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NEWS: Secret UK DNA Database Revealed

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posted on Jan, 20 2006 @ 11:20 PM
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A database in the UK that contains over 24000 dna samples has been revealed by a Conservative MP. The database contains the dna of juviniles, most of which have never committed a crime. The Home Office which is resopnsible for the database is expected to have 7% of the UK populations dna on file in two years time. Although the database is not illegal it has been kept in secret unknown to most victims who provide samples to police.
 



news.bbc.co.uk
DNA profiles of 24,000 juveniles who have never been cautioned, charged or convicted of an offence are stored on the UK database, an MP has revealed.

The Conservative MP fears a huge juvenile database - though not illegal - is being created by "stealth".

Suspects who are arrested over any imprisonable offence can have their DNA held even if they are acquitted. The Home Office announced earlier this month that 7% of the UK population will be on the database in two years' time. It is already the biggest in the world and has so far cost £300m


Please visit the link provided for the complete story.


I always knew that they took dna samples from victims and criminals for investigations but i never knew they they kept them on file. This kind of worries me because of the thing that are starting to become possible with dna. If the Uk is doing this know what do you think your countries have on you. They can easily find you through one of your family members dna even if they dont have yours on file.




posted on Jan, 21 2006 @ 07:57 AM
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Saw this story this morning and for me - it is confirmation we are in the grip of a police state.

The dna samples are from *innocent* individuals who as part of the booking process are practically forced to give this material. I'd like to know how many crimes have been solved in the uK by the use of such a database.

This is appalling. Oh and apparently from April every conviction you've had in your life will remain on file for ever (or as near damn practically) ....



posted on Jan, 23 2006 @ 11:58 AM
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I recall that there was a related story wherein they talked about how every roadway throughout england (or was it greater britain?) was now able to be monitored via video camera.

Can't say that there's much of a surprise though that the gov would keep DNA samples that people have given them. What was anyone expecting?

Other places, like Iceland, have had their entire population added to a genetic database.



posted on Jan, 23 2006 @ 12:11 PM
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For the record, when i was arrested they took my dna even though it was irrelevent to the crime which i had admitted to anyway.
They said then that it was to keep on record and it was now routine to take it from anyone that was arrested for any reason.
This was six years ago.
I accept this information being on file as I had done something wrong at the time (it wasn't major I might add!), this is one of the reasons that I don't worry too much about having to give up my personal iinformation these days, including biometric ID, because I already forfitted it when I was naughty and got caught. I do empathise for all the innocent people out there though, seeing as I associate it with the consequences behind criminal activity (no matter how minor) it is bad for normal, innocent people to be effectively treated the same way.




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Posted Via ATSmobile (BETA v0.3)


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[edit on 23-1-2006 by AgentSmith]



posted on Jan, 23 2006 @ 03:04 PM
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It is standard practice when you are arrested for a criminal offence to take your DNA, fingerprints and photograph. All of these are kept regardless of whether you are charged or not.

It's not a Police decision, it's a Home Office one.



posted on Jan, 23 2006 @ 03:13 PM
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The problem with this thing is that not only criminals DNA is kept on file, but also victims.

Even in the US, storing Victims DNA or any other person involved in an investigation, that didn't turn out to be the criminal they looked for, is a violation of their privacy and not allowed by law.

Normaly, all DNA material gathered from "suspects" that don't turn out to have been guilty or family, neighbours and such that was taken for reference or exclusionary reasons can only be stored with the file about the case, not centraly in a database.

Only DNA "evidence" can be stored together with the files related to a crime, but not listed in a central database and DNA samples that lead to the arrest and conviction of a person, making this person a criminal, can be stored in a criminal database.



posted on Jan, 23 2006 @ 03:30 PM
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That actually surprises me that its so few. Does England have the heel prick test for newborn babies? In Australia the heel Prick test or Guthries test is believed to take every new born babies DNA and hold it on a central National DNA Database in Canberra


External Source
AG Dep Aus
Identification involves establishing that a person is who he or she says they are, or more specifically that they are the same person who was recorded in a different context, for example the person registered as born at a particular time or place (whose genetic make-up is recorded on a Guthries Card). Identification plays an important role in the criminal justice system both before the courts and in law enforcement and criminal investigation.



External SOurce
Law Link Privacy Doc
Is there a need for a national policy regarding access to Guthries cards for law enforcement purposes.
Newborn screening using Guthries cards has now been in place in most States since the late 1970s. Consequently all stored cards collected before 1994 relate to adults. In 1999 my office examined the NSW Newborn Screening Program, and made a number of suggestions in relation to the information provided to mothers on how cards would be retained and used, including the right to have them subsequently destroyed. While I acknowledge the difficulty in negotiating fully informed consent during the stress of child-birth, there are mechanisms which can enhance the control of families. The provision of a brochure providing accurate information about the purposes of testing, that testing is voluntary and that mothers have a right to seek to have test samples destroyed goes some way.


I guess thats why I am surprised at this story. Its nothing new here. Since 1974 every Australian who has had the Guthries test has their DNA on record.

Oh we don't get told the truth and its supposed to be voluntary and all, ..but its a big "secret" and they do not tell you what it really is.

So it may be a violation in the US and England but here in Australia they get away with it. Is Australa the only ones that have the baby heel prick tests?







[edit on 23-1-2006 by Mayet]



posted on Jan, 24 2006 @ 10:34 AM
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I don't understand the fear of a dna database. Unless you are commiting offences that you can be found out threw your dna is there a real problem?. What else is worse that could happen? they clone stem cells of you to plant at a crimescene? There just seems like there would be easier ways to frame someone. If it didnt take going out of my way I wouldnt mind giving a dna sample. I am just more concerned with being able to find my address and telephone number on yahoo.



posted on Jan, 24 2006 @ 11:24 AM
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I think the point people get at when they are in opposition to this is that we shouldnt be filed like we are future-criminals just waiting for the chance to commit the crime and thats sure what it feels like when your filed away in the systems. If you havent commmitted a crime there is no reason on this earth why you should be giving up your DNA and information, even to 'help speed up the process of catching the person' because if your a suspect they can go ahead and force you to give up your DNA.



posted on Jan, 24 2006 @ 05:47 PM
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Originally posted by FactoryLad
It is standard practice when you are arrested for a criminal offence to take your DNA, fingerprints and photograph. All of these are kept regardless of whether you are charged or not.

It's not a Police decision, it's a Home Office one.


They are supposed to destroy it if your not charged/convivted.

Wether they do or not, is another question.



posted on Jan, 26 2006 @ 02:27 AM
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While it sounds real nice putting everyone in a DNA database from the get go - for the purpose of solving & preventing crime. Of course those unaware of the reality of our world say "Why worry if you don't do anything wrong" or commit a crime?

On the one hand I suppose if we all knew from the begining that if we do a crime in our lifetimes there would be virtually no way to get away with it because we would always leave a dna trace behind - that could reduce crime somewhat. The problem is - say I wanted to commit a crime or set someone up - hey easy all I do is go into his bathroom & steal a few hairs from his brush or shower drain & carefully leave them at a crime scene.

How anyone can be so ignorant to believe that police who know someone is guilty won't plant DNA to manipulate a crime scene - OJ trial anyone?

The real evil intent lies in what else they plan to do with the database besides solve crimes. That is the real purpose of this & has nothing to do with solving crimes, but a far darker purpose of segragating us further than we already are.

My DNA is mine & if someone wants to study it they should pay me & I should have a choice whether or not they can have it. That is how it would be in a free society. Should we allow others to catagorize us like cattle?

Nobody owns me and anyone who tries to store DNA without my consent is my enemy & their only purpose is to do me harm or at the very least have the upper hand over me at all times - That my friends is EVIL and those who support this are either ignorant, brainwashed or truely evil ones. It's time to rid are planet of evil & not allow it to grow any further.


Originally posted by FactoryLad
It is standard practice when you are arrested for a criminal offence to take your DNA, fingerprints and photograph. All of these are kept regardless of whether you are charged or not.

It's not a Police decision, it's a Home Office one.


What a crock of BS. Yeah that's how greed evil & power hungry mongers manipulate the unaware. Whether they're slimy businessmen, politcians or goverment whores. They call it standard practice as if they're just a cog in they system. Pass the buck - none of us are responsible.

Wake up open your eyes - while you still have a choice of when you can open them. You can either say "no more smoke & mirrors now" or you can continue to submit to your masters & many will die fighting to become truely free once again.

Before we allow others to use our finger prints, retna scans, DNA or whather else they come up with we need to create rules that protect how they can use this data as it belongs to us and is part of us. We can't just allow them to do whatever they like with it just because they give us one useful purpose and they later decide to do something else with it.




[edit on 26-1-2006 by outsider]



posted on Jan, 26 2006 @ 05:38 AM
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Not too hot on the idea of a big DNA library then, eh guys?

Well, thanks to the Serious Organised Crime and Police Act that was recently passed, police officers have the right to take prints of the soles of you shoes/trainers when your in custody. This way you can be linked with any other offences with the same sole pattern left at a crime scene. They're kept and logged against your name too.

To be honest, I'm not going to lose any sleep over any of it. You've got my DNA, fingerprints and footware impressions...what are you going to do with it? Remember, this is in a legal sense people, it's not going to be used for anything else.



posted on Jan, 26 2006 @ 05:46 AM
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it's not going to be used for anything else.


How do you know? I'm sure Hitler or Stalin would have loved it had this technology been available back then
Are you so certain that the UK, US or some other "free" country will always remain "free"? Why mark out all the Jews/Pols/etc etc etc when all you need is a skin sample, a database and a program taking every newborns dna and putting it on a database somewhere.

It's not the Government I'm afraid of, it's the sheeple like you who will just blindly follow.

It will be people like YOU who will allow this to be abused through apathy and complacency.

This technology in of itself is not the danger, it's Human Nature itself that is the threat. Which is why when it comes to all encompasing dna/fingerprint(or whatever) databases we should just leave well enough alone.

On a side note, why did someone tag this thread with the tag "eugenics"?
I don't see the connection here.

[edit on 26-1-2006 by sardion2000]



posted on Jan, 26 2006 @ 05:56 AM
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I know this has nothing to do with DNA but i've heard that some schools are asked to make children do finger paintings, so they can be collected up and handed over to the government or police? as obviously your finger prints never change, anyone know anything about this?

Thanks



posted on Jan, 26 2006 @ 05:57 AM
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Originally posted by DodgeG1
I know this has nothing to do with DNA but i've heard that some schools are asked to make children do finger paintings, so they can be collected up and handed over to the government or police? as obviously your finger prints never change, anyone know anything about this?

Thanks


Okay now that is getting a bit overly paranoid.

[edit on 26-1-2006 by sardion2000]



posted on Jan, 26 2006 @ 05:58 AM
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How do you know? I'm sure Hitler or Stalin would have loved it had this technology been available back then *snip*


Perhaps, but then again speculation can be misleading.

Remember, if it was found out that the British Government was using a DNA library for truely evil purposes the European Court of Human Rights would have a field day dissasembiling them.

I'm hard pressed to find a truely evil purpose one can do with a few scraping of skin cells anyway.

The most your looking at is breach of civil liberties, if your that concerned, go see a solicitor and book yourself a hearing in the European Court of Human Rights. I'm supprised no-one moaning about it hasn't done this already.

I know DNA is supposed to be implemented into UK Identity Cards and I'm disgusted at the idea of this. Not at the notion that DNA samples would be used in such a way, but the fact our government has the cheek to make us pay £80 for the privilage of carrying a piece of plastic around.

Feet firmly on the ground me, mate.

Edited to add quote.

[edit on 26/1/2006 by FactoryLad]



posted on Jan, 26 2006 @ 06:07 AM
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Originally posted by sardion2000

Originally posted by DodgeG1
I know this has nothing to do with DNA but i've heard that some schools are asked to make children do finger paintings, so they can be collected up and handed over to the government or police? as obviously your finger prints never change, anyone know anything about this?

Thanks


Okay now that is getting a bit overly paranoid.

[edit on 26-1-2006 by sardion2000]


maybe, but ya never know!



posted on Jan, 26 2006 @ 06:57 AM
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Originally posted by FactoryLad
Not too hot on the idea of a big DNA library then, eh guys?

Well, thanks to the Serious Organised Crime and Police Act that was recently passed, police officers have the right to take prints of the soles of you shoes/trainers when your in custody. This way you can be linked with any other offences with the same sole pattern left at a crime scene. They're kept and logged against your name too.


Oh dear I can see a sudden rise and spree of shoe theft.. "I was mugged and the thief took my shoes"



posted on Jan, 26 2006 @ 07:00 AM
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Originally posted by DodgeG1
I know this has nothing to do with DNA but i've heard that some schools are asked to make children do finger paintings, so they can be collected up and handed over to the government or police? as obviously your finger prints never change, anyone know anything about this?
Thanks


I've never heard of that, personally I am rather proud of all my childrens hand print and foot print drawings they bring home. Wheres there is smoke though.... It is possible, not probable in any way but certainly possible.




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