Are cartoons the news media’s way of maligning civil protest?

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posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 07:35 PM
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There have been a lot of instances lately where numbers of people are dying in so called “cartoon riots” isn’t it a little odd that the only demonstrations that we hear about in the news are ones that are about cartoons. The numbers of dead throughout the Middle East and South Asia is increasing daily. We never hear about the numbers dying in riots or protests otherwise. Those that aren’t over cartoons I mean. Maybe the western media is simply trying to give us what they want us to hear.

My other fear is that these protests are over much more than these cartoons (duh), but the news media wants to denigrate those lives lost by saying that they died over a cartoon. This would be even worse, in my opinion, because those who did make it to the frontlines of the media are not seen as having died for the cause of freedom (or whatever they probably did die for) but instead seen as dying because they were mad at a cartoon.




posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 07:48 PM
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That is the motto of Corporate Press Releases. Notice how I avoided using the term "Journalism" because that is an artform which is now mostly relegated to Op/Ed pieces these days as it's always about contentious issues and to avoid Libel damages the Papers and Programs label them as Op/Ed to avoid it saying it was the opinion of this one person and not the Corporation. NEways...

Regular protests are boring and people just roll their eyes and switch to another channel. They (the Corporate Execs) are well aware of this as they see the numbers in 15 minute intervals(or even less now I dunno) so they try to sensationlize it as much as possible. I really hope Citizen Journalism changes that though.

So no I disagree, they are showing us what WE want to see not what they want us to see. They are afterall in the news business.



posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 08:39 PM
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Originally posted by Rasobasi420
The numbers of dead throughout the Middle East and South Asia is increasing daily. We never hear about the numbers dying in riots or protests otherwise. Those that aren’t over cartoons I mean. Maybe the western media is simply trying to give us what they want us to hear.
< snip >
My other fear is that these protests are over much more than these cartoons (duh), but the news media wants to denigrate those lives lost by saying that they died over a cartoon. This would be even worse, in my opinion, because those who did make it to the frontlines of the media are not seen as having died for the cause of freedom (or whatever they probably did die for) but instead seen as dying because they were mad at a cartoon.

Well, it is true. They did die over a cartoon. But is wasn't in the cause of freedom - just the opposite. It was because they want to oppress those who do not worship Allah.

How can I say that with confidence? Because of the hundreds of anti-west and anti-Israeli cartoons that are regularly posted by these same protestors. That equals hypocrisy, imo.

The media is not denigrating their lives. The media is celebrating our freedom of speech and religion.



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 06:40 AM
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Originally posted by jsobecky
Well, it is true. They did die over a cartoon. But is wasn't in the cause of freedom - just the opposite. It was because they want to oppress those who do not worship Allah.

How can I say that with confidence? Because of the hundreds of anti-west and anti-Israeli cartoons that are regularly posted by these same protestors. That equals hypocrisy, imo.

The media is not denigrating their lives. The media is celebrating our freedom of speech and religion.


You don't see it as a little odd that no other protests have had the media coverage that these do? Why isn't it covered when people die in protests over the occupation of Iraq, or the Abu Ghraib incidents. These seem like more valid protests. Are we to believe that there are no protests other protests in which people die?

It seems very obvious that the media is either strategicly picking it's stories to make them Middle Eastern activists look like they're not willing to die over anything but cartoons. Or these are much bigger protests, with more serious subjects at the core than cartoons, but we're being told that it's over cartoons because it makes us chuckle rather that worry, or sympathise with those protesting.



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 06:54 AM
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Here's an article on BBC written by their Pakistani correspondent. It appears there may be a hidden motive, not merely just over the cartoons.


Hidden Motives Behind Cartoon Riots

[...]

Pakistani observers point out that while the protests may have done little to bring the alleged blasphemers under pressure they have certainly conveyed the destructive potential of injured religious sentiment to the outside world.

"Is this the image of ourselves that we want to paint for the outside world?" Punjab Chief Minister Pervez Ellahi asked of the riots in Lahore.

"Are we trying to convince the West that Muslims are indeed violent people?"

Maybe not, but perhaps Pakistan's religious leadership may not be averse to the idea of demonstrating to the world that Pakistanis remain a deeply religious people despite Gen Musharraf's liberal rhetoric.

And if demonstrating this requires arson and looting, it may be a small price in the mind of the country's religious leadership for emphasising an orthodox cultural agenda which has been under consistent pressure since the September 2001 attacks on the US.

[...]

Western observers may be baffled at the images of Muslim rioters burning the properties of other Muslims in protest at sacrilege committed by Danes.

But they may find the situation easier to understand if they give a thought to what might be the real target of the rioters.

Is it a bunch of nameless and faceless cartoonists living in Denmark or a government at home which is threatening their orthodoxy with its liberal rhetoric?



And here's an article from the official Pakistani government website:-


Publication of blasphemous caricatures eroding West's goodwill: President

[...]

Replying to a question, he said such blasphemous acts were making militant elements to gain ground. "They are made to gain ground by such acts, they will gain ground, we are making them gain ground," he added. On the violence during protests in Pakistan, the President said the protestors were infiltrated by those who had political agendas and they expanded the scope of the protest against this blasphemous act to let down the government. Looting shops was not the job of anyone who is agitating against blasphemy, he said.

[...]


[edit - to add Pakistani article]

[edit on 18-2-2006 by Beachcoma]



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 08:41 AM
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Originally posted by Rasobasi420
You don't see it as a little odd that no other protests have had the media coverage that these do? Why isn't it covered when people die in protests over the occupation of Iraq, or the Abu Ghraib incidents. These seem like more valid protests. Are we to believe that there are no protests other protests in which people die?

It seems very obvious that the media is either strategicly picking it's stories to make them Middle Eastern activists look like they're not willing to die over anything but cartoons. Or these are much bigger protests, with more serious subjects at the core than cartoons, but we're being told that it's over cartoons because it makes us chuckle rather that worry, or sympathise with those protesting.

Well, I thought about this before I posted my first reply. I can't recall any other protests, especially deadly ones, that you allude to. Can you name some?

The media coverage doesn't make me, or anyone I know, chuckle. It does bring out a deep contempt for those rioters, though. What is there to sympathize with? They have no right to destroy property and to murder people because they are "offended" about a drawing.

Don't you see how hypocritical these rioters are? They constantly deride Christianity and the Israeli people with disgusting cartoons and drawings. Is it OK for them to do it? Then how can you ask for our sympathy?



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 09:16 AM
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When events such as political resignations/terminations begin to occur, creditability lends itself to the sad reality of the stories:


ROME (Reuters) - Italy's Reforms Minister Roberto Calderoli resigned on Saturday following deadly clashes in Libya over cartoons of the Prophet Mohammad that he had made into T-shirts and wore on state television, a spokesman said....
Reuters, February 18, 2006

The above example from the following deadly protest:


TRIPOLI, Libya - Libya suspended the interior minister Saturday, citing an "excessive use of force" in riots the day before that left at least 10 people dead in the bloodiest protest yet against the Prophet Muhammad cartoons that have roiled the Muslim world...
Associated Press, February 18, 2006.


However, I do agree with the notion that the ME ‘groups’ use the media much more for a propaganda advantage more effectively than western nations; this may be changing:


"Our enemies have skilfully adapted to fighting wars in today's media age, but... our country has not," he said.
Mr Rumsfeld said al-Qaeda and other Islamic extremists were bombarding Muslims with negative images of the West, which had poisoned the public view of the US.
The US must fight back by operating a more effective, 24-hour propaganda machine, or risk a "dangerous deficiency," he said....
BBC, February 17, 2006.


Which will probably lead to more:


Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice asked Congress yesterday to provide $75 million in emergency funding to step up pressure on the Iranian government, including expanding radio and television broadcasts into Iran and promoting internal opposition to the rule of religious leaders...

