Do you think Babylon in Revelations might be the U.S. or New York City?

the US is mystery Babylon, the US is the great city, the US is the false prophet,

Well, according to Revelation 17, Mystery Babylon is:

4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication: 5 And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH. 6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

I don't think that the U.S. is arrayed in purple and scarlet, has a golden cup in her hand, and has killed Christians. Mystery Babylon also sits on 7 hills.

I believe you are off base in believing that the U.S. is Mystery Babylon.

Then the Mystery Babylon religion is modern protestant-ish christainity, as that is the only religion that is even remotely capable of enforcing their religion over the globe via a miliatary and having jerusalem as its capital.

It would be impossible for the religion to be protestant Christianity as it will be a worldwide religion of acceptance. Christianity believes in only salvation through Christ. The world religion will accept Muslims, Hindus, etc. just like they are. No way Muslims will believe in Jesus.

Originally posted by Sun Matrix
I don't think that the U.S. is arrayed in purple and scarlet, has a golden cup in her hand, and has killed Christians. Mystery Babylon also sits on 7 hills.

I believe you are off base in believing that the U.S. is Mystery Babylon.

While I agree with the conclusion, the method is spurious. It should be patently obvious even to the casual reader of Revelation that these are symbols and not a literal description.

It should be patently obvious even to the casual reader of Revelation that these are symbols and not a literal description

.

I would like to reword that statement to:

A casual reader of Revelation, likely would believe that these are symbols and are not literal. In doing so, they can make the scripture fit anything they want. However, the words are very clear and specific. Mystery Babylon is dressed in purple and scarlet, has a golden cup, kills Christians and sits on 7 hills.

Please feel free to explain these specifics as symbols of the U.S.

You Americans, you always make me smile. You always think everything is concerning you. Ohhh Babylon must be NYC because of blah blah blahh. funny try looking outside your own country for a change. To people who aren't American ever noticed when you ask one where they are from they reply with their state not their country. Because you really should know all the states of the US simply because you live on earth. Funny. Keep it going. Please all Americans who aren't like this don't take offence, I met you I know your out there, I know your smart, cool and really appreciate other cultures, you're just hard to find behind all the ingnorance.

I always wonder why people connect New York City with Babylon, or Sodom/Gomorrah. Las Vegas, Los Angeles, and--before the unfortunate hurricane--New Orleans seem like cities that fit the bill better, IMO.

I always wonder why people connect New York City with Babylon, or Sodom/Gomorrah. Las Vegas, Los Angeles, and--before the unfortunate hurricane--New Orleans seem like cities that fit the bill better, IMO.

Rev. 17:18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.

It is mainly because Revelation talks about a GREAT CITY being Babylon.

This is a really interesting read concerning the topic at hand. Would like to hear some opinions on the site. Thanks


www.remnantofgod.org...

Originally posted by Sun Matrix
It would be impossible for the religion to be protestant Christianity as it will be a worldwide religion of acceptance. Christianity believes in only salvation through Christ.

There are numerous protestant churchs that are ecumenical. Also, where does it say that its going to be all accepting? It just says that its very popular.

I also had a thought earier today on the winged lion figure. There are numerous examples in assyrian and other semitic art and architecture of bull monsters with men's faces and wings. Obviously, rather different from a lion with wings, but in the essential elements its pretty similar, a four legged beast with bird wings. Also, the feet of some of these winged-bull monsters are somewhat lion like in some representations.

So this might infact be another back handed reference to the eastern 'mystyery' religions of the time. Indeed, no modern religion really fits the stuff that seems to be alluded to in this text, except for the mystery religions of the era, mithraism, the isis cult, etc.

www.remnantofgod.org...
that prophecy declares will HELP the beast in the Vatican enforce its MARK upon all of mankind

Seems like little more than more of the old catholic-protestant rivalry.

Originally posted by Youngblood_USA
This is a really interesting read concerning the topic at hand. Would like to hear some opinions on the site. Thanks
www.remnantofgod.org...

LOL!
Protestants and their "I-hate-the-Catholic-Church-so-they-must-be-the Antichrist" mentality.
Always good for a laugh.

It's not necessarily a hatred of the Catholic church here, the article describes the US as the "war machine" to carry out the plans of the 1st beast (the church). Which would not seem too far off base seeing all the lates RFID and survellance surfacing in this "new world" the neocons seem to be pushing for leaving the American public more and more jobless and colder at home. Kill the middle class, that's the goal...and when the borders are finally dropped for good and the rush of illegals come running in by the millions..that will be the final blow.

