Chavez tells Rice: 'Don't mess with me, Girl!'

Keep an eye on the alliance between Chavez and Morales of Bolivia.

This is why the Chilean’s receipt of 2 [urlwww.signonsandiego.com...]F-16s[/url] is a big issue down there.

They are both a couple of loose cannons.

deltaboy said:

In any case, if Chavez continues to be paranoid against the world, and even against his own people, it could spark a crisis in Venezuela. The 2002 massive protests which Chavez manage to successful put down along with the attempted coup shows that the people does not have much patience.

Uh, Hugo was democratically elected, which kind of blows a hole into your massive protest argument.
I take it you know next to nothing on this coup attempt, and are just jumping on the anti-Chavez band wagon. I suggest you do some non-biased research on this matter.
Chavez is not paranoid against the world, just the USA mostly, and I don't blame him one bit, paranoia can be good for self preservation.

Who do you believe more honest:
Bush
or
Chavez

Chavez has his thong in a knot here lately. I'm pretty sure there are many in the current admin. who would like to see a little coup in his country and if I'm right, it has been tried more than sevral times. Shooting his mouth off at Condi, is not the best way to get on her good side. You have to give credit where it is due and Condi should get pretty much. Besides, who would not want to be vamped by her lovely eyes!.

Saphronia would get my 4th WATS if I had one.

The ideal solution for Chavez would lie in moderation. You cannot root only for the poor, and you definately should hold allegence to more than $. He needs to find the fine line between that has been lost over all these years of economic oppression. That same line is moving further and further towards the rich worldwide. How can we see Chavez as anything other than a breath of fresh air into the stale garbage that has been South American leaders?

Anyone versed in South American economics and the US gov't/corporate involvements in these economics should know that Chavez is truely a modern day Robin Hood. Robin Hood definately made a lot of unpopular noise, but was he the bad guy?

Ill put money on rice knocking out Chavez. Hes all talk, no action, typical little punk.

Train

Thanks for a very constructive post train. I feel like I am 10 times smarter having heard that response. Another valued poster on ATS.

Saphronia:
Two mistakes
1) that Cuba (cubans) have self determination under Castro! Escuse me?!?! at the point of a gun? with only one candidate (Castro) in what they call elections, and any disident (anyone questioning the unfair system) thrown in jail? Have you been to Cuba? Have you spoken to regular cubans? I have, on both accounts.
2) You believe the word "Blockade" used by Castro. It is incorrect; the truth is that the US has an embargo E-M-B-A-R-G-O! meaning only us, he cannot do bussiness with the USA. only one of over 150 countries. He can freely do bussiness with any of the other +150 countries out there with no restriction and still his people starve and risk their lives just to be able to get out.
The USA may not be perfect, and we are guilty of many ills, but we are not responsible for the failure of a system that has not worked; ever!, not even once. The only "communist" systems that seem to work, are those that still claim to be, but their economies and politics are more towards the right wing socialism side than anything else (example China and many others that are following now like Vietnam and many socialist block countries in Eastern Europe)


BTW (on other subject in this thread) Hugo Chavez is benefiting from oil at $60/barrell versus $18/barrell when he took power, if not for that, he would be in even more trouble than he is, his economy is now 65% of what it was before him. I have many Venezuelan friends, and you have to get your news from them, what happened at the voting booths; WHAT REALLY HAPPENED WHE JIMMY CARTER WAS NOT AROUND!

P.S.: I love cuban cigars which I smoke often since I travel a lot (I am a pilot) I would love for the embargo to go away and be able to smoke when I want and what I want in the US without breaking the law. I do believe the embargo is counterproductive, it is not helping anyone but Castro (sable rattling and blaming it for everything) and it should be lifted.

Originally posted by Toadmund
Uh, Hugo was democratically elected, which kind of blows a hole into your massive protest argument.
I take it you know next to nothing on this coup attempt, and are just jumping on the anti-Chavez band wagon. I suggest you do some non-biased research on this matter.

He may be democratically elected, but as I say, there is not much patience, as before the 2002 massive protests which he successfully put down. He also fought against the coup. Ironically, he lead a coup himself back in 1992.

news.bbc.co.uk...

