The New Adolph Hitler !

They sure as hell can't buy em from us. Where else do they go? The fact that Venezela is seeking arms doesnt make them any more a threat than Russia, who has a crapload of arms already, or China, or...well...everyone.

Once in a while a new "fashion" shows up... a couple of months ago, it was to label people. specially Bush" has the anti-Christ... now the pouplar slogan is " that guy is the new Hitler" .

Its sickening, how ppl will just trow around this accusation without even thinking twice.

Who and where, in these days, has send hald-alive people into ovens ?
Brand them as catke with burning iron numbers ? pull out their teeth and nails to avoy their defense during torture and rape ?
Forced children to carry the dead bodies of their parents to the ovens ?

Do people even have a notion of what they are saying when they accuse someoen of beeing "like Hilter" ?

The only Hitler i see in our days was Saddam... and yes ...him and his sons did a lot worse than the above described.

There are plenty of "Hitlers" in the Uganda for example, where children are forced to eat soup made out their parents bodies... Does anyone even think about what they are saying when they call someone "hitler"... do you have an idea of the evil that one has to inflict on people to "earn" that title?

I just hope that all these people whomever they are, that go around calling others "Hitler" for every breath of air, never...NEVER... have the "bad luck" to meet a true HITLER... that will have plenty of fun in watching their suffering.

100,000 Kalashnikov's? yeah sounds like a real peaceful guy....unfortuneately he is still 900,000 weapons short of his goal...

I guess the russians must be doing a booming business....looks like an oil for guns program now.

So, by your logic it is OK for the good ole' USA to buy and sell weapons to whomever they chose, but it's a bad thing for Chavez to protect himself from
Mr. Danger?

Remember the old saying from Bush Sr "A Kinder and Gentler Nation"?

What if I was to tell you there is something much sinister taking place in our society and other tech societies that are basically a continuation of some of the Nazi experiments. Rather than round folks up physically and brutalize them as Hitler, Saddam etc "they" destroy our immune systems so they can bleed us over long periods of time buying their candy(pharmaceuticals) that promises to heal us but most of the time gives the patient more illness which in turn makes "them" or "they" richer.

My poor HD is working overtime writing this post as they watch, and I do find it quite entertaining.

Perhaps what ole Bush Sr meant by A Kinder and Gentler Nation is "A Kinder and Gentler Nazi Germany"

I suggest you all take a look at just one of their fav weapons "Mind Control" That wonderful device that makes anyone challenge truth especially if its too far out there. The victim of this device can stay in the comfort zone of darkness where they can see no evil, hear no evil, and speak no evil.
www.mindcontrolinamerica.com...

Toad:

We already suffered a lot of bloodshed in the 70's from Castro and his minions
Chavez is trying to impose a communist Latin America, he is using Venezuela oil money to do so, with his nice firends, Castro, Kirchner and Evo Morales (Bolivian President druglord recently elected )

Whatever, you surely are a French-Canadian, so I think im wasting my time

Originally posted by magnito_student
Rather than round folks up physically and brutalize them as Hitler, Saddam etc "they" destroy our immune systems so they can bleed us over long periods of time buying their candy(pharmaceuticals) that promises to heal us but most of the time gives the patient more illness which in turn makes "them" or "they" richer.

I understand where you are going with that, and I partially agree with you., once i have my own supiscions that AIDS could have created in a lab. BUT... if true, this is something that has been going on for more yeras than I've been on Earth, so what i son't understand is why only the Bush Presidents are blamed... what did Kennedy did to stop it ? Carter, Clinton?... NOTHING ! If anything they only put more wood in the fire, yet they are treated as great men... almost "saviors" ????

Are you worried about him buying the weapons or the fact you didn't get the export order?

Faced with aggression and threats from the world's biggest military power Chavez buys arms from the No 2 arms manufacturer in the world

www.globalissues.org...

Big Deal!!

Originally posted by msnevil

(Note: South America is a Big Battleground between the USA's war of Drugs. And the Leftist Marxists supporters of the Drug regime's. Which are supported by Cuba and China as well. Its all about "power". Leftist Imperialism vrs US imperialism.)

