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FaithDefender v Loki : Ghosts Exist.

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posted on Oct, 2 2003 @ 07:05 AM
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Loki has been around quite awhile now and members will already know of his abilities,where as FaithDefender is fairly new and a dark horse.Judges,of course,do not take ATS status into account and who knows perhaps a top seed may fall.I'm sure I'm not alone when I say this is one of the most intriguing debates.

Each debator will have one opening statement each.This will be followed by 3 alternating replies each.There will be one closing statement each and no rebutal.
No post will be longer than 800 words and in the case of the closing statement no longer than 500 words.In the event of a debator posting more than the stated word limit then the excess words will be deleted by me from the bottom.Credits or references at the bottom count as part of the post.

Editing is Strictly forbidden.

Excluding both the opening and closing statements only 1 image or link may be included in any post.Opening and Closing statement must not carry either images or links.

The Debate topic is:That Ghosts exist and are the spirits of the dead that for whatever reason have not left this Earth.

FaithDefender will argue for this proposition and he will open the Debate.
Loki will respond and argue against this proposition.

As a guide responses should be made within 18 hours.However if the debate is moving forward then I have a relaxed attitude to this.

Defaulters will not be excepted in the next Tournament.The winner will receive 3000 ATS points the loser(on condition of completion)will receive 1500 ATS points.This on top of generous points allocation for Debate forum posts.

This Topic will be opened on Sunday Evening GMT and the debate may start.

I wish you both goodluck

The winner of the bout will face the winner of the Gazrok v NinjaoftheNight contest.


[Edited on 2-10-2003 by John bull 1]




posted on Oct, 5 2003 @ 05:33 PM
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AS to the question of whether or not ghosts exist, yes they definitely do. There have been so many sightings, it would take days to research all of them. There have even been reportd of seeing people such as guards, still roaming their old routes for a patrol. As to answer why htey have not fully left the Earth yet, I believe it is because the spirits still have unfginished business from when they were alive. An example of this would be, say, a Civil War patrol soldeir, sees an enemy trrop, and gets caught up in the chase, so completely fails to report the witnessing of the enemy troop. During the chase, the soldier is shot. He stays behind due to his great regret of failing to warn his fellow troops.



posted on Oct, 5 2003 @ 07:48 PM
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Let me open by saying that there has in fact been some very compelling arguments, both for and against the existence of ghosts. One thing I'd like to point out, however, is the natural willingness of the human mind to percieve what they can see as undeniable fact. This can be best explained by the sayings "If I hadn't seen it for myself, I wouldn't have belived it" and, "Your eyes can decieve you." Both are very strong arguments for the human dependence upon their own sight as the deciding factor in making decisions.
That being said, I propose that the perceptions and feelings known as hauntings are merely highly localized atmospheric disturbances, caused by one's own brainwaves. I argue that it is possible for a human being, upon hearing the rumour of haunting, to eminate a strange sort of brainwave that alters magnetism in the immediate atmosphere, allowing for such phenomenon as localized rapid cooling, and the perception of voices. This is quite possible, considering how much we don't actually know about human brain functions. There was a study done in Britain by one Dr. Richard Wiseman that hauntings may be the product of such disturbances, and not ghosts.



posted on Oct, 5 2003 @ 09:15 PM
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Before I start, I have to give you credit for all of those reasonable arguments. Now, all of those may or may not make sense, but for arguments sake, I'll go along with it. Now, that may explain all of the recent reports, but then how does it explain the original reporters? It does not justify the lying of the original reports. I personally do believe that some spirits live on until they decide they want to leave the Earth, whether it be a weird brainwave emitted by a paranoid tourist, or someone who is educated on the topic, it does not explain the sightings. How does this exolain the various people that believe in ghosts?-Faith
Good Luck Loki.



posted on Oct, 5 2003 @ 10:23 PM
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Faithdefender, was that your first argument? Oh well. Here goes.

The presence of the anomalies are simple to explain as coincidence, to answer your question. It's quite possible that people who are extraordinarily powerful in the area of the anomalaous(sp?) brainwaves (IE, the ones that would cause atmospheric disturbance to the immediate area, producing a 'haunting') leave 'fingerprints' on the sites that they profess to have seen 'ghosts'. This means that they leave behind a ripple in the atmosphere, much in the way that cows leave circles in the pasture when they lie down.
Primary sightings of spirits can be easily explained. Even I, in my state of blissful normalness can get a bad 'vibe' from an area, depending on several factors, including, but not limited to lighting, ambient sounds, and pre-conceived notions of the 'haunted' area. Our society has several prerequesites for a site to be 'haunted'. One of these is that it be old, dark, dank, and dingy. Just because my basement looks like the wine cellar of an old victorian mansion which was the home of a man whom ate little children, doesn't mean that I'm going to have the 'ghosts' of Hannibal Lecter's victims running around my house.
Simply put; I regard the Idea of ghosts as preposterous. I can only address this from the viewpoint of a living person, as I haven't died yet, but I think that after all I've heard of how much 'ghosts' destroy the sanity of sensible people, I'd just as soon go to where I'm going, rather than stick around to hassle my family.



posted on Oct, 7 2003 @ 02:38 PM
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No reply from FaithDefender.

Initially I was disheartened by this.

But if the first qualification round serves to show the ability of potential debators to write then this first round,which was not originally planned,shows the ability of potential debators to compete.

So it is with confidence in the integity of this tournament to find a worthy Challenger for our Champion that I pronounce Loki the winner of this contest.

Loki will go on to face Gazrok in the next round.

I have received messages that FaithDefender is having computer problems.Sadly because of the schedule of this tournament we must move forward.Because he has sent me notification FaithDefender will be elligable for the next Tournament.

Congratulations Loki.The next debate topics will be posted on Sunday.

Do not worry about the manner of your victory.This process is about seperating the wheat from the chaff to find the best debator to challenge out Champion.



posted on Oct, 8 2003 @ 02:32 AM
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Oh well. I'm sure You would've been a good match, faithdefender. I'm looking ahead to my next match, Gazrok, current TWATS winner. Hm. Let's do this like brutus...





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