Mr Chavez's "revolution" had little real impact on the lives of ordinary Venezuelans, who still suffer from chronic poverty and widespread unemployment despite the country's oil wealth.

From coup-leader to president

The ex-paratrooper's journey along the road to power has been an eventful one.

In February 1992, he led an attempt to overthrow the government of President Carlos Andres Perez amid growing anger at economic austerity measures.

The foundations for that failed coup had been laid a decade earlier, when Mr Chavez and a group of fellow military officers founded a secret movement named after the South American independence leader, Simon Bolivar.

The February revolt by members of the Revolutionary Bolivarian Movement claimed 18 lives and left 60 injured before Mr Chavez gave himself up.

He was languishing in a military jail when his associates tried again to seize power nine months later.

That second coup attempt, in November 1992, was crushed as well, but only after the rebels had captured a TV station and broadcast a videotape of their leader announcing the fall of the government.

Mr Chavez spent two years in prison before being granted a pardon.

He then relaunched his party as the Movement of the Fifth Republic and made the transition from soldier to politician.

Just because he was elected by the majority of the people doesn't mean he is a good leader, look at Hitler, Hamas, and George W. Bush.(His second election, not the first one where he lost to Gore by half a million)

Look at his actions!

Kicked out US Oil Barons and replaced them with his own countrymen.

Took money from the rich and gave it to the poor.

Kept in power after a CIA lead coup that failed.

Tries to debate political opponets who either don't show up or place a bomb in a car and try to kill Chavez ala Hamas style.

Ok, so far his actions only seem negative if you are a republican in America, but!!!!

Chavez gives oil away to millions in trade for doctors, teachers, and construction workers to any country willing to make the deal, sadly only countries like Cuba and Ghana were willing to make the deal as Bush told American companies not to trade with Chavez.

Chavez sells oil cheap to New England states, of course they vote democrat so what do you expect? WHy not to Texas? Sure they don't have high heating bills in winter, and sure there are oil fields in Texas so they have their own, but why not Texas? Why to only states that get cold in winter and don't have their own oil fields?

Chavez said that if his opponets won't participate in an election he will change the law so he can run for more then two terms since the last election no opponets would run because they couldn't pull a Haiti.(Recently caught burning ballots, ala Jeb Bush in Florida style) Chavez obviously wants to become supreme ruler for as long as the people are willing to vote for him.

Hmmm, I can't even put enough conservative spin on that stuff to make it look bad! Dang man, his opponets won't run because Chavez with the group Jimmy Carter works for made sure no one would tamper with the votes? He gave oil away for doctors and teachers and people who could build things in his country? Sold barrels of oil cheap to New England states since Bush wasn't doing anything about the gouging of prices? WTF is wrong with republicans, they must have some strong brainwashing pills.

It's all a lot of hot air, meant mainly for domestic and regional consumption. He's not exactly a raving lunatic, but he's not doing his people any good either. Forget China for the moment; the US is the world's biggest and most important market for the rest of the world to market and sell it's produce in. Le'ts be honest here, Venezuela's really not got a lot going for it at the moment; both inflation and unemployment remain fundamental problems.

Venezuela could certainly do with a helping hand and an undrestanding attitude from the Americans, but I doubt the Americans want to be seen dealing with such an unstable and outspoken leader.

LOLOLO watch out merrycans, dont choke on Chavez !

He is a human being, which can not be said for current US administration

He is not doing his country any good? He is helping them by keeping the oppressive hand of the US out of their economy! You guys apparantly dont understand how our businesses and policies work down there. Do you honestly think any money from an America corporation goes back into the Venezuelan economy? He only wants to control his own country. No puppet strings.

I will do all of you uninformed people a huge favor.

We have a nice little thread going, complete with a Venezuelan and an Argentine. If you really want to know how people feel about Chevez, without this currupt political BS you have been fed it would serve you to browse around here: www.abovetopsecret.com...'

