A400M News Update

After digging a bit I can tell you only that it is indeed overweight.
The *****1 have been **********2 to compensate.

1: when a man proposes to a woman he is supposed to give her a **** (say it like a politically incorrect oriental)

2: upon performing an act prohibited by a placard which you have not noticed someone might tell you to **** the ****, except due to their rich cultural heritage they don not say the, they say da.

There, that shouldn't come up in any searches in a hurry. If you can figure out what that says please oblige me not to post the correct words to that sequence. If you don't understand, tough luck.

[edit on 20-1-2009 by CloudySkye]

Originally posted by waynos
There are other issues too, it is suggested, but not confirmed that the aircraft is 20 tons overweight and 13 tons light on payload.

Originally posted by waynos
According to Flight International it is 'only' 12 tons overweight and 3 tons light on payload so maybe my figures got lost in translation. Still seems a lot of weight to be accounted for though.

Nah, reverse those figures.

3 over and 12 light would sound much more like it to me (although I wouldn't rule out 20 light to be honest).


Simply put, they are lacking the two things you need to lift stuff into the air. The first, everyone knows about, the second... well, it shouldn't be hard to figure out.

just got off the wires AND its being pulled from alot of news sources allready but i manage to get


article.wn.com...

PARIS - EADS on Friday denied reports it might pull out of its troubled A400M military transport plane program, saying it is rather looking to renegotiate parts of the contract. The European defense and aerospace...

and


www.aol.in...

PARIS (AP) - Defense and aerospace giant EADS called Friday for a ``new approach'' for its embattled A400M program, in which the first delivery of the military transport plane would come no sooner than 2012.

EADS and its Airbus Military unit said they are recommending a new start to production ``only once adequate maturity is reached, based on flight test results.'' In a statement, they said Airbus Military is working with engine developers ``to firm up a date for the first flight.''

with governments expecting delivery in the firm fixed price contract within 18 months EADS are in deep #.

This weeks AWST has a bit on how France is trying to exert politcal pressure to save the aiframe in light of recent comments by the UK and others about the deal.

EADS admitted that delays to the program COULD lead to OCCAR canceling the A400 program. They think that it's unlikely that it will, but they have a contractual right to cancel their orders on 1 April, if all the member nations agree.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
EADS admitted that delays to the program COULD lead to OCCAR canceling the A400 program. They think that it's unlikely that it will, but they have a contractual right to cancel their orders on 1 April, if all the member nations agree.

Its a bluff IMHO they are trying to milk more money out of member nations. It will be interesting to see the more vocal critics at the MOD in the UK either decide to pull out which may drive the final nail in the coffin of the program, or they cave in and offer up more $$$$ for the airframe.

Its just deserts IMHO given the general shadyness that revolved around the engine selection.

reply to post by FredT


At least one person is saying that the general shape of the economy and having the C-17 and C-130J out there may convince at least one country to pull out. If that happens that may leave OCCAR with no choice but to use the cancel option.

reply to post by Zaphod58


Yeah I agree. Rumor has it that lockmart is being very very agressive with the pricing for the 130J and If Boeing was smart they should offer up the C-17 at or near cost to simply keep the line open.

Im trying to find data on the relative costs of what EADS is proposing versus the current cost of the C-17. I thought I saw they were getting close.

THis is an interesting read BTW
www.fas.org...

Its not directly realted but the USAF spend 170 million to lease An-124's

Current costs per A400M aircraft are placed at at EUR 145 million,www.defenseindustrydaily.com...

Its not clear if this includes any extra that EADS wants above or this is as I am assuming the intial contract

Ive heard that Boeing quoting 185 million right now but cannot find a source. Even at 200 million per copy its still pretty close IMHO given the improvement in capacity.

The last C-17 the UK RAF brought was £130 million ($267 million) contracted at end of 2007, The UK RAF price is always a lot more the than the USAF I assume because the USAF per plane price doesn't include the develpment cost and I think some of the system cost is listed seperate.
Since the £ has nosed dived since then it would now be about £190 million in euros that's about 205 million. The £ hasn't fallen as far against the euro.

Also depends on if you need plane numbers or payload, probably would need a mix of C-17 and C-130J.

The C-17 was bought at $202.3 million at fiscal 1998 constant dollars for the USAF. That was for 174 aircraft.

The C-130J runs about $45-70 million per aircraft. A mix of the two would come out to a better deal than the A400 as it currently stands in my opinion.

Just read through an AWST article about the A400.

French officals are looking at intern transport needs and say the that search will "Priviledge European Solutions"

This is exactly the same attitude towards "a European Engine" that basically had Airbus telling the competiton what Pratt Canada had offered and allowed them to rebid the contract.

Funny when the US congress says no to an Airbus tanker we get all this anti US rancor but when fortress Europe does it its all fine and dandy

If its good for the goose...............................

The difference is , this is just france who were the ones to benefit most from the europrop crap - i do believe the UK wanted the P&W engines because it works.

Also would of been interesting to think if P&WC would of created the same delay in the engine tests that put the program almost 8 months behind alone.

Originally posted by FredT
This is exactly the same attitude towards "a European Engine" that basically had Airbus telling the competiton what Pratt Canada had offered and allowed them to rebid the contract.

Funny when the US congress says no to an Airbus tanker we get all this anti US rancor but when fortress Europe does it its all fine and dandy

The engine is being used as an excuse to cover other problems....


Because Airbus didn't build the engines.


(I'm NOT saying there are not problems with the engines - but they aren't even the most significant problems with the aircraft)

reply to post by kilcoo316


and my secret squirrel has bigger ollocks than your secret squirrel


maybe , just maybe , in coashed termanology , actually give a possible indicition as to the underlying reason why the A400 will get cancelled;

i mean get further delayed till everyone has had enough and buys boeing.

All four engines have been run, and low speed taxi tests completed. The pilots said that the aircraft was "extremely responsive" during taxi tests. It was taxied at 20kts, with turns, and backed up with no problems. Airbus is looking at around mid-December for first flight (week 50).

There is a press conference on the first flight tomorrow. At the same time the German media group Focus is claiming the entire program is facing cancellation in the face of overruns as high as $8B.

Congratulations to Airbus on a successful first flight.

Reporting is Airbus lost roughly $1.5 Billion this year, thanks in large part to the ongoing Grizzly debacle and bribery probe. Yikes.

Janes

Yahoo

During 2019, 14 A400M military transport aircraft were delivered in line with the latest delivery schedule, bringing the in-service fleet to 88 aircraft at year-end. Several key milestones towards full capability were achieved in the year, including the simultaneous deployment of paratroopers and helicopter air-to-air refuelling dry contacts. In 2020, development activities will continue towards achieving the revised capability roadmap. Retrofit activities are progressing in line with the customer-agreed plan. While the rebaselining of the A400M programme was completed and significant progress has been made on technical capabilities, the outlook is increasingly challenging on exports during the launch contract phase, also in light of the repeatedly extended German export ban to Saudi Arabia. As a result, the Company has reassessed its export assumptions on future export deliveries for the launch contract phase and recognised a charge of € 1.2 billion in the fourth quarter of 2019.