Washing Post, February 16, 2006


Unfortunately, the riots appear to be superficially over what they appear to be…over culturally offensive cartoons. The real question is: How are these cartoons being used to polarize extremists and push moderates over the fence?

Imo, there is a much broader picture than the one being painted by the 'press'.

mg



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 09:23 AM
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I think the reason these protests are so much in the news is because they shine a light on radical Islam, which supports the current administration's agenda. After all, if they can get our hatred up for all Muslims, then we will support the War in Iraq the the future war in Iran.

However, the 1000-man protests right here in the USA against the war aren't covered at all because that would lower support for the wars. It's all about the governmental control of the media and the ease at which the American mind and loyalty are swayed.

Ever wonder why the Danish cartoon protest signs held by Middle Easterners are in English?


We are being played.



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 11:31 AM
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Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
I think the reason these protests are so much in the news is because they shine a light on radical Islam, which supports the current administration's agenda. After all, if they can get our hatred up for all Muslims, then we will support the War in Iraq the the future war in Iran.

However, the 1000-man protests right here in the USA against the war aren't covered at all because that would lower support for the wars. It's all about the governmental control of the media and the ease at which the American mind and loyalty are swayed.

Ever wonder why the Danish cartoon protest signs held by Middle Easterners are in English?


We are being played.

The signs were in English for the same reason that the riots continue: someone is trying desperately to incite the west to react to this violence.

So far, western response has been admirable. But the moment that it escalates to retaliation of any sort, it will be a blank check for the fanatical muslims to riot even more violently.

MSM is strongly liberal in the US. Witness the disdain some show when Fox News is mentioned. The gov.t doesn't need to stoke the fires of contempt for fanatical muslims; it's already at it's peak. And Joe Six-pack doesn't need to know anything more than the fact that some wackos are burning and killing over a cartoon. He's made up his mind; he doesn't need to be convinced on a daily basis. He's smarter than he is given credit for.



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 11:53 AM
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Originally posted by jsobecky
The signs were in English for the same reason that the riots continue: someone is trying desperately to incite the west to react to this violence.


Who?



And Joe Six-pack doesn't need to know anything more than the fact that some wackos are burning and killing over a cartoon. He's made up his mind; he doesn't need to be convinced on a daily basis. He's smarter than he is given credit for.


Maybe Joe doesn't but Amy fence-sitter does. The mass coverage of violent, dark-skinned people against America's freedom of speech touches the brains and hearts of liberals in America. TRUST ME!!! I'm not a fence-sitter, but I have found myself getting frustrated and grouping all Muslims together and that's against everything I believe in.

I KNOW, logically, that the vast majority of Muslims are peaceful. I've know them! They're my friends! But this cartoon fiasco has gotten my hackles up. The media is having an effect on me! And I consider it brainwashing.

The purpose of it is to turn the West against Muslims and promote our war on the Middle East, I'm convinced. Fortunately, I'm able to stay conscious about it and not fall for the propaganda.



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 02:26 PM
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Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
I'm not a fence-sitter, but I have found myself getting frustrated and grouping all Muslims together and that's against everything I believe in.

You shouldn't let it affect you like that - you're smarter than that.


The media is having an effect on me! And I consider it brainwashing.

The purpose of it is to turn the West against Muslims and promote our war on the Middle East, I'm convinced. Fortunately, I'm able to stay conscious about it and not fall for the propaganda.

Well, it's having the opposite effect. It's whipping up the furor of the muslims. I just saw that thousands were protesting in London today. What does Britain have to do with the cartoons? Nothing. Pakistan has outlawed protests in Islamabad. So what is the media supposed to report?



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 09:02 PM
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jsobecky - who is "trying desperately to incite the west to react to this violence"? If it's not our government, as I suspect, who do you think it is?

I know I shouldn't let it effect me, but I get really protective of the Constitution, you know? It's human nature to say. "It's 'them' who are causing the problem" It's more difficult to remember that it's individuals who are reacting this way and that we cannot blanket a religion with a label because of the actions of a few.

