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Do You Want To Know What Happens First Hand In Iraq!!

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posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 12:30 PM
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Originally Posted By: Beachcoma
Interesting. That's a serious case of mismanagement. Sub-con and sub-con some more. And then sub-con again. That sort of thing doesn't reflect well on the rest of the Americans there, does it? Unfortunately I don't see what the rank and file soldier could do about it.

I agree this is a serious case of mismanagement and there is nothing that us soldiers or citizens can do anything about. I believe this is why the cost of the war effort is so high as well as the rising price of gasoline.

Do you know that Iraqis pay the lowest price for gas worldwide at a mere 5 cents/gal. They pay this little because it is subsidized by the government, I don't understand why our government can't subsidize gas for us as well it's not like they don't have the money to do so.


Originally Posted By: Beachcoma
I'm curious about the complicity of the police and the insurgents/suiciders. Why do you think they are willingly aiding them? Have the police been infiltrated by the insurgents or is it because they themselves want you guys out of their country? If it's the former, what can be done? If it's the latter, I'm not sure if there's anything that can be done

As far as the complicity of the police I am not quite sure about but do believe that some are helping the insurgents. What there motives are I don't know but I do know that a lot of the citizens I come across as well as police are friendly and thank us all the time for helping them.

I wouldn't doubt that there are some that want us out of there or are quite simply insurgents. By saying insurgents I am talking about different groups. There are foreign fighters and then there are local thugs from different tribes and then Sadaam loyalists from his former regime.

The situation we are in there now is we are basically in the middle of a civil war now between the Shiites, Kurds, and Sunnis. This is causing a lot of turmoil internally these days and also sparking a lot of the conflict.




posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 06:34 PM
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Originally posted by marg6043

Originally posted by Dronetek

How can you support the soldiers when you dont believe in their mission? I just dont understand the logic behind that over used phrase.



I can answer that one, as a wife of a retired Marine I know that a soldier follow the orders of his comander in Chief as long as he under the US arm forces he has to do what he is told to do.

Regarless if he agree or not with what his comanidng in Chief stands for.

I can still support and sympatized with the soldiers of my country because the are following orders but that doesn't mean I have to agree with what their comanding in chief Alias the president of the US is using them for.

Very simple.




However, by not supporting the war you are giving the enemy hope and propaganda material. You are emboldening the enemy we are fighting so I don’t see how you reconcile that fact.



posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 07:38 PM
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I am glad that you are back and safe IncognitoGhostman. BTW, congrats on finding the love of your life.


Thank you for giving us an insight into what is going on over there now, and know that a lot more Americans support you and the rest of our troops nomatter what you hear in the media. In my new job i get to go all over the west and Northwest of the US, and I see everywhere the support that the people give our troops in Iraq. The media doesn't show this because "it is boring for them", they only prefer to show death and destruction and never show any of the good things happening over there.

Welcome home brother.


Luis.



posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 10:06 PM
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USMC Vet, 1990-1994. Honorable Discharge. Many medals, ribbons, including Combat Expeditionary, Expert (x4) Rifleman. Served during Gulf War, Somalia. In fact, I volunteered right out of boot camp to be 'sent' to Iraq. I literally stood up in my avionics class and said that. Although I was told to sit my ass down and learn what Good old Uncle S had in store for me, I was willing to jump out of an airplane THAT DAMNED SECOND for my brothers (and sisters) in Arms. I loved them that much, simply not because I was mind-controlled or brain-washed -- nosir, because I was part of a team for the first time in my life that had common goals (to defend), common ambitions (to excel at everything possible) and common ideals (freedom, democracy and love of one's country).

Today, some 12 years later, I would gladly die for my country, over and over (lol) again, because I love the F-Ing United States of Freaking America. In that sense, I am the most loyal Patriot Uncle Sam could call upon.

Would there ever be another invasion by the British, or the Chinese, or by any Other Power in the World against our soil, or our interests, you'd better believe I'd be breaking out my cammies, shining up my boots and cleaning my trusty M16. And I'd do with with pride and joy, in the knowledge that this is what makes and allows for freedom of our great country.

For Incog, I wholeheartedly wish I could give him a brotherly hug and welcome him back to the Good Ol'e US of A, in one piece no doubt.

This is where it stops for me. Going past this point I have so many criticisms of the Bush administration, of our national policy, that it's going to only end up negative and a shout fest. Whatever you believe, if you're in this county, be thankful for the men and women in Military Service who place their asses on the line each and every second of each and every day, whether in Iraq or Alaska, Afghanistan or Indiana. May we be blessed continually with the devotion and dedicated that our armed forces offer to our country.

There I'll stop.

Wait, no ... one more thing ...


