Vampires, Lycans, and Witches...and the Church...

Originally posted by Nakash
Blue soldier, you want evidence? How about the fact that Gnostic Gospels were around way before the Templars were even founded. Blue, read those gnostic Gospels and see for yourself that they have nothing to do with Christianity- they are PAGANISM. This is what get's to me- nobody is "hiding" anything, it's just that these texts are so blatantly heretical and ridiculous that they don't even merit being part of the Apocrypha (a useful set of texts which though not "inspired" in any sense shed some light on accepted Canon).



[edit on 23-1-2006 by Nakash]

I have no doubt that the templars were founded after the Gnostic bibles were written, but I did not say that the templars wrote the books. I said that they found them. And yes, I did read some of the Gnostic bibles. How are they full of heresy? The gnostic bibles are composed of books (supposedly) written by Jesus Christ and his disciples including Mary Magdalene. They are full of deep meaning, symbolism, philosiphy, and written beautifully the same way the current bible is. If you mean heresy, as in against the Catholic church, then I completely agree. But If you ask me to choose between Jesus Christ and his followers, or the Catholic Church which has a long history of corruptiveness, then I pick my God before my Church.

don't you realize that Masons are really controlled by the Illumanati... who are really the Learned Men of the 1600's who found a way to take a human and merge him genetically with a wolf? Yep, the Illumanati are the Original Werewolves/Lycans!

(Is that how you wanted the thread to go? I think I hit everything except George W. Bush's involvment. Nope, wait! It's said he's a Mason... therefore Illumanati, and thus a Werewolf! All because a handful of scientist were killer or imprisioned in the 1600's by the Church. Go figure.)

Link? What link? YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE LINK! ...... anyways, sarcasm needs no link.

Blue, I'm not Catholic but any way you put it Gnosticism is heretical pop paganism dervied from Neoplatonist thinkers of the Roman era. They aren't Christianity, they are fairy tales which have nothing to do with the Bible. How do we judge a text as heretical ? We see if it has some level of concordance with accepted texts. Thus The book of Maccabees does not belong to the OT. Likewise Gnostic gospels are texts written by Romans still in Mystery cults and who weren't too fond of the accepted figure given to Christ and don't belong to the NT. This is a fundamental rule of Hermeneutics.


Blue, may I suggest you read of Christian denominations outside of Catholicism? The Roman Catholic church is not really Christian in it's precepts (which were taken from Babylon), Jesus Christ is conceived in the Gospels as a FAR different figure (with very concise wishes) other than that espoused by the Popes and their Cardinals. I myself am an Anabaptist- many who held beliefs similar to mine were killed by the Roman church (ie: Crusade against the Waldenses, the Maverens, etc.)

[edit on 2-2-2006 by Nakash]

Evidence Evidence!! I need Evidence!!

And by the way, simply because the Catholic Church deems the Gnostic Bibles as heretical and blasphemous doesn't mean they are. As I pointed out from my past posts, The CC has been known to be wrong and corrupt on many occasions. The reason why the CC deems the Gnostic Bibles as heretical is because the Gnostic Bibles offer a different view on Jesus and his disciples, which the CC is trying to silence.

Bleh, I hate the term "lycan." That word - or abbreviated word, rather - didn't exist until it was written into the 'Underworld' movie.

Actual words you could use are: werewolf, lycanthrope, shapeshifter, wolfman, and loup-garou.

Apologies for this little rant, but as a mythology/folklore student and a language nazi, I can't stand that term outside of 'Underworld' context.

reply to post by Jeremiah25



i understand the other ways the church is corrupt may offend some but i am rather interested in finding these out. if you could supply me with this knowledge or with links that will enable me to find it on my own i would greatly appreciate it. my e-mail is [email protected] any information would be greatly appreciated.

reply to post by Jeremiah25

It is not so hard to believe that there are vampires in the world as mother nature quite often brings similare creatures in others an example we have bats but we also have vampire bats and other varietys as well. There are whitches in the world and more than enough have been burned through the ages. Also there is the weairwolf condition very rare but some people are born covered in thick fur. So is it realy far fetched to believe that Vampires, Lickens, Shapeshifters, Warewolves and Witches are walking this earth maybe living right next door to you. Maybe the world has evolved so much that once again they will be seen as they have in history long gone.

I have been studying the physical side of the paranormal for years and especialy Werewolf and vampire phenomena and I would just like to point out and I know that the sceptics will snub this but never the less I would like to state that the film made a number of years ago called DOG SOLDIERS is very very closer to the mark than sceptics think. The proof is out there for people to collate and peruse then make up thier own mind , but please remember to come to your decision logicaly using the evidence that is availabe to the public.

yours abet

i read through this entire thread to see if anyone caught on, but apparently noone did. THE EARTH REVOLVES AROUND THE SUN, and not the other way around. THE SUN IS STATIONARY, IT IS THE EARTH THAT MOVES.
the church wanted people to believe that the sun revolved around the earth, thus making the earth (God's master creation) the center of everything.

reply to post by catastrophic_insinuations


that would be the same church which held SERIOUS debates on wether ` dog head men ` had souls and should be preached to - or were animals to be treated as such

reply to post by TheBlueSoldier


I believe the RCC is Divinely founded. I am Catholic. However, even a Divinely founded institution can be corrupt because it is run by men. The true view of the Church is what She teaches which has never changed dogmatically. Please do not bring up Galileo, Joan of Arc or any of the non dogmatic decisions of the Church.

It is obvious BlueSoldier you just hate. The poster who challenged you on the Gnostic gospels is exactly spot on. His view is what is generally accepted by most scholars and indeed anyone who has read them. You are asking for proof from him when you are the one who has a view that is not main stream. The burden of proof is more on you. My opinion is however that you hate the Church and no amount of clear concise logic would matter, you will continue to hate.

Also, several statements you have made fly in the face of accepted history. For example, Galileo was not executed. The Gnostic Gospels were not written by who you say they were. If you are this far off on historically accepted facts, your credibility about even less substantiated history is greatly in doubt. Second, your hate has destroyed your perception of Western history where many of these things are concerned. A blind man can see that you are really straining and trying too hard to put your hate of the Church into history.

A more interesting point would be why you hate the Church so much. I am not talking about quoting some historical fact that may bother you but what personally is it? Has something happened to you in regards to the Church? Did you grow up with this prejudice? Why is this a personal thing for you?

reply to post by Nakash


If no one is hiding anything why did your famous catholic church hold the dead sea scrolls for over 2 decades and refuse to let the Thomas scroll to even be read by anyone but the pope and his asststant...only to have it destroyed after? ( there are still 10 scrolls that they refuse to release)
You have no idea what you are talking about! the scrools are NOT PAGANISM in nature. I for one have read the originals and they do nothing other than tear down the BS translation that the vatican let the" people" have.(Roman Slves to be exact) Nothing in the vatican or king james version lines up with the true historical facts that have been flooding forth since they decided to try and conceal the scrolls from the public for so long.
The dead sea scrolls arent the oldest ones out there and the only difference between them and the older ones is in the use of phrases.... they are visibly the same in meaning just different words used as some are in differnet dialects. They dont follow any form of pagan religion either. They tell people the truth about not needing some preist to forgive them of their sins that is the all encompassing creationals power IE. GOD... the same portion was given to man in the form of a soul and it is the persons responsibility to live a just and upright life period. They dont like the scrolls because they ALL say it isnt up to some priest over the people to lead; it is the persons responsibility; it is up to the person to make sure his community is taken care of; it is up to the person to come before God in secret if he feels the need because what is between God and the person is just that. Not one place in the ancient scrolls says you have to pay tithes to anyone not one place does it say any organized church has the right to baptise or has the power to forgive sins. The scrolls talk about living in peace and loving "everything" period. The main sticking point for the Vatican is that in the oldest scrolls Jesus as you call him is nothing more than a teacher with a gift for understaning and the ability to help people understand things "hidden" from them by the churches. In my book this makes him a great man who put aside his own life and taught so everyone he could reach could understand the truth.
These so called Bibles are just the original ROMAN LAWS FOR THE SLAVES...all that BS was the LAWS in place for the slaves in the ROMAN EMPIRE at the time. It has been proven many times with their very own VATICAN records. All you have to do to compare them is a very simple historical search on the Roman Empires rules for its slaves just prior to the time of Jesus.(ie people) Prepare to be amased because the RULES and the BIBLE are the samething! The only difference being is that the Bible has some Vatican "timed" backwards history in thier words added.

Think of this as you will. but i am a firm believer in vampires. and i would just like to put down some reasons why I and many others believe in what we do. my name is Bella but don't think im a twilight obsessed fan im only in this because i am a vampire believer and always have been:

1) If vampires are truly as clever, intelligent and evolved as myth and legend make them out to then is it any wonder why they haven't yet been properly discovered and have been able to blend in with the scene of the normal day life of a human with out a hitch?

2) think to a few years back, when scientists said that absolutely nothing could live to a certain point in the ocean as the pressure at the bottom was so strong anything that went down there would inevitably ... die? well years later they found a whole new species! aquatic creatures that we would never of dreamed of. and that shows that people get it wrong, it shows that scientist can be wrong sometimes... dead wrong.

and yes what if vampires have tried reaching out to us? Like if a newly created vampire is lonely and wants, needs to tell someone about him/her so it can take the strain off them, but by the time they try to convince us, a fellow vampire or a coven member has told them the dangers and has convinced him/her vampire that they cant tell anyