A good handgun for home defense?

I carry that same model smith & wesson in .40 cal for personal defense. I dont care what anyone tells you caliber does matter. in a life or death situation how many people have the nerves to aim that little .22 steady enough to hit say an eyeball or some other small orifice for a stopping shot? hit them in the body with it & they will barely flinch! hit them in the forehead & the bullet wont penetrate the skull. I deer hunt alot and carry a pistol to finish off wounded animals. I used to carry a compact .380 for this. the one time I used it for this purpose the bullet went under the skin & around the skull of the deer. now imagine your intruder is a wacked out crackhead or something! bottom line is in a situation where your life is at stake you need something that delivers enough energy to take a body shot for your first shot...unless you are combat hardened! you are taking a big risk with a .22 going for a head shot. chances are the nerves will make you miss the smaller target altogether. I sleep well with a semi-auto 12 gauge under the bed loaded with 3" 000buckshot the first 3 rounds followed by 3" sabot slugs for the last 2 and my .40 cal on the bedside table.

I have some things a little larger waiting for that NWO invasion

Alot of people have suggested a shotgun but honestly I've never owned nor have I had much experience with one.Now I'm good with my Sigma but my neighborhood is getting worse and I do think caliber matters I just don't want to risk trying to take out some insane crackhead with a 380. I'm considering a 357 after reading this thread.I believe Tauraus has some at a nice price and with pretty good construction.

You might want to check out my old thread here: www.abovetopsecret.com...

There are alot of good suggestions there, although, for home defense a "handgun" might not be the best option.

If you're really stuck on the "handgun" option, I personally like the Glock 19c.

[edit on 3/2/06 by redmage]

the shotgun has pros and cons. the way they scatter its a point & shoot deal, quick & easy. if you go with something like a 20 gauge semi-auto the recoil is minimal. the gas operated semi-autos deliver much less felt recoil than a single shot or pump. the con is maneuverability. not as easy to swing a shotgun around inside a confined living space. there are always the short barrelled shotguns but then you are increasing the recoil. if you go the shotgun route I wouldnt use anything smaller than #4 shot. the smaller dove & field loads like a 7 1/2 or 8 shot wont penetrate enough. there are some youth models that have shorter pull stock & a full length barrel. this will help maneuverability without adding recoil.

cant go wrong with a .357 but they let you know that you just fired one. a 9mm, while not my first choice, will do the job without breaking your wrist. I personally cant tell the difference in felt recoil between the 9mm & .40 cal but the effect on what is hit is quite different.

from what you describe I am leaning towards the shotgun. the recoil is alot easier to handle against your shoulder as opposed to extended arms. go with the semi-auto but make sure if its used that you clean it extensively & replace the main spring. this will help avoid feeding jams. cut the stock to where you are comfortable shouldering it quickly & add a sims recoil pad. finished product will be a sho nuff home defender thats easy to manage! keep that .380 to use in case of a carjacking or other situation where the action will be quick & close.

If you want a revolver go for .357 mag not for .38spec since You can fire the later from a gun meant for the first one...
Standard .38 loads are lighter than 9mm Para so they are comfortable to shoot from any size revolver...

My personal choise is CZ-75B in 9mm Para, but main reason behind it is IPSC Production Class rules combined with study allowance
If i needed a gun for self defence i'd pick a new S&W with 8 round drum, 4 inch barrel, in .357Mag. It's reliable and versatile ie. no springs that will get loose if you keep it loaded 24/7 and if you can't take down a home intruder in 8 shots you souldn't own a gun...

Combat is a different story and i'd be happy to recomend any 9mm CZ gun for everyone (or tanfoglios)

I personally like revolvers or what is sometimes called "wheel guns."
I own several in different calibers. Two are .357s. The other is a .45 ACP in a revolver..if you can believe that. It is a tarus Tracker..very accurate.
The two .357s are nice because you can load them with .38 specials. One I do load this way with .38 specials...very managable in recoil this way. The other I load with .357s.
The poster who posted about a shot gun is on the mark too. 20 gauge is fine for home defense..and also recoil is managable..compared to 12 gauges. 12 gauge can be viscious in the recoil department. Especially for women and those of small stature like myself. But shotguns are fine.
No one says you have to carry .357 magnums in a .357 magnum..they handle .38 specials just fine. Alot cheaper than .357s too..especially if you are going to practice alot.

NO matter what you decide to get...be sure you know how to use it..no substitute for practice. Also be very aware of children in your home or playing around your yard. Owning a gun is a very big responsibility.
My guns are like the tools in my garage...I dont like a bunch of kids playing in my garage..they can get hurt in there..quickly. I am very particular about who uses my tools..all of them. I dont loan them out easily and I take care of what I have.
SAme thing with my reloading equipment. No lightweights need apply.

practice , practice, practice.

Thanks to all for good posts,
Orangetom

As far as a handgun, I recommend the Sig P239 in a .40 caliber. Fairly compact, super accurate and will stop a mule dead in it's tracks. Also not much recoil if you are inexperienced or a small guy. I own ten different handguns but this is my fav by far. But honestly, like the other poster mentioned, for home protection nothing beats a plain old .12 guage pump. Safe, easy to use and you dont even have to aim, just point it towards the intruder and let er rip. Load it with some 00 Buck and you will be all set. Be safe!

i'd look at a USP compact .45 or a FN 5.7

the .45 will have the stopping power and the noise along with it.
but the 5.7 will let you unload a lot faster with a high accuracy rate, which is vital if your retreating or moving backwards. twenty round clip is also handy. campared to the .45's 12 round clip.

well to start i mean the usp compact in the 9mm. you said you didn't want big...
but for home defense definantly look for a shotgun. preferably the double sawn-off. you may need to make new doorways for fast exists!

I'm a big fan of the "shotgun with a handgun backup" school of thought. However, if it is just a handgun you're thinking of, a revolver is the way to go, preferably in .38 or .357 mag (a .357 will fire .38s if you are worried about recoil). Something along the lines of a Ruger SP101 3" will cover most home defense needs.

If you are slightly better trained or experienced, or if you simply must have a semi, then something in DA/DAO, calibre of 9mm or bigger and most importantly something that you are comfortable using.

Forget a handgun your good with a Tec9

maybe P90 with HV rounds............yeah

When choosing a handgun, the first and most important thing is to make sure it fits your hand. There is no one size fits all in handgun grips, and there is no one size of hand - that's why newer guns are being designed with adjustable backstraps, especially HK and SiG. Then go to pointability, pick a spot on the wall of the gunstore, adopt a shooting stance, close your eyes and bring the gun up to where you think the sights will align with the target - then see how you did. Try it with different guns, you'll see a difference.

Next is ease of use - for you. Some favor a revolver because it's simple to use, most go for a semi auto which are generally more complex in operation, although only minimally for some (e.g. Glock). Then you need to find a trigger action that you like, there are a myriad to choose from, single action, traditional double action, double action only, safe action (Glock), quick action (Walther), safety fast system (FN), law enforcement module (H&K), DAK (SiG).

Only then can you begin to think about caliber, because if you can't hold the gun properly, it doesn't point naturally for you, or you just don't like that trigger action - then caliber won't save you. I'll focus on semi auto calibers (many of which can also be used in revolvers and vice versa):

.22LR - it's for plinking forget it
.25AP - the gentlemans pocket pistol caliber, essentially similar to .22 ballistically - i.e. avoid it.
.32ACP - John Browning's favorite caliber, useful in a pocket gun only
.380ACP - considered by many to be the absolute minimum for self defence, commonly found in blowback pistols that generate a "higher than normal for caliber" recoil as a result.
9mm (AKA - 9mm Luger, 9x19, 9mm Parabellum etc) - still the most popular police and personal defence caliber in the US for semi autos, but not by much. An excellent choice especially for newbies. Cheap to shoot ($12 for 100 rounds at Walmart), moderate recoil, readily available, excellent terminal ballistics for hollowpoints (of which more later).
.40S&W - almost #1 in police holsters in terms of number, a good choice but with higher recoil. A round that some find hard to shoot well.
.357SiG - A .40 case necked down to accept a 9mm bullet. Gaining popularity with police forces because of its barrier penetration capabilities. Heavy on muzzle blast.
.45ACP - the classic old war horse - heavy recoil but with a slow impulse (more of a push than a snap because of the lower operating pressure). Puts people down with as much authority as any handgun round can reasonably expect to.

Bullet design - this one causes arguments too, the following is my PERSONAL opinion - many would disagree.

Use FMJ (Full Metal Jacket) in lesser calibers, you need penetration not expansion - these consist of .25, .32 and .380 out of pocket guns (not larger .380s)

Use JHP (Jacketed Hollowpoint) in larger calibers - .380 (out of larger guns), 9mm, .40, .357, .45.

Hollowpoints feature a cavity in the tip that causes the bullet to expand or "mushroom" when it hits fluid at speed.

There are other lesser factors, do you want a rail to fit lights or lasers, which day sights or night sights work best etc, but essentially that's it.