It's not hatred. It's just that the Catholic church mixed paganism into Christianity which is unforgivable. It also sounds quite blasphemous to Protestants for somebody to sit in a big gold throne and basically say " I speak for Jesus Christ, now follow me chumps". Also most of the Pope's Cardinals don't even take the Bible seriously, how can you be the religious leaders of 1 billion people and not even study your own scriptures? As for the Antichrist biz, somebody from Christendom is going to be a traitor and lead the sheep astray. The Pope is a natural candidate, even among Catholics (Dark Pope anybody?) The Roman church fit's the prophecy amazingly in some points, it's doctrines are very similar to those of ancient Babylon:

www.biblebelievers.com...

So that's the deal. Why would protestants "hate" Catholics? We live with them since the beginning of Christianity, we claim to follow the same God, we just have different views of that God.

[edit on 23-2-2006 by Nakash]

Originally posted by Nakash
It's not hatred. It's just that the Catholic church mixed paganism into Christianity which is unforgivable.

So your God doesn't forgive. Wow, he sounds very un-Christian to me.
Here's the definition on paganism:
n : any of various religions other than Christianity or Judaism or Islamism
Catholicism is a Christian religion, it's not an "other".
There's a little bit of paganism in every religion because none of us are as perfect as God.
I'll bet you have hints of paganism in your life. You inhabit a website about astrology, prophecies, rumors, etc. You have an interest in the unknown and supernatural. That makes you pagan in my book. Hmmmm, guess this is unforgivable.

Originally posted by Nakash
It also sounds quite blasphemous to Protestants for somebody to sit in a big gold throne and basically say " I speak for Jesus Christ, now follow me chumps".

We think so much of our God we want the most beautiful houses of worship to praise him. He is deserving of the very best that man has to offer him. And obviously you forgot about Peter being the "rock" that Christ would use to build his church upon. After Peter gives a confession about the identity of Jesus, the Lord does the same in return for Peter. Jesus does not say, "Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jona! For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father who is in heaven. And I tell you, you are an insignificant pebble and on this rock I will build my Church. . . . I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven." Jesus is giving Peter a three-fold blessing, including the gift of the keys to the kingdom, not undermining his authority. To say that Jesus is downplaying Peter flies in the face of the context. Jesus is installing Peter as a form of chief steward or prime minister under the King of Kings by giving him the keys to the kingdom. As can be seen in Isaiah 22:22, kings in the Old Testament appointed a chief steward to serve under them in a position of great authority to rule over the inhabitants of the kingdom. Jesus quotes almost verbatum from this passage in Isaiah, and so it is clear what he has in mind. He is raising Peter up as a father figure to the household of faith (Is. 22:21), to lead them and guide the flock (John 21:15-17). This authority of the prime minister under the king was passed on from one man to another down through the ages by the giving of the keys, which were worn on the shoulder as a sign of authority. Likewise, the authority of Peter has been passed down for 2000 years by means of the papacy.

Don't follow the Pope if you don't want to, but he was appointed by Jesus himself 2000 years ago to lead his flock.....goes way back to the original Aramaic translation (skip the Greek - I know that's what you Protestants use).

Originally posted by Nakash
Also most of the Pope's Cardinals don't even take the Bible seriously, how can you be the religious leaders of 1 billion people and not even study your own scriptures?

And you can back this up with proof? Ha ha ha!

Originally posted by Nakash
Why would protestants "hate" Catholics? We live with them since the beginning of Christianity
[edit on 23-2-2006 by Nakash]

Wrong again! You Protestants didn't come into being til the Reformation...well over a thousand years after the Roman Catholic Church was established by Christ.
You're an idiot!

Mystery babylon is first and second century rome

the whole of revelations is about roman persecution of christians.

an antichrist who controls seemingly all peoples? sounds like the roman emperor to me.

Originally posted by Sun Matrix

the US is mystery Babylon, the US is the great city, the US is the false prophet,

Well, according to Revelation 17, Mystery Babylon is:

4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication: 5 And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH. 6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

I don't think that the U.S. is arrayed in purple and scarlet, has a golden cup in her hand, and has killed Christians. Mystery Babylon also sits on 7 hills.

I believe you are off base in believing that the U.S. is Mystery Babylon.

I'm not aware of any country in the world having exclusive purple and scarlet patriotic colors??Hmmm, I interpret purple and scarlet as being "beautiful, rich, intoxicating". Maybe the colors are just metaphor for "very beautiful, desirable".....much of the Bible is metaphoric. I seriously doubt the colors are literal.....it's a parable. Jesus taught almost exclusively in parables, so it would come as no surprise to me that Revelations is one big prophetic-metaphoric-parable. Jesus said that those who couldn't understand his parables were those who didn't know God. If you couldn't understand the parable it was because you were not fit to enter heaven.