Side Note:
And the ironic Thing is This. Cindy Sheehan would be killed if she "protested across from Chavez's Home."

And I Would rather live in the States and protest Bush. And Live. Then live under Chavez, And always fear for my life.

Yeah, you live if your lucky !

The ironic thing is this. Donald Rumsfeld would be killed if he "called in his markers" to put a toxic poisonous drug back in the hands of Chavez's people. Regardless what he does that this government will never approve of, he would never approve of committing genocide on his own people.
You do not fear for your life because you do not accept that THIS administration is digging our graves.

Don't forget, the "Drug Regime" in this country is so powerfull that they have taken control of our government.
The federal judge that swore gwb into office is a former employee of the same drug company that Donald Rumsfeld 'traded' the American people to.

Aspartame lawsuit accuses many companies of poisoning the public

Read about how this chemical was 'banned' by the FDA, only to be re-instated during the Regan-era by Donald Rumsfeld,
regardless of the blatant consequences that this drug presented to 'the people'.
Aspartame=Formaldehyde,
but it's 'ok' for you to drink it according to the man who calls this dirt poor farmer the next Adolph Hitler.

I want Donald Rumsfeld's head in a manure sack.
Bring it to me !
I might cooperate.

Originally posted by Submersible

Originally posted by dgtempe
I thought we already had a new Hitler.

Chavez is an uneducated animal with clothes on, with a 3rd grade education. What do you suppose he knows??
At least Fidel Castro (his buddy) had a college education.

Chavez is what is called "El Burro"

So what does that mean?

Jesus, Muhammad ,and all of the men who translated the Bible and the Quran from their original 'forms' were "el Burro's" as well.

What does that make us?

"El Burro" wanna-bee's?

Are you implying that Jesus, Muhammed and all God's prophets fall into the same category as Chavez???? I dont think so, please dont twist all this.
Since i know Spanish, and i have listened to the words of "El Burro", i can tell you he's a mental midget with a great desire for power.

I guess i can say this BECAUSE I AM HISPANIC.

The US govt. will foreverly label anyone who questions them either:
Unpatriotic
Unamerican
Antiamerican
Terrorist
Extremist
Madman/woman
etc.
Things wont change unless there is a 100% overhaul of the US govt. and also the business sectors in short the whole USA. Get used to this going on I am amazed you havent already, if you think this is something new your sadly mistaken.

It is really a coincidence that everyone who talks bad about Chavez always fail to provide evidence about it. I am a Venezuelan living in London. The reason I am living here has nothing to do with political issues, it is just that my other half is from this area so we decided to settle in europe for the time being. The only reason I bring this up is because by living here I can be objective of the situation back home. Unfortunately in order to find proper news about Venezuela I really have to dig the web because the only news you can find in the international media is the bunch of lies and propaganda that comes out of the US goverment and the Venezuelan oposicion (which comes out to be the same thing anyways).

So far the oposition leaders tried to get Chavez tried at the Hage, Spain and in other countries about the human rights allegations and all those cases were all dismissed immidiately because there was no evidence to support it. The only reason they say Chavez supresses the opposition is because there are a few politicians in jail, however, a politician in jail IS NOT the same as a political prisioner. These people are in jail because of all the sabotage and damage they caused to the country. For example, lets take the oil strike the oposition carried out. They halted the oil production of the country and they would only start it back up if Chavez ressigned as president. Now as in every country you are allow to go in strike as long as it has to do with something to do with your job, like demanding more benefits, a pay rise, etc. What you cannot do is not go to your job because you do not like the current president and you want him to quit. Chavez gave them more than 30 days for them to go back to their posts but they never did. Not only they failed to show up at work, but they changed all the passwords and sabotaged the refineries and oil tankers so that if anyone else tried to operate them it would generate a catastrophe. At the end of grace period the government fired them all got other people to work in the refinery. (The oil company belongs to the state NOT a private company so the government can fire the workers). Now it works better than ever. Now sabotaging ships, refineries and calling for rebellion is a crime anywhere in the world. I believe there are 1 or 2 people arrested for all this mess since the other braves ones fled the country after what they did. This strike costed us a lot of money.

