the personalities of many people who try to control you. They flatter you with lies when you do what they want and they smear you with lies when you don't. You can never believe the best or the worst that is spoken about you. Both these kinds of lies were coming out of the mouth of this thing. He actually told me that he wanted me to tell people what he told me. He even flattered me by saying I was the reincarnation of the Apostle Paul. This was about the same time that someone else came out with a book claiming himself to also be the reincarnation of the Apostle Paul. I've resisted this thing with everything I got. If you are looking for alien disinfo agents look no further than the churches.



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 04:55 AM
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Originally posted by NotClever
I searched and couldn't find any indication that this has been discussed on ATS before.

I've been wondering why contactee accounts and experiences seem to have some dramatic differences, yet some elements that are nearly identical.

Some contactees appear to be repulsed by aliens and want little to do with them, others accept them and want to spread the word. Some accounts are that the aliens are here to help and guide us, other accounts are that they could care less about us and manipulate us as they wish.

It finally dawned on me.

Could extraterrestrial intelligence be aware of and use disinformation?

Is it possible contactees are unwittingly being used to spread alien disinformation in order to obscure their reasons for visiting?

NC



I agree with your position 110 % Disinfo, is a type of mind control........



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 09:32 AM
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Originally posted by grasshopper
You dont sound too clever in my opinion. First you make the mistake of assuming that they are visitors. Where is your proof of that? That would be disinformation in my opinion. See my point? You start off by spreading disinformation and then you claim that someone else is spreading disinformation. It is what they call in psychology projection. Unless you can give some real good reasoning or evidence to back up your assertions then it just looks like projection to me and that you are here to spread disinfo.


Man what are you talking about?
Im not spreading disinfo and im not claiming someone else spreads disinfo


And no i have no proof, that is why i dont tell my contactee experiences, ive only said i experienced it like i experience normal day life, where is the disinfo on that.

Man i dont even tell what ive experienced, only how ive experienced..

I dont get it



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 10:09 AM
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Originally posted by grasshopper
If you are looking for alien disinfo agents look no further than the churches.


NotClever-
If youre going to research this with any tenacity regarding the core experience, you might want to start looking into this aspect.



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by grasshopper

You dont sound too clever in my opinion. First you make the mistake of assuming that they are visitors. Where is your proof of that? That would be disinformation in my opinion. See my point? You start off by spreading disinformation and then you claim that someone else is spreading disinformation. It is what they call in psychology projection. Unless you can give some real good reasoning or evidence to back up your assertions then it just looks like projection to me and that you are here to spread disinfo.


I assume since this is your first post in this thread that you are referring to me, NotClever. I know you have some interesting input, I've read your other posts. I don't understand why you started out this way.

Allow me to go off topic here for a moment and let folks know a little bit about me. Sorry, bear with me.

So everyone knows; my usual response to comments I don't understand is to deconstruct the parts, looking for what must be the hidden gem.

Sometimes I find it, sometimes I don't.

Part 1: No, I'm not too clever. Clearly, my username is NotClever. I use that in an attempt to keep myself humble. It doesn't always work.

Part 2: There isn't a single assertion in my opening post. The post title is an 'argumentative thesis statement', defined at wikipedia as; "claiming a topic and justifying the truth through example, open to debate." Emphasis added by me.

Part 3: Psychological projection (or projection bias) can be defined as unconsciously assuming that others share the same or similar thoughts, beliefs, values, or positions on any given subject. From wikipedia. Read that definition closely. This is "Aliens and UFOs".

Part 4: Ah hah! I found the gem in a different post of yours:


Keeping people confused about them and their true nature is what they do and they do it quite well. They do not wish to be studied or understood by us.

Thank you, you just supported my 'disinfo' thesis....grasshopper.

"He who learns but does not think, is lost! He who thinks but does not learn is in great danger." Confucius

We now return to our regularly scheduled program.


Originally posted by jritzmann

Hypnosis, I dont feel is any real viable way to retrieve any missing time instances. It's been talked about for years that it deals with an area of the brain used for "fantasy" or "nightmare" type senarios, and not true memory. I feel alot of these "hypnotherapists" are literally changing people's memories by virtue of the "alien abduction", and couple that with media contamination, and you get where we are now.


Agreed. I use as an example Bud Hopkins. Correct me if I'm wrong. His cases share a high degree of 'sameness', when the experience may actually differ dramatically from case to case. There are two guaranteed constants in Hopkins cases, him or the hypnotist. I wonder how much sub-conscious influence may be present in his cases.


Originally posted by violet

Or the abductee or contactee, gives their own spin on details, accoridng to personal or sprirual beliefs



Originally posted by jritzmann

Originally posted by grasshopper
If you are looking for alien disinfo agents look no further than the churches.


NotClever-
If youre going to research this with any tenacity regarding the core experience, you might want to start looking into this aspect.

Interesting, three separate individuals pointing out what may be a core concept to the phenomenon. Any ideas where the first steps of this research should lead? I suppose I could simply start with my minister.

Thanks for your posts, its interesting reading.

NC



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 01:00 PM
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Originally posted by NotClever
NotClever-
If youre going to research this with any tenacity regarding the core experience, you might want to start looking into this aspect.

Interesting, three separate individuals pointing out what may be a core concept to the phenomenon. Any ideas where the first steps of this research should lead? I suppose I could simply start with my minister.


Nope, theyre just people too, so you'll get different answers. One thing you can start doing is soliciting for "experiencers" to interview.

Make sure, that you put these questions on you list:
1) What nationality do you descend from?
2) What is your IQ?
3) Have you ever "fooled" with any mind altering drugs? Emphasize "ever".
4) Do you currently have any interest or practice in the "occult"? (everything from a Ouija board on down)

Should you follow through with those questions, you'll find interesting results. As some only pose as "experiencers", you'll have some conflicting ones, but if you feel the majority of them are serious and sincere, you'll see a pattern.

Once I had the established "pattern" some experiencers said I was "psychic" because I could tell them their answers before they said them. It's nearly that solid. So to me, the consistencies are worth something towards progress.

Those are also core questions, other can be: Do you have any history in your family of mental illness? But those 4, to me, are very good indicators.



posted on Mar, 9 2006 @ 02:26 PM
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Sorry, not clever, I couldn't resist the swipe at your name. I use projection in a different way. I was a psychology student in college. To me projection is similar to the concept some people refer to when they say something like, "it takes one to know one". That is about half true in my opinion. A part of ourselves that we don't like when we see it in others it makes us mad. We may not even realize that the thing that we dislike in others is what we don't realize is a part of us. Others would call it hypocracy. They accuse others of doing what they themselves do. I prefer the term projection because it isn't really hypocracy if it is done unconsciously in my opinion. Some people do it consciously and others do it unconsciously. When I hear someone make accusations without any real proof or at least a logical argument that makes sense to me then I start thinking projection. You are coming in here and taking swipes at people like me who claim to have had contact. Expect us to be defensive. I am not a disinfo agent.



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