Originally posted by Vekar
...(talking about Incog's original post)...

"oh look who I am so you should repsect me more than anyone else"


You're, what, 18, maybe 21 max? You've undoubtedly never served your country, let alone served anyone but yourself. Why would you attack someone in this manner when they don't deserve your stinging words and harsh criticism?

Honestly I hope when you die you are cremated. I hope the ashes get pressed into service in some future war as a ceramic plate inserted into a flak jacket which blocks a bullet from a person intent on killing a solider, sailor, airmen or marine who is only doing their job.

Note that Incog didn't sign the dotted line to go kill Iraqi babies you freaking -edit-. No Sir, he signed to offer his assistance to Uncle Sam, because of a small bit of patriotism, a small bit of pride, and possible a small bit of loyalty to his nation and his ideals of freedom, democracy and 'a better world'. Even that small amount [which I suspect is huge, actually from his humble tone] is more than the unidentifiable amount in your black and crusty heart.



[edit on 17-2-2006 by parrhesia]



posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 11:10 PM
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mods? a warn or three for g.i. joe, here?


Mod edit:

removing offensive quoted material and big quote

[edit on 17-2-2006 by parrhesia]

edited to remove repetition of offensive 'tasteless crap'. and to thank parrhesia for the thankless task of taking out the garbage.


[edit on 18-2-2006 by billybob]



posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 11:23 PM
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Originally posted by billybob

mods? a warn or three for g.i. joe, here?

i mean, 'turd munching homo' is about as in appropriate as you can get.


Ouch. Homo is a bad word? It *can* mean Homosapien, or homogenous or homonid. You know. Sheesh.



posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 11:28 PM
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Good one Next, I couldn't have put it in a better way. I hate ungrateful people, especially callous -edit- such as Vekar. Let him go to his starbucks drink "la revolucion" capuccinos or visit abortion clinic to gloat over dead fetuses being used for toothpaste ( or whatever some -edit- loves to do in his spare time).

Review This.

Mod edit: removing trash

[edit on 17-2-2006 by parrhesia]



posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 11:37 PM
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-snipslur- wow, you geniuses are on a roll.

--ditto last edit. if you want to play with the big boys, you have to curb your juvenile tongues, web travellers.--

[edit on 18-2-2006 by billybob]



posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 11:48 PM
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Originally posted by Nakash
Good one Next, I couldn't have put it in a better way. I hate ungrateful people, especially callous jackoffs such as Vekar. Let him go to his starbucks drink "la revolucion" capuccinos or visit abortion clinic to gloat over dead fetuses being used for toothpaste ( or whatever some liberal fag loves to do in his spare time).



Ouch, that was harsh, but I feal no pity for Vekar. Like I said earlier, all Vekar does is pop into a thread, through out a couple insults and goes to a new thread never to return. That is his pattern. There are only a handful of threads that he post in more then once.


Again incognito, thanks for every thing, and thanks to all the other brave men and women that make it possible for people like Vekar to be able to insult and live to talk about it.

If he were to be living in a place like Iraq and started talking poorly of Saddam before he was taking out of power like he does about Bush he no doubt would have been killed by Saddam or any other dictator for that matter.



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 08:51 AM
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Originally posted by billybob
-snipslur- wow, you geniuses


Actually, 135 on IQ test at age 12? Yah, I'd say I'm pretty friggin smart. But then again, intelligence isn't everything.


are on a roll.


That's how doers *do*. They 'roll' baby, they roll.


--ditto last edit. if you want to play with the big boys, you have to curb your juvenile tongues, web travellers.--


It's probably safe to say that in 1980, as I was cutting my virgin teeth in computing, and later in 1982 when I ran my own BBS on things called modems, I was probably having flame wars in quasi-forums way before your young whippersnapping-arse was even high enough to see out of the crib. Could be wrong, but that would my best estimate based on the fact that you know so very little about challenging statements and issuing

And what do evoking comments -- with the full knowledge of what I expect would come my way: some criticism, some praise, have to do with 'playing with the big boys'? By far I think there are other boards where the 'big boys' play. A 'web traveller' with lots of ATS points does not a 'big boy' make. Nor a genius. Quite sorry chap. Move along.



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 08:58 AM
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The topic of this thread is not each other.

Discuss the thread topic and be civil or this thread will be closed and further warnings given.

On topic, please.



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 02:13 PM
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Originally posted by parrhesia
The topic of this thread is not each other.


True. This has become a tangent of support versus non-support versus opiniated diatribe.


...and be civil or this thread will be closed and further warnings given. On topic, please.