About the narco and guerillas.... Venezuela is NOT a major producer of drugs nor have guerrillas. Yes, a lot of drugs leave from Venezuela but those drugs come from Colombia, not us. As I see it that would be more of a Colombian problem (and the US since they are there supposedly to control this) than ours. There is no evidence what so ever that Chavez is supporting any of these groups, nor that he is passing nuclear secrets to Iran nor any other country. All those allegations have been created by people with lots of power/money and access to the media.

What the hell is everyone worried about 100.000 machine guns!? what the hell do you expect our army to carry? sling shots!? we are not buying missiles, nuclear nor biological weapons nor anything special. Damn, I guarantee there are more than 100k machines guns in a city in Texas. I more worried about the 13 ton bomb the US is creating. Once again, there is no evidence that any weapons have ever been given to the Colombian guerrilla from Venezuela. Really, the news makes everything seem evil and problematic.

Last, the US cannot expect Venezuela (or any other country for that matter) to only be friends with his friends. They get pissed if we talk to Iran, Iraq or any other country in their black list. I am sorry, but why? what has any of those countries ever done to us? Shall we ignore them just because the US tells us too? Those countries deserve all our respect just like the rest of the world. Maybe the reason that they have no problems with us is because we treat them with respect and as equals, instead of trying to take advantage of them.

Venezuela is a pro peace country. We have never invaded any other country nor had issues with anyone. The only problems we have right now is with countries that are extremely close to the United States and following US advice, they talk crap about us. Mind you, if you talk crap about us, don't expect us to talk nicely about you, it is as simple as that.

The only way you can really see this is by going to the country and experiencing it yourself. I have been trying to find some good articles in english, but can only find it in spanish. If I find something good in english I will post it.

Take care,
AJAG

Thanks Ajag for your perspective.

I find it funny that although the US is the worlds biggest arms dealer, by far, Chavez gets such a bad name for wanting some guns. Like I said earlier, most South American leaders are puppets to US interests. As soon as someone with a different view takes office our media (or Gov't...the two are damn near synonymous) immediately does everything they can to discredit him, right down to making him seem to be in bed with the Islamic terrorists.

AJAG

Thanks for that - an informed insight and a balance to some of the toss posted on here as 'facts'.

It seems to me the US regards South America as it's fiefdom to be used, exploited and dominated as it decides.

Chavez's real crime appears to be to not allow the US to run his country

Hasta

S

No problem, my pleasure. I check these boards very often, but I hardly post since I end to see a lot of misinformed people and to be honest most of the time it is a waste trying to talk to them. The only reason I posted today was because I found you guys here, not repeating what the propaganda machine tells you, but your own informed opinions.

People do not take into consideration that now Venezuela is Illiteracy free (confirmed by the UN) thanks to Chavez, who implemented the same Literacy program that Fidel used in Cuba. Nor the fact that now at least 80% of Venezuelans have free access to both doctors and medications. Nor that kids in public school get fed before they are sent home for the day. Nor that now thanks to all the money he has put into education kids have a guaranted place in schools and universities. THe problem from all this is that the rich people do not get anything from this which makes them pissed. It drives them insane that he is using the money of the country to help it's people instead of using it to double or tripple their millions.

You see, in Venezuela (now) we see the president as a person we chose to help us with our problems, in other words the president is our servant. Chavez considers himself to be one of us, he himself calls himself our servant. We put him there for him to serve us, unlike the president of the United States who is there for you to serve him. So you can help him and his buddies make millions from the oil, weapons and reconstruction businesses. Before our "democracy" used to be just like that, but it all changed with Chavez.

On a final note let me give you a small piece of information that you might not know. Chavez does not get a salary as the president. At least in Venezuela all public officials get a salary, including the president, however, Chavez gives his salary away as scholarships to help more students finish their studies.