And yes, the Muslim extremists are rioting, but I really think it's only a matter of time before non-Muslims get so fired up over all this that they'll start physical stuff, too.

The media could report on the anti-war protests going on right here, but that doesn't serve their agenda.



posted on Feb, 19 2006 @ 09:35 AM
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I think it's the imam's doing it. And Iran is a big antagonist also. Why? Because they want to whip up support for their nuclear program.

Once again, I don't see many people labeling all of islam as fanatical. There are a few, but most people understand that it's a sub-set of muslims responsible for the violence.

The riots are increasing in number, instead of levelling off or decreasing. The west remains fairly calm. We have not responded the way the fanatics want us to respond. This frustrates them, much like Rumplestiltskin stomping his foot until he finally tore himself in two.



posted on Feb, 19 2006 @ 07:30 PM
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Jsobecky, I noticed your George Orwell quote. I have another George Orwell quote that may fit
"Early in life I had noticed that no event is ever correctly reported in a newspaper. "



posted on Feb, 19 2006 @ 08:23 PM
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Yes, I've seen that quote. What relevance does it have to the thread? Surely you're not implying that the riots aren't really happening, are you?

I rarely read the papers anymore, btw. The news is stale by the time it reaches the reader.



posted on Feb, 19 2006 @ 11:24 PM
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I think what Rasobasi420 is trying to say is that the media puts a spin on it's reports to the point that it appears worse than it is. For example CNN reported that "Malaysia says the cartoons are an attack on Islam".

I am from Malaysia and I can tell you straight away that's bull. Certain protesters said that. But the report makes it look like it's the government's position, therefore Malaysia's official position.

So the point is if they can spin that little bit of news, don't you think it's quite reasonable to assume they'd spin everything else?

You know what I think about this whole thing? I think the western media is taking advantage of this whole cartoon controversy to paint muslims in a bad light and I think that radical opposition elements within the countries that are rioting are taking advantage of this controversy to mobilize support for their cause and destabilize their governments.

Who loses the most? The moderate muslim majority.



posted on Feb, 21 2006 @ 06:28 AM
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Originally posted by Beachcoma
I think what Rasobasi420 is trying to say is that the media puts a spin on it's reports to the point that it appears worse than it is. For example CNN reported that "Malaysia says the cartoons are an attack on Islam".

I am from Malaysia and I can tell you straight away that's bull. Certain protesters said that. But the report makes it look like it's the government's position, therefore Malaysia's official position.

Worse than it is? I suppose it could be worse that torching embassies and murdering people, but I'm not sure how much worse.



So the point is if they can spin that little bit of news, don't you think it's quite reasonable to assume they'd spin everything else?

They could, but I haven't seen them doing it yet in this case.

You're saying that someone reading that headline will come to the conclusion that the gov't. of Malaysia holds that position. So what? Any discerning reader that cared about that would certainly delve deeper to learn the true position of the Malaysian gov't. But I doubt whether it matters to many outsiders whether it was the gov't. or the rioters that said that.

Besides, media spin isn't something new, you know.



You know what I think about this whole thing? I think the western media is taking advantage of this whole cartoon controversy to paint muslims in a bad light and I think that radical opposition elements within the countries that are rioting are taking advantage of this controversy to mobilize support for their cause and destabilize their governments.

Who loses the most? The moderate muslim majority.

So, what is the "official" position of the gov't.? Or the position of the rioters? Those are the real questions. Can you answer them?

Once again, I have to disagree with the notion that the western media is taking advantage of the bad behavior of these fanatics. The moderates are not doing the rioting, it's the fanatics who are. Trying to shift blame onto the media is a ploy to shift responsibility away from those responsible for the destruction. It won't work.

Who loses the most? The moderate muslims and the westerm world. Because the real battle is for the hearts and minds of the moderates. If the fanatics win their sympathy and support, this can easily turn into a full-blown religious war.

So, this "media spin" ploy doesn't cut it, imo.



posted on Feb, 21 2006 @ 07:39 AM
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Originally posted by jsobecky
So what? Any discerning reader that cared about that would certainly delve deeper to learn the true position of the Malaysian gov't. But I doubt whether it matters to many outsiders whether it was the gov't. or the rioters that said that.