Your fault, honestly. No? In the beginning when Vekar began to spew his LIAR LIAR and other assorted nasties, was it not the time to then either shut the thread down and/or issue warnings? I really wonder about you mods -- most of you claim that it's your job to moderate but you fail to moderate in a timely fashion.

Please, don't claim any owness here, I don't expect you to. And please, be sure to warn me as I'm sure you will be doing.



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 02:53 PM
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Originally posted by NextLevel
And please, be sure to warn me as I'm sure you will be doing.


Anymore off topic talk and you can count on it, as you seem to be asking for it. Consider this the last verbal warning.

Topic people and keep it clean.



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 03:53 PM
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hats off to incognito ghostman for being candid.

i'm sorry you had to mow down innocent people with your tools of death. i'm not being facicious. i really feel sorry for soldiers. i would have killed those women and children, too, probably, and i'm a lefty/anarchist bleeding heart-liberal platonist. survival of the most ruthless is the law of the jungle, and 'civilization' is the meanest jungle on earth.

the saddest thing is that they(armed forces) THINK they know what they're fighting for(the good ones), but are usually completely unaware of the political/financial power struggles that TRULY guide the hand of fate(all the generals and big brass know, to an extent.).

the 'bad ones'(soldiers) are just idiot yahoos that like to blow stuff up and kill people because it gives them a sense of superiority.

peace is only achieved when people give up.

[edit on 18-2-2006 by billybob]



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 03:58 PM
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Originally posted by NextLevel

Your fault, honestly. No? In the beginning when Vekar began to spew his LIAR LIAR and other assorted nasties, was it not the time to then either shut the thread down and/or issue warnings? I really wonder about you mods -- most of you claim that it's your job to moderate but you fail to moderate in a timely fashion.



Are you trying to excuse your behaviour in this thread?

Don't even try it.

If, in the future, you have a problem with someones behaviour in a thread you're more than welcome to submit and complaint gripe (contrary to popular belief, we Mods can't catch everything). Unless, of course, you want to sit on it and use it as an excuse for your own crap.



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 04:49 PM
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The most important thing I’m about to post, which is what I want to say to the troops serving all over the world right now, is in the last paragraph. The rest is for everyone else, but read or don’t as you will.

Someone asked how someone can be opposed to the war, yet support the soldiers taking part in said war. I'm sure everyone's philosophical compass differs regarding this, but in my case when I say I support the troops, it means I applaud the spirit of sacrifice and willingness to give their lives for something they believe in, and that I want each and every one of them to come back home without a scratch on them if at all humanly possible. It also means it breaks my heart to see even one of them wounded, let alone killed. However, I'm not naive enough to think that the majority of soldiers don't believe in what they're doing. I'm sure the vast majority does believe in what they're doing, or they wouldn't be risking their lives to do it. So, you could accurately say that I would philosophically differ with them. I personally believe that war cannot be justified, and that it is a great blight on the collective human consciousness that I hope will one day be done away with. I'm idealistic; sorry. My point is that the spirit of what they're doing and risking their lives for, is something I completely support and applaud. I differ purely on the circumstances, means, and reasons, but I will never condemn them for believing what they are doing is right. They have experienced and seen things I probably never will, and I would never presume to be wiser or more knowledgeable about the reasons or justifications for what is happening. Supporting the spirit that drives them to willingly risk their lives for the people they love and want to protect, is what I support. The war, while it is the form the actualization of that spirit currently takes, is what I'm opposed to - not the individuals taking part in it. That seems contradictory to many, I'm sure, but I assure you that it isn't. You're free to say it is, as far as a factual, technical reality, but I would ask that people refrain from saying it is a contradiction for me, or that I can't believe both at the same time, because clearly I do.

Someone also said that not supporting the war clashes with supporting the troops because it endangers their lives by emboldening the enemy. First of all, we're talking about an enemy willing to die without hesitation just to kill one or two of us if need be. We're talking about an enemy that feels death is preferable to life. I don't think any lack of support for the war is going to make them anymore determined to kill us, because they're about as hell bent on wiping us out as they can be already, in my opinion. Second of all, what they fight to protect is a land where speaking one's mind is permitted. Once we start silencing folks for stating their opinions for reasons of patriotism or war support, is the day one of the most vital parts of what they're fighting and dying to protect - whether I agree with that or not - dies. Saying that someone like me is endangering lives by expressing an opinion - especially when the people saying that are the same ones defending the right to publish cartoons that incite violence - is just a hop, skip, and a jump away from saying those who are opposed to the war are treasonous, and as contradictory as they say I and those who believe as I do are. If you feel we are, then I'm deeply saddened by that, and I apologize if this causes you distress or offense as that isn't my intent, but I won't be changing my views.

