34th Floor of the WTC!!!

Hey,

just came across this. Sounded interesting. Its from the account of William Rodriguez, a hero and survivor of 9/11.

Strangely, while William was on the 33rd floor he heard lots of very loud noise as if someone was moving heavy equipment and furniture around on the 34th floor. The reason this is interesting is that the 34th floor was completely empty. Elevators did not stop at the 34th floor. It was off limits due to a construction project. He said that this was the first time that he felt fear.

The full article is at this link.

He heard explosions from below him and above. Wonder what was on the 34th floor???

If the 34th floor was off limits due to a "construction project," and this guy heard loud noises like something moving on that floor, then I guess we can put one and one together and figure there was some "construction" still going on, eh?

That or another of a long list of coincidences, of course.

Oops - or he's lying. Can't forget that one.

Btw, I have a .pdf file of the court case this guy brought (er, is bringing - won't happen) against the government if anyone ever wants it. It has some information in it that's began thinning out online, much like the file itself, such as direct references to gag orders placed upon the witnesses. This case and Indira Singh's testimony are the only verfifiable witness testimonies I'm aware of indicating gag orders ordered directly upon civilian witnesses.

[edit on 17-1-2006 by bsbray11]

By all means, post it up! I'd definately be interested in this!

Which tower are we talking about?


www.cooperativeresearch.org...
North

John O'Neill begins his new job as head of security at the WTC. [New Yorker, 1/14/02] A friend says to him, �Well, that will be an easy job. They're not going to bomb that place again.� O'Neill replies, �Well actually they've always wanted to finish that job. I think they're going to try again.� On September 10, he moves into his new office on the 34th floor of the North Tower. That night, he tells colleague Jerry Hauer, �We're due for something big. I don't like the way things are lining up in Afghanistan� (a probable reference to the assassination of Afghan leader Ahmed Shah Massoud the day before). O'Neill will be killed in the 9/11 attack. [PBS Frontline, 10/3/02 (D)]

www.nj.com.../specialprojects/huntevil/disguise13.html
south

That shattered rear window on his Dodge Durango looked to be the worst part of Paul Newman's day when he discovered it at 7:30 a.m. The Maplewood man knew he'd be out $600 and late to his job on the 34th floor of the South Tower.

Your story seems like a hoax. I found this information through one simple Google search.

That night, he tells colleague Jerry Hauer, ?We're due for something big. I don't like the way things are lining up in Afghanistan? (a probable reference to the assassination of Afghan leader Ahmed Shah Massoud the day before).

nothin for nothin but that didn't get reported till the 13th.

Really? Here's a story from 9/11 saying he was feared dead in an explosion.

Afghanistan resistance leader feared dead in blast
By Ahmed Rashid in Lahore
(Filed: 11/09/2001)

THE leader of the Afghan resistance, Ahmad Shah Massoud, was reported to have been killed or seriously wounded yesterday in a grave setback to hopes of toppling the extremist Islamic Taliban regime.

www.telegraph.co.uk.../news/2001/09/11/wmass11.xml

You're right. Bombed on the 9th...conflicting reports on the 10th...pretty sure he's dead on the 11th...confirmed dead by the 13th.
Sorry, I misread my info.

www.theconservativevoice.com...

There was a swooshing sound coming from the freight elevators on B2 and B3. Water from the fire sprinklers from all of the floors had gone into the elevator shaft. There were two individuals trapped below who were in danger of drowning. Rodriguez was able to secure a long enough ladder to extend into the shaft to facilitate their escape from a watery grave.

He had possession of just one of the five master keys that opened all of the stairwell doors at each of the floors in the 110 story building. The other four key holders were trained for emergencies. They had already left the building. Firemen from New York City Unit Six arrived. Each fireman, in addition to protective clothing, had about 70 pounds of equipment. William, who now had the only key, led the firemen up stairwell B. Firemen were going up as victims were coming down. The stairwells were narrow with no windows.

The firemen made it up to the 27th floor but were exhausted from the burden of their equipment. As William had ascended up the stairwell he, as well as the firemen, had heard explosions from the 20th through the 30th floor. Chunks of the building were falling down all around them and they could literally hear the building coming down. Yet, the firemen continued to climb and give aid. After all, they assumed the fire was isolated at the location where the plane entered.

On the 33rd floor, William was able to procure some dust masks from a maintenance office. The air was thick with smoke. On the 33rd floor he found a woman laying on the floor in a fetal position. She didn't know where to go or what to do. They had fire drills twice a year but because of employee turnover, not everyone had a clear view of emergency procedures. While some individuals intuitively respond appropriately in an emergency, others are absolutely paralyzed by their fears.

Strangely, while William was on the 33rd floor he heard lots of very loud noise as if someone was moving heavy equipment and furniture around on the 34th floor. The reason this is interesting is that the 34th floor was completely empty. Elevators did not stop at the 34th floor. It was off limits due to a construction project. He said that this was the first time that he felt fear.