So what? So what? What an ethnocentric point of view. Yes, a discerning reader would delve deeper. Unfortunately most people just take what they read in the papers as gospel. Besides, Malaysia is a small unimportant country on the world stage, most people wouldn't give two hoots what is up with the country, as proven by your statement. And just like you they'd assume there are riots going on here as well when the fact is it was a small protests organized by the opposition party leaders.

What is the official government position? The government thinks the cartoons are inappropriate, nothing more. What is the official position of the rioters? I don't know, there are no riots going on. What are you talking about? Rioters elsewhere? I don't know either but if you had payed attention to the details you might realise that the riots elsewhere are politically motivated.

I know media spin isn't new. And I'm not shifting the responsibility for the destruction caused by the rioters. What they are doing is wrong, how many times my I state this? You have totaly missed the point I was trying to present. What I was trying to say was that there is a spin in every single report that comes out these days. It's subtle, but it's there. Perhaps it's so subtle even you didn't spot it.



posted on Feb, 21 2006 @ 03:32 PM
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Originally posted by Beachcoma

Originally posted by jsobecky
So what? Any discerning reader that cared about that would certainly delve deeper to learn the true position of the Malaysian gov't. But I doubt whether it matters to many outsiders whether it was the gov't. or the rioters that said that.


So what? So what? What an ethnocentric point of view. Yes, a discerning reader would delve deeper. Unfortunately most people just take what they read in the papers as gospel. Besides, Malaysia is a small unimportant country on the world stage, most people wouldn't give two hoots what is up with the country, as proven by your statement. And just like you they'd assume there are riots going on here as well when the fact is it was a small protests organized by the opposition party leaders.

First of all, I'd appreciate it if you'd tone it down and stop with the personal attacks.

Most people don't care if it was ANYBODY'S gov't., not just Malaysia.
And if most people won't bother to delve deeper, what concern is that of mine? Am I supposed to force them to?

As far as me assuming there were riots going on there, well

For example CNN reported that "Malaysia says the cartoons are an attack on Islam".

I am from Malaysia and I can tell you straight away that's bull. Certain protesters said that. But the report makes it look like it's the government's position, therefore Malaysia's official position.

Guess who said that?


What is the official position of the rioters? I don't know, there are no riots going on. What are you talking about? Rioters elsewhere? I don't know either but if you had payed attention to the details you might realise that the riots elsewhere are politically motivated.

There you go with the personal attacks again.



What I was trying to say was that there is a spin in every single report that comes out these days. It's subtle, but it's there. Perhaps it's so subtle even you didn't spot it.

No kidding about the spin. Talk about stating the obvious, something everybody realizes. Not "subtle", as you state.

And there you go with the personal attacks yet again.
:shk:

[edit on 21-2-2006 by jsobecky]



posted on Feb, 21 2006 @ 10:43 PM
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Originally posted by jsobecky

Originally posted by Rasobasi420
The numbers of dead throughout the Middle East and South Asia is increasing daily. We never hear about the numbers dying in riots or protests otherwise. Those that aren’t over cartoons I mean. Maybe the western media is simply trying to give us what they want us to hear.
< snip >
My other fear is that these protests are over much more than these cartoons (duh), but the news media wants to denigrate those lives lost by saying that they died over a cartoon. This would be even worse, in my opinion, because those who did make it to the frontlines of the media are not seen as having died for the cause of freedom (or whatever they probably did die for) but instead seen as dying because they were mad at a cartoon.

Well, it is true. They did die over a cartoon. But is wasn't in the cause of freedom - just the opposite. It was because they want to oppress those who do not worship Allah.

How can I say that with confidence? Because of the hundreds of anti-west and anti-Israeli cartoons that are regularly posted by these same protestors. That equals hypocrisy, imo.

The media is not denigrating their lives. The media is celebrating our freedom of speech and religion.





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