Take care,
AJAG

AJAG

NICE PROPAGANDA. I live in Argentina, so we know who Chavez is and who are his friends.
Good luck with your "hermandad boliviarana" sh*t!!

PLEASE PLEASE tell the mebers of this forum:
How is the Parliament composed now?
Who are the memebers of the supreme Court?
Who is Maria Corina Machado?

daniel-venezuela.blogspot.com...

sumate-is-a-chavez-target.blogspot.com...

[edit on 10-2-2006 by Vladtepes]

Thanks again!

Vladtepes, why dont you state your side of the arguement rather than just criticizing his. Your sources seem a bit biased.

I would love to hear both of the competing arguments your two have. You have a perspective we in the States and the UK lack. Lets hear it.

Originally posted by DaFunk13
Thanks again!

Vladtepes, why dont you state your side of the arguement rather than just criticizing his. Your sources seem a bit biased.

I would love to hear both of the competing arguments your two have. You have a perspective we in the States and the UK lack. Lets hear it.

I'll give you one example of the type of Chavez idea of Democracy:

Venezuela's parliament plans legislation to extend Chavez term till 2030


New deputies elected to Venezuela's National Assembly, to be sworn in January, will legislate to keep President Hugo Chavez in office until 2030, National Assembly President Nicolas Maduro said on Tuesday.

The legislation would be revolutionary and would ensure that Chavez remains in power not just till 2021, but till 2030, Maduro said at a ceremony celebrating the victory of pro-government deputies in Sunday's elections.

He said the new parliament also planned to pass several laws that are "for the people and with the people."

"One cycle of the Assembly has completed and another one has begun which will speed the revolution: of changes made in favor of the people," Maduro said. "The main contribution of this new assembly will be to consolidate the revolution."

According to the current Venezuelan constitution, approved six years ago in a referendum, only one presidential re-election is allowed and a full presidential term is six years.

Chavez had said he wanted to retire from political life in 2021, but this year he extended his horizons to 2030.

Try to defend THAT!.




[edit on 10-2-2006 by Vladtepes]

Originally posted by Vladtepes

PLEASE PLEASE tell the mebers of this forum:
How is the Parliament composed now?
Who are the memebers of the supreme Court?
Who is Maria Corina Machado?

daniel-venezuela.blogspot.com...

sumate-is-a-chavez-target.blogspot.com...

[edit on 10-2-2006 by Vladtepes]

1.- The parlament is compose only of Chavez suporters right now. The reason being because the oposicion decided not to run their candidates like a week before the elections. The reasons for this was that they did not trust the election process... HOWEVER, the United Nations, the Organization of American States and the Carter center among other international observers we had to make sure there was no cheating told them and guarantee the opposition that there was no way in hell anyone could cheat. Since Chavez got to power the government decided to modernize the election process. Before it was all done by hand which was a problem because all they had to do was bride the table officials for different poll centers and they could change the books and give you the results you wanted. Now it is all electronic and the source code of the software used is given to the observers, oposition members and whoever the hell wants to check it. The oposition gave as a requirement for tem to participate in the elections that they used the old manual system. Everyone told them no so they didn't want to participate. Kind of suspicios huh? They do not want to used the 100% cheat proof system but instead they want the old unreliable, corruption prone one. They knew they did not have the votes to beat Chavez so they decided not to run and blame it on an unreliable election process. That way they can still lie to their few suporters 2 ways: They make the government look unreliable and they do not show how little support they really have.

2.- I do not understand why people keep bringing up the supreme court. This is the supreme court that ruled that there was never a coup against Chavez and freed the people who kidnapped him, replace the constitution of Venezuela for 2 days, started a which hunt against every pro-Chavez member of the government during the 2 day coup (April 2001) and killed and injured hundreds of people between April 11, 2001 and April 13, 2001, when the people rised against them, kicked them out of power and brought Chavez back. I have a great video about this in english produced by and Irish group that was in Venezuela during those days. I made a DVD from the tape so the quality is not awesome but it is good. During this time they assaulted the Cuba embassy in Venezuela.