Originally posted by DaFunk13
He is not doing his country any good? He is helping them by keeping the oppressive hand of the US out of their economy! You guys apparantly dont understand how our businesses and policies work down there. Do you honestly think any money from an America corporation goes back into the Venezuelan economy? He only wants to control his own country. No puppet strings.

I will do all of you uninformed people a huge favor.

We have a nice little thread going, complete with a Venezuelan and an Argentine. If you really want to know how people feel about Chevez, without this currupt political BS you have been fed it would serve you to browse around here: www.abovetopsecret.com...'

Fidel's become adept at it, as has Kim Jong Il, and now Chavez's trying his hand at it; jumping up and down and making a fuss all for domestic and regional consumption. One of the reasons why North Korea's in such a poor state is because it's cut itself from the rest of the world's markets. Cuba hasn't got any access to the US, Canada or Europe either and now it's as if Chavez WANTS the Americans and Europeans to regard him as a problem and to stop dealing with Venezuela, commerically.

Whether we like it or not, it's a small world out there; an interconnected world. Chavez is doing his people a dis-service, not brightening their futures, or resolving Venezuela's high rates of inflation, unemployment and poverty.

Most of Venezuelas ails are our fault! Research corporate involvement in South America all together. I think you will realize why Chavez does want our "help." Uncle Sam is not a generous as you think.

Ever notice that every time a country decides it doesnt want our "help" they become bad guys? Who the hell is helping who?

Originally posted by DaFunk13
Most of Venezuelas ails are our fault! Research corporate involvement in South America all together. I think you will realize why Chavez does want our "help." Uncle Sam is not a generous as you think.

Ever notice that every time a country decides it doesnt want our "help" they become bad guys? Who the hell is helping who?

That's fanciful. He may be blaming Venezuelas problems on Washington and corporate America, but he's only doing so because his administration hasn't yet quite worked out how they're going to fulfill the election promises they made to the electorate.

Another Day in the Empire



Thus when SS Condi Rice mentions “democracy” in Venezuela, we have a pretty good idea of what she is talking about—undermining and eventually overthrowing the democratically elected government of Hugo Chávez. For the neoliberals and neocons, Chávez stands in the way of the Free Trade Area of the Americas (or “free trade,” as in freedom for globalist transnational corporations and international bankers and loan sharks to loot and pillage the natural resources, including Venezuela’s oil, of the Americas). In an effort to demonize Chávez, SS Rice “said that Venezuela and Cuba are ’sidekicks’ of Iran and dangers to Latin American democracies,” in other words, for the Straussian neocons, Venezuela is a junior partner of the axis of evil and will be attacked in similar fashion. “Rice also made reference to suspicions that Venezuela was linked to a recent political crisis in Nicaragua,” the Post Chronicle reports. Nicaragua, of course, was brutally attacked by Reagan neocons through their Contra proxy, resulting in the murder of 30,000-50,000 innocent Nicaraguans in the 1980s (while U.S. supported death squads in neighboring El Salvador and Guatemala claimed the lives of 70,000 and 100,000 respectively).

Well, I think that mister Kurt Nimmo NAILED it with this Statement.

Nobody wants an independant Venezuela - I mean nobody in the world of so-called Free Trade. And if you are not WITH US on this Free Trade stuff, they you are most definetly in bed with the Terrorists, the Evildoers, a Junior partner of the Axis of Evil, an anti-Democratic Hostile Regime, that NEEDS to be changed as soon as possible.

President Chavez Said:

"We are breaking the imperialist chains that bound us!"

And that is Exactly what he is Doing.

What's the Empire's next move?

I am sure that Venezual is very Interesting in the view of US foreign geo-strategic & economic politricks, since they are selling it about 1.5 million barrels per day...

Originally posted by Lanton
That's fanciful. He may be blaming Venezuelas problems on Washington and corporate America, but he's only doing so because his administration hasn't yet quite worked out how they're going to fulfill the election promises they made to the electorate.

Or its because it is true, you have no idea what you are talking about, and it is going to take a whole lot longer than 3-4 years to fix all of the problems that have been ignored for years and years. But thanks for adding something constructive.

And thanks for that link Souljah.