They continued to ascend to the 39th floor. This is as far as William got before he was turned back by the firefighters. As he began his descent he heard the plane hit the south tower.

The first plane hit WTC 1 at 8:46:26 , and the second hit WTC 2 at 9:02:54, or 16 1/2 minutes later.

This guy must be some kind of superhero. He finds a ladder and rescues people trapped in an elevator, then he goes to the lobby and meets up with the firemen. He then climbs 33 floors (against the flow of people coming down them), stops on 33, helps a woman, goes and gets some dust masks out, then gets back into the stairwell, goes up another 6 floors all in about 16 minutes. Wow.

A comfortable walking speed is around 3.1 mph (source).

There are 5280 feet in a mile. So 3.1 mph = 16368 ft. per hour, which is the same as 272.8 ft. per minute, or 4.5 ft. per second.



Each floor was 12 feet high. Assuming the stairs were at 45 degree angles (which looks as if it creates additional distance than was actually there because of how steep it is), we can get the following:



By Pythagorean Theorem, a² + b² = c². whereas c is the hypotenuse, and a and b are the remaining sides. So 144 + 144 = 288, and the square root of 288 is 16.97, which I'll round up to 17. Therefore we can estimate the stairs being about 17 feet long per floor.

I'll throw in 10 feet on each floor between each set of stairs. So we have 17 feet of stairs per floor, and 10 feet between each set on each floor.

17 ft. + 10 ft. = 27 ft.
27 ft. * 33 = 561 ft.

So we can estimate about 561 ft. to walk up 33 floors of stairs.

According to the earlier figure of 272.8 ft. per minute, at a comfortable walking pace, 561 feet can be comfortably walked in a little over 2 minutes. Therefore, if Rodriguez was moving fairly quickly, and given the circumstances we can assume he was, then it would've taken him less than 2 minutes to climb up those 33 floors. If he was jogging at about 6.2 mph, it would've taken him 1 minute to climb the 33 floors.

1 minute to climb up, 2/11 of that time to climb an additional 6 floors (6/33 = 2/11) and the same time doubled to come back down, leaves him about 13 full minutes to actually help people and not just running up and down stairs.

He had plenty of time.

This man was one of the heros of 9/11, yes, but not because of any superhuman abilities. Any healthy person could do the physical work he did in the given amount of time; I've just shown it wouldn't be hard - at all. You should be ashamed for accusing this man of lying in the first place.

[edit on 26-1-2006 by bsbray11]

Have you ever tried to walk up 39 floors? Not to mention the fact that there were people going down. There is no way that he could have done all the things he claimed to have done in 15 minutes.

In any case, I think that illustrates the power of selective memory. If he claimed that the sound he heard was the south tower collapsing; his timeline would make more sense. As it is, his accounts are full of selective interpretations of events.

For instance, when he was in the basement, how could he possibly distinguish the impact from the subsequent fuel air explosions?

How does he know that the sounds he heard on 33 weren’t coming from the building structure itself?

Originally posted by HowardRoark
Have you ever tried to walk up 39 floors? Not to mention the fact that there were people going down. There is no way that he could have done all the things he claimed to have done in 15 minutes.

Sorry; I just proved mathematically that it wouldn't be that hard, judging by the distances involved. There would be time to spare to allow people to pass on their way down; no problem.

You can speculate all you'd like, but his testimony adds up perfectly as it stands. Sorry Howard.

Originally posted by bsbray11

Originally posted by HowardRoark
Have you ever tried to walk up 39 floors? Not to mention the fact that there were people going down. There is no way that he could have done all the things he claimed to have done in 15 minutes.

Sorry; I just proved mathematically that it wouldn't be that hard, judging by the distances involved. There would be time to spare to allow people to pass on their way down; no problem.

You can speculate all you'd like, but his testimony adds up perfectly as it stands. Sorry Howard.

Bsbray, I would like to see you run up 39 floors. Perhaps your math is valid, and in a place without gravity, I am sure You indeed would be able to travel a long distance fast. Please, try it out and report back, it would be fun to hear Your revised version of this mans ability to climb stairs. Just think about it... 1 minute?

Mathematically it might be possible. Realistically a lot less likely. I have a hard enough time going up 8 floors to my doctors office, taking my time.

Originally posted by Ulvetann
Bsbray, I would like to see you run up 39 floors. Perhaps your math is valid, and in a place without gravity, I am sure You indeed would be able to travel a long distance fast. Please, try it out and report back, it would be fun to hear Your revised version of this mans ability to climb stairs. Just think about it... 1 minute?

I actually did imagine it, and I don't think I would have any problem doing that. I've run up and down flights of stairs in the past just for the hell of it. I'm in good physical condition, and Rodriguez doesn't exactly look like a tub of lard:



external image

I might be short for breath for a bit, but it certainly isn't an a grand Olympic challenge. My equation is pretty much the equivalent of running 561 feet at a little over 6 mph. May be hard to believe, but some of us Americans are still in decent shape, and can actually manage to run up stairs.