3.- Maria Corina Machado... I can't believe youo even brough her up. what a way to kill yourself in an argument. She is the leader of an oposition organization called sumate. This organization started as an "independent" organization to collect statistics and surveys on the popularity of the candidates which somehow they always show majority for the oposition. Of course, the surveys were all carried out in the most exclusive shopping malls of Venezuela and in country clubs were Chavez suporters do not hang out. Mind you, there are a lot of middle-upper class Chavez suporters too, but they are not vocal because they will be fired from their jobs. After the surveys this organization decided to start collecting signatures for the referendum against Chavez. When the constitution was Changed 1 year after Chavez getting to power (There was a referendum called to asked the people if they wanted to adopt the new resolution and that won aswell) Chavez made sure that you could call a referendum on any political figure half way his term, if enough people are not happy with his job. Sumate, started collecting signatures for the recall refendum against Chavez 1 year earlier than half way his term or the allowed date for starting the collection. Then they comply to regulations stipulated for this process and to top it, they had signatures of people who had been dead for over 10 years and from people under 18 years old, which is the age you need to be to vote or participate in these kind of things in Venezuela. needless to say these signatures were not accepted so they kicked and screamed for months with the help of the white house. So when the right time arrived they sent them to collect them again. This time they also contained dead and under age people but still were accepted. Now what they failed to tell the world is that private companies were forcing their employees to sign for the referendum. The problem with their plan is that when you go vote it is secret so even if you signed for the referendum, you can still vote for the president to stay. Chavez easily won it and that is why he is still in power. Now it turns out that Sumate is receiving funds from the National Endowment for democracy (I think tha tis the name). Basically, the white house is using Sumate to destabilize the country. Maria Corina Machado should be in Jail for destabilizing the country and treason (destabilizing her own country by orders of another country). Shae called many times for riots, protests, people not to pay taxes. Is she in Jail? no, she is free as a bird.

About Chavez statying until 2030. Now lets clear something up. When Chavez claims that he will stay in government until 2021 he means contributing to the government, not necessarily as president. Now if the National Assembly (parlament) decided to keep him until 2021, 2030 or any other period other than 2012 (presidential periods in Venezuela are 6 years and this year if he wins would be his second and last term) it would require a change in the constitution. Thanks to Chavez, The constitution of Venezuela cannot be changed without the approval of the country. Basically a referendum would be called to see if we want to change it or not. If we vote yes, then he can stay. As far as I know I think this is what democrazy is right? Chavez made sure this was included inthe constitution to protect the country from corrupt politicians acting on belhalf of corporations and/or other governments. For example, in the constitution it states that the oil company of Venezuela is a public company which belongs to all the Venezuelans along with the natural resources. For another president to be able to sell the oil company now he/she would have to put it on a referendum. This helps us protect our country.

Lastly, stop calling Chavez a communist. In communist regimes, you do not own anything. Chavez has given more land and property to poor people than the rest did in 40 years of democracy. He is a socialist which means he wants to help people, provide them with social services like health, education, jobs, housing, etc. He just does not believe in the magical hand of capitalism that is supposed to help make everyting better.

Actually I am surprised an Argentinian would take your position. You more than anyone should know what happened to Argentina for listenening to the US and the IMF. You sold everything, your public companies and resources to private companies and other countries. Your country was in bankrupcy and just now it is starting to be a bit better. Chavez has done nothing more than help Argentina and actually people really like him there. Sounds like you are part of the previous government

Take care,
AJAG

So...He doesnt want to step down after his term is finished? While I dont necessarily agree with his stance, I dont think this proves any of your claims, or more importantly, disproves any of AJAGs statements.

Again, I am not trying to bait anyone for argument or discredit you personally, I am only trying to encourage intelligent debate.

I think it is great that we have two people from Latin America that can debate this issue while a bunch of us Murkans and Brits can observe.

Keep it up!