Remember that we are fortunate enough to live in a nation that affords us the right to use a firearm for our personal safety while many in other nations can only live in fear of a violent attack because their respective governments prefer them to be disarmed and defenceless.

Exercise your rights.

Get good JHP ammo for what ever handgun you get.

In the .357, 158g , 9mm 124g, .40 180g. YMMV

Roper

Winchester, you definitly should be a Subject Matter Expert in the Weaponry forum!

I gave you my vote for WATS for your last post, excellent stuff!

What is a good suggestion for a first gun? I can't decide.

-Pistol, reasonable choice for self-defense and plinking, but they usually run atleast 300 bucks for a reasonable model, I personally am considdering the Springfield XD series of guns.
-Carbine, like the Hi-Point carbines in 9mm or .40cal, give a stock for steady shots, fires cheaper pistol ammo and shoot at less high velocity and it's rounds has less mass so wont penetrate through too much stuff, would be a great choice for plinking and self defense.
-Rifle, I am considdering Russian rifles and copies there off like the AK, SKS and Mosin Nagant, their ammo is more expensive but do open more options like hunting.
-Shotguns, I am considdering the Mossberg 500 model, I can't afford the more expensive Remington 597's, I am also considdering the Chinese YL-12, these would be great for home defense and hunting.

I own airguns, 1 high powered air rifle (Spring gun), 1 CO2 BB Pistol and 2 Airsoft pistols (Spring).

They give me a good option for training indoors but they offer me little defense and little long distance shooting which i'd like to do sometime on the range.

You have voted Winchester Ranger T for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have two more votes this month.

Thanks GrOuNd_ZeRo and Chinawhite, appreciate it

GZ - I'm happy to give you my opinions but even true firearms experts prefer different guns, so what chance do I have. Money is also a factor, we'd all like an MP5

Originally posted by GrOuNd_ZeRo
What is a good suggestion for a first gun? I can't decide.

-Pistol, reasonable choice for self-defense and plinking, but they usually run atleast 300 bucks for a reasonable model, I personally am considdering the Springfield XD series of guns.

You're pretty much on the money right there. The XD is available in a variety of sizes from sub-compact all the way up to extended slide. It adds a 1911 style grip safety to a Glock-like safe action trigger, and has been shown to be capable of withstanding countless thousands of rounds during torture testing. As your first gun I would definitely go with 9mm in a full size (but not the extended slide version). Try it against the following handguns for fit and feel:

SiG P226
SiG P228
Browning Hi-Power
Glock 17
Glock 19
H&K USP
H&K P2000
Walther P99

If you intend to "carry", these guns will be on the large side though.

Carbine, like the Hi-Point carbines in 9mm or .40cal, give a stock for steady shots, fires cheaper pistol ammo and shoot at less high velocity and it's rounds has less mass so wont penetrate through too much stuff, would be a great choice for plinking and self defense.

In this category I would definitely suggest taking a look at the Beretta CX4. In a carbine, .40S&W does very well and recoil is negligible. A CX4 loaded with 180gr Speer Gold Dots would make a formidable defensive combo.

www.cx4storm.com...

Rifle, I am considdering Russian rifles and copies there off like the AK, SKS and Mosin Nagant, their ammo is more expensive but do open more options like hunting.

Many states will not allow you to hunt with a semi-auto, but regulations do vary. The Mosin Nagants are fun little thumpers, especially the M44 which can be had for around $100, but it will beat the living crap out of you when you shoot it, the full size version is tamer. Personally I went with a Yugoslavian SKS in this category. My local gun store is still selling unfired copies for under $200 which is actually a little on the expensive side, but it is a great all round weapon and shoots the ubiquitous and very cheap 7.62x39mm ammunition.

The rifle grenades are not available unfortunately

www.warrelicsshop.com...

Shotguns, I am considdering the Mossberg 500 model, I can't afford the more expensive Remington 597's, I am also considdering the Chinese YL-12, these would be great for home defense and hunting.

Sounds like you're watching the pennies, so I would back you up on the choice of the Mossberg. If you ever win the lottery, pick yourself up a Benelli M4 Super 90.

www.benelli.it...

Hope this helps !

[edit on 5-3-2006 by Winchester Ranger T]

If You're getting a XD i'd suggest test firing it, some of the early guns had lousy accuracy (ie. not able to hi a A4 paper with rested shots at 25m)... Don't know if this accuracy issue exists in guns going to USA (Yes the XD is made in Balkans )

The XD can be extensively researched with people who actually own one here:

www.hs2000talk.com...

you cant go wrong with a S&W 40cal not as big as 44 but hicap like a 9 second choice is 357sig awsome slf defence cartrage with just the right amount of stoping power!