Also keep in mind that the limits of the human body can be pushed that much further under extreme stress, when adrenaline excretion increases. It takes its toll on the body (very unhealthy), but people have been known to lift cars with their bare hands in similar circumstances. Thus is the effect of adrenaline upon the human body. And again, this isn't exactly professional athletics to begin with.


Why can't you guys accept this guys testimony as he states it? He was just as much a hero of 9/11 as all the others there helping to save lives that day, including the firefighters, and policemen, and civilian volunteers, and the WTC workers themselves, such as Rodriguez himself. Just because you don't think you could do it, doesn't mean squat towards his testimony. His testimony is perfectly reasonable for a healthy man in such circumstances.

[edit on 26-1-2006 by bsbray11]

I agree with bsbray you'd be amazed what people can do when their adreniline is runnning.

In the situation at the WTC I have no doubt someone could run up 33 flights with little problem.

People have lifted impossibly heavy objects to save people. Adreniline is amazing stuff.

[edit on 26/1/2006 by ANOK]

Originally posted by eoyn

Strangely, while William was on the 33rd floor he heard lots of very loud noise as if someone was moving heavy equipment and furniture around on the 34th floor. The reason this is interesting is that the 34th floor was completely empty. Elevators did not stop at the 34th floor. It was off limits due to a construction project. He said that this was the first time that he felt fear.

He heard explosions from below him and above. Wonder what was on the 34th floor???

Classic "straw man" argument.

He heard a loud noise. The floor was off limits due to construction. Then the Straw Man of the "explosion" is created to be debunked.

Nevermind that the floor would not have been off limits to construction workers.
Nevermind that a sound of moving equipment was changed to "explosions."

Now you must debunk "explosions" on an empty floor or in other words... the Straw Man



Now...another Straw Man?

A guy on B2 takes another injured guy outside and runs back in. Uses a ladder to help some people right there in an elevator. Meets up with the firemen because he has a key and goes up WITH THEM to the 27th floor where the firemen were exausted. He goes up to 33 and finds masks in an office, then goes up to 39 before the fire fighters (that he was WITH) turned him back.

No debate on the fact the firemen made it that far too. Only the Straw Man about physical capability of someone they never met and a degredation into math and gravity.

Hello? The firemen made it that far too, but took a break on 27 because they were carrying 70+ pounds more.

Sheesh.

[edit on 27-1-2006 by ZeddicusZulZorander]

I am not denying that the firemen made it up that far, I just don't thing they did it in 10 minutes.

Does anyone know the exact floors the squibs were emerging from?

Perhaps if the 34th floor was one of the places squibs emerged from it would correlate well with Rodriguez's story.

Also another report extremely similar on the 98th floor according to Scott Forbes, he heard heavy 'construction' work, literally shaking the floor he was on. He actually had the courage to take a look but when he did the floor was completely empty(!)

Were squibs present at the 98th floor too?

Originally posted by Insolubrious
Does anyone know the exact floors the squibs were emerging from?

Perhaps if the 34th floor was one of the places squibs emerged from it would correlate well with Rodriguez's story.

Also another report extremely similar on the 98th floor according to Scott Forbes, he heard heavy 'construction' work, literally shaking the floor he was on. He actually had the courage to take a look but when he did the floor was completely empty(!)

Were squibs present at the 98th floor too?

Insolubrious,

I don't want to get too much into a debate with you about the squibs, but IF they were in facts squibs, Can you explain why there isn't any failure to the building after the squibs are set off? (in the area of the squib) Also, please explain how the "squib" reacts totaly opposite to that of squibs on other C.D.'s, increasing in intensity as the collapse gets closer.

Originally posted by CameronFox

Insolubrious,

I don't want to get too much into a debate with you about the squibs, but IF they were in facts squibs, Can you explain why there isn't any failure to the building after the squibs are set off? (in the area of the squib) Also, please explain how the "squib" reacts totaly opposite to that of squibs on other C.D.'s, increasing in intensity as the collapse gets closer.

Dear CameronFox,

you say there isn't any failure to the building after the squibs are set off?

Yet there is failure to the building after the squibs are set off, total and catostrophic failure only a seconds later (if that)! Besides the plan was more about destruction than creating failure.

Remember, these were two of the largest buildings in the world! If it were official C.D it would of been a record breaker, not to mention a monumental task.

There was so much more explosive energy required and a much larger area to be destroyed than an average C.D job. The explosives were not planted at the edges of the outer walls, but rather deeper in the central core. The pressure is moving faster outwards than the visible destruction. C.D usually happens from the base and travels upwards, this was a wave of destruction travelling downwards. It cannot be compared to other C.D jobs since all the C.D videos we see are of very small and weaker buildings using different techniques, lower yields and different types of explosives. These squibs are huge and centralized! If it were simply caused by pressures from above then they would of been bursting out on all the floors all the way down in chorus and I doubt anyone would question it. However they emerge from limited locations and are centralized.