People aren't black and white. We are complex beings, and we house many seemingly - and at times literally - conflicting emotions and thoughts within ourselves. It is what makes us human, and paradoxically, what keeps us free. I actually agree that it is a paradox, but one I feel is solvable. I have faith that the country - and hopefully the world - will find a way to reconcile the two sides of the fence with respect to conflict. The alternative is to alienate one another, and even though the arguments between the two can be heated, and even though I can't speak for anyone else, that is the last thing I, personally, want. I respect and value the opinions and feelings of even those I disagree with most vehemently (which probably is another paradox, but there you go lol). Sometimes entertaining the opinion of those who disagree with you/me is the only way we/I can learn something.

Last but certainly not least, to you who risked and continue to risk your life to protect us and what you believe in, and any of your fellow soldiers, relief workers, contractors, doctors, etc. serving in Iraq and elsewhere, I want to say thank-you, and that I hope that doesn't sound hollow coming from someone who doesn't believe in war, because I swear to you that it isn't hollow to me when I say it. I cannot express in words the amount of respect and gratitude I have to you for your willingness and courage in risking - and for many of you, losing - your life/lives for us. It's so hard to put in words or to explain to someone that you don't believe in what they're doing, but do believe in why they're doing it and in them as people. For whatever its worth, I want you all home, safe and sound, and I want you to know something that I think is probably completely unapparent when you hear news from back home, which is this: those of us who are opposed to the war think about you constantly, care about you, and keep you in our hearts and minds. It is important to me and so many others like me that you know, and believe that. I know opposition to the war is just as controversial as the war itself, and I hope you can believe me when I say that, for me, my opposition to it is not opposition to your wellbeing, and the spirit of what you are trying to do. My creed is basically, "agreement is not necessary to understanding, nor to respect." I hope this comes across as it is intended. One of my friends is serving in Iraq, and it's very painful for me to imagine him seeing people like me saying we oppose the war, and thinking that means we think he's a bad person or that we don't care about him. I assure you that nothing could be further from the truth.



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 06:10 PM
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totally excellent, acewombat. very well said, and EXACTLY how i feel(having two brothers in the army(one having been blinded by a laser in afghanistan). when i believe the towers were demoed and flight 77 is not what hit the pentagon, this is no small thing.

[edit on 18-2-2006 by billybob]



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 06:15 PM
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Blinded by a laser? Is he okay? Blindness was only temporary, right?



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 06:27 PM
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Originally posted by sweatmonicaIdo
Blinded by a laser? Is he okay? Blindness was only temporary, right?


yeah. it was a couple yrs. ago. it was in one eye, and it only lasted a few days.
the trauma of tucking in his buddy's intestines, however, will probably be a permanent thing.

[edit on 18-2-2006 by billybob]



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 06:38 PM
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now that you have returned from fighting the war that our government has chosen to risk the lives of our military to fight,
what is it like to come home and find out that the government that you were fighting for is intentionally killing Americans at an ALARMING rate?

The director of the EPA has intentionally sped up the rate at which we are suffocating ourselves......
like a pillow over our faces.

The Sec. of Defense among many other top seated officials at the 'fright-house' are all former employee's of the most powerfull source of science in the world.... basically drug dealers have taken over as our official 'representatives'.
The White Crack House

And not only was the USG feeding you and the other soldiers FRANKENFOOD, everybody in the U.S. and the majority of the world is also being forced to eat it as well.

What are your thoughts on the war you have been fighting for your government on the other side of the world, compared to the massacre the same government is conducting on our own people right here at home?

Do you think the amount of 'terror' in Iraq or the threat that the "radical Islamic" people pose on the U.S. comes anywhere close to the amount of preventable death that occurs here at home everysingleday ?

Were there any 'official' scientific experiments being conducted on you or any of the other soldiers that you are aware of? Besides eating FRANKENFOOD?

Do you believe that anytime in the near future the men and women who have served this country would be willing to fight for themselves, with 'the people', instead of fighting for the USG against the people?

Do you think the possibility of this happening would be higher if the majority of our U.S. soldiers understood that the main reason they have been sent to war is to camoflauge the massive amount of murder the USG is committing on our own loved one here at home ?

And lastly, if you felt certain in your heart that you and everybody in your family's life was being threatned and some were being killed by a 'terrorist' in this country....
would you as a soldier take it upon yourself to go out and kill him?
Even if you didn't have 'orders'?



"I, Steve Johnson, swear to suffocate this entire Nation A.S.A.P. !

I'm glad you made it home safe, and I respect you for your choice to fight for the 'freedom' of our country...now that your home, the bad news is that the REAL terrorist are here and they have us inoculated with drugs and propaganda.

Is there anybody you can call for help?


This is not a test.


[edit on 18-2-2006 by Submersible]



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