China J13,J14,J15???

The photo in the article is so realistic. Everything looks real.

Originally posted by Seekerof
The photo is bogus, both of them.
The aircraft is nothing but MFI MiG-1.44 ripoff, CG 3-D modified picture, which was skillfully done.
One, the aircraft in the photo is too smooth and the shadowing is off.
Two, if it does not look like an MFI MiG-1.44 ripoff, then the CG 3-D modified picture of the alleged actual stealth fighter looks like a hybrid of a YF-23 rearpart and a J-10 frontpart with DSI-intake. A definate nice CG 3-D rendering job, giving it a look that is even more stealthy and less bulky than the Russian MFI MiG-1.42/44.

The one from the article looks pretty dusty and rough to me... the second one might have had some touch ups and some fake people put in.

Neither the MiG 1.44 nor the J-10 have the canopy mechanism shown on this plane. The canopy opens its entire body out, whereas on the 1.44 and J-10 only part of it opens, while the front piece is fixed. The canopy mechanism of this plane is similar to the F-22's canopy.

Also if you look at the nose, it has a fold running down, with a bit of an S-shaped curve. Neither the 1.44 nor J-10 or F-22 or YF-23 are like this (-22 and -23 have the fold but it's not curved)

The plane also has a smooth hump on its back. Again, no plane is similar to that.

The tail control surfaces are also much smaller and more outward than both the 1.44 and yf-23

And then of course there's that unique DSI.

It's gonna be quite a photoshop job to make this, I think, because of rather big difference from most of the planes you mentioned.

And I don't see why it can't be an authentic mockup, maybe with CGI touchups to make it look cleaner. What's so hard about making mockups anyway?


[edit on 22-3-2006 by Taishyou]

Ooh looks like I just found another pic of this plane

This one is CGI for sure no argument there


Another



JUST FOUND THOSE TWO
I noticed that all the equipment are removed in the first one and the wall was repainted... maybe the previous pics the mockup was still under construction and now they're done so they cleaned up everything and put the mockup on display.





[edit on 23-3-2006 by Taishyou]

Taishyou,
"Maybe" is not cutting it for me, nor is the use of the word "mockup."
How about provide the link to the pictures/articles and then provide the translation?
Perhaps then, we can all see for ourselves if indeed it "maybe" is a "mockup".....or simply what it really is: a fake?






seekerof

[edit on 23-3-2006 by Seekerof]

Originally posted by Seekerof
Taishyou,
"Maybe" is not cutting it for me, nor is the use of the word "mockup."
How about provide the link to the pictures/articles and then provide the translation?
Perhaps then, we can all see for ourselves if indeed it "maybe" is a "mockup".....or simply what it really is: a fake?

seekerof

[edit on 23-3-2006 by Seekerof]

I think this link will explain everything !!!

jczs.sina.com.cn...

... it's a CG ... a very good one, but clearly a CG !!!

Cheers, Deino

This is the article where they came from

mil.eastday.com...

Basically it talks about how far away the 4th gen fighter is from completion (pretty far)

Recently some pictures of the so-called J-14 4th generation fighter have been circulating on the internet. Its appearance has some strange features. Judging from a tape shown at the Zhuhai Airshow, it's evident that China has already began development of a 4th generation stealth fighter. At least two wind tunnel models are currently undergoing tests. Shenyang is currently conducting basic research on the next-gen fighter. There is speculation that since wind tunnel models have already been made, there is probably a full scale mockup as well. In Chendu, since development for the J-10 has completed, it is highly likely that there are new projects for a new fighter or improvements for the J-10

According to "Chinese defence commentary," two major obstacles for development of a new fighter are engines and radars.

The American F-22 has twin F119—PW100 engines that provide 156kN／15907kg of thrust while it weighs only 14.062 ton, it has excellent T/W ratio. It can also supercruise at mach 1.82

Russia has already started a new engine development project. They want to increase the thrust of AL-31F to 14500kg as well as implementing digital control. Even newer is AL-41F with 196kN thrust. Its inlet temperature exceeds the AL-31F in service in PLAAF by 250 degrees, at 1700 degrees

To Chinese engineers, developing enginges capable of allowing aircraft supercruise is still a big challenge. One main goal is to increase the thrust of WS-10A to above 15000kg and that will take many years, which is why the J-10A can only rely on the AL-31FN for now. In November 2005 new AL-31FN engines have been ordered from Russia. Even after AL-31FN imports, China may still need Russian assistance in developing a new engine

Looking at radars. Radars have already entered the active phased array era. The F-22 uses AN／APG77, which can detect a 1m^2 target from 200km away. In recent exercises, an F-22 defeated 5 F-15Cs without being detected

Russian Zhuk radar has also reached a high level, able to detect fighter sized targets from 200km, track 30 and engage 8

According to "Chinese defence commentary," China has only begun development of a phased arrary radar, as well as seeking assistance from Russia. Russia thinks China already has enough experience on mechanical radar designs, and further assistance may allow China to successfully develop a new radar in 10 years

Finally, looking at weaponry. The two known Chinese stealth fighter designs have internal weapons bays like the F-22. The current PL—12 and SD—10 have larger diameters than the early AIM-120A. To incorporate them into internal weapons bays, they need to be reduced in size, similar to AIM-120C

GPS guided bombs are a must for future strike fighters. Russia has developed the Glonass GPS guidance system. The future J-14 can either borrow the Glonass, or use an indegenous GPS guidance system. Use of the Glonass depends heavily on future Sino-Russian relationship. Indegenous GPS guidance systems are only in the planning phase

J-14's development has already begun, but its completion is fairly far away.

Originally posted by Seekerof
Taishyou,
"Maybe" is not cutting it for me, nor is the use of the word "mockup."
How about provide the link to the pictures/articles and then provide the translation?
Perhaps then, we can all see for ourselves if indeed it "maybe" is a "mockup".....or simply what it really is: a fake?

The plane being a mockup was not my idea, it was mentioned by Sergio Coniglio on the original Military Technology article here. Have you read it? Maybe you can contact him and ask him where he got his info.

img134.imageshack.us...

so does anyone know if the pic in the article is real?
the same pic was in this chinese newspaper





[edit on 23-3-2006 by emperorx]

Originally posted by emperorx
so does anyone know if the pic in the article is real?
the same pic was in this chinese newspaper
[edit on 23-3-2006 by emperorx]

It's a fake ... a plain cut and past ! In CDF was a similar discussion until someone found the original newspaper page !

Cheers, Deino

its a very good looking fake, neat plane i must say the rear end looks like a yf-23. Is it just me or does it look like the plane is houses in a basketball gym? In one of the pictures you can see the different colored basketball like waxed shiney court floor.

Taishyou,
I read the article, and thanks for the correction on the use of "mock-up."
Allow me to correct my statement: Sergio Coniglio and you are mistaken in the continued reference to "mock-up," per se'.

There is simply no way that a CGI 3-D computer model can be a "mock-up" in the sense of the aircraft being an actual working model. However, a CGI 3-D computer model can be considered a "mock-up," as undoubtedly referenced and utilized by Sergio Coniglio, if it is a rough drawing or sketch of a proposed printed piece.


Deino, thank you for the link. I had it translated and it confirmed my notions that the alleged Chinese Gen-5 stealth aircraft was indeed simply a computer generated "mock-up," not actually built nor sitting in any Chinese actual hanger somewhere in Manchuria or a suburb in Beijing central.


Char2c35t, agreed. The CGI is an excellent fake.

Originally posted by seekerof
Two, if it does not look like an MFI MiG-1.44 ripoff, then the CG 3-D modified picture of the alleged actual stealth fighter looks like a hybrid of a YF-23 rearpart and a J-10 frontpart with DSI-intake. A definate nice CG 3-D rendering job, giving it a look that is even more stealthy and less bulky than the Russian MFI MiG-1.42/44.

seekerof

[edit on 27-3-2006 by Seekerof]

Found new pic... it looks like this JXX proposal, under construction



[edit on 3-4-2006 by Taishyou]

Thats the F-22 under construction and the picture was the supposed PAK-FA