"a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication"
I interpret this as a very rich, powerful country that comes off as having lots of class, wealth, prestige but is full of abominations/fornications (promiscuity, premarital sex, pornography, prostitution, homosexuality, abortions, adultery, greed, murders, robberies, rapes). This country also leads the world by her power, and seduces the world by her allure of freedom, sex, money, power....anything you want you can have in Babylon. Everyone wants to live in Babylon because it's the coolest, best, place to be. You can get f*cked in Babylon, eat the best food, have the latest modern, life-enhancing amenities in Babylon. Everybody dreams they lived in Babylon......it is "the land of pleasure".
Hmmmmmm.......wonder who that can be?

Iraq, hahahahahahahahahahahahaha.
Anywhere in the Mid-East, hahahahahahahahahhahahaha
Rome, what's there? Great food, cool museums...I'm bored, let's go home.

"drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus"
This does not mean she kills Christians at all. Read it again. She's drunk and high enjoying life.
It means: she takes advantage of good people, uses them for her disposal, to get what she wants – she's a whore, and she'll do anything to get what she wants. The second part of it means that a good portion of her inhabitants are followers of Jesus (martyrs, if you will, because although firm believers in Jesus they will all die too when Babylon goes up in flames, i.e. nuclear bombs).

"and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration."
If you were John, back in the first century and were given a vision of this great country of ours, with it's huge spiraling towered cities; sprawling, fertile, rich green landscapes; orange/red canyons; beautiful lakes and rivers; yellow desert; all the modern marvels we've built into our country..........would you not have to wonder with awe...with admiration. Seems lots of foreigners nowadays do. I can't remember a time in this nations history when so many races have mingled into such a melting pot here. We've got Mexicans hopping the border by the multitudes because there sick of the pit they live in and "they want to live in America, experience America"................Babylon.

In the 1960's the sexual revolution came about in America, the rest of the world followed suit. And the whole world changed drastically. Drugs, rock'n'roll, sex took over. Don't believe me? Ask your parents. Babylon lost her innocence in the 1960's and the world has never been the same morally. And it just keeps getting worse......I remember when the vast majority of this country believed in God.......not anymore. It's becoming cool to not believe in God. We're pulling religion out of everything. This is not good at all.

The end will come when the vast majority of the world have become Godless.
We're headed there...

America is Mystery Babylon.
When will she go up in flames? I'm not sure. But the writing is on the wall.
And hey, we just sold our ports to the Arabs....it's really only a matter of time.
But it will come.........................
If you can't see the parallel you're spiritually blind????

I find this topic quite interesting. Rather or not it holds truth, I'm not sure..but many things to seem to run hand in hand. I was just surfing some sites concerning this topic and I ran across this man (so-called prophet) of the late 80's thru the 90's. He was released from a prison in Romania and came to America to warm of it's demise. (Why he was released, i'm not sure, I haven't read enough yet.) But was hoping someone has ever heard of this man, his name is Dumitru Duduman. I'll supply a link here as well. There's quite a bit on the web concerning this guy.


www.whatsaiththescripture.com...

I notice that he thinks that America is Mystery Babylon. I don't put much stock in him because of that alone.

I didn't see much of that, he did say however, that los angeles, las vegas, and new york were similar to sodom and gomorrah and would be wiped out...and predicted a civil war would break out in mid america, after the army had spent all their bullets on the mid-east wars and began purchasing from Tawain...during the inner turmoil that breaks out..Russia penetrates in through florida, mexico, and wisconsin. Thus is when china invades russia pushing them all the way paris.

[edit on 2/23/2006 by Youngblood_USA]

I'm not aware of any country in the world having exclusive purple and scarlet patriotic colors??

Bingo, maybe it is not a country.

Hmmm, I interpret purple and scarlet as being "beautiful, rich, intoxicating". Maybe the colors are just metaphor for "very beautiful, desirable".....much of the Bible is metaphoric. I seriously doubt the colors are literal.....it's a parable. Jesus taught almost exclusively in parables, so it would come as no surprise to me that Revelations is one big prophetic-metaphoric-parable.

Quit making everything so hard. Purple and scarlet are two colors. Your answer is dressed in purple and scarlet.

Iraq, hahahahahahahahahahahahaha

Iraq is Babylon
Mystery Babylon sits on 7 hills

"drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus"

This means, kills Christians. How you get anything else out of this is beyond me.

You spend too much time dreaming things up. You need to just read what it says.

If you are told to beware of those wearing a blue coat, it would be wise to do so. Just because Hawaii is surronded by blue water, don't tell me they are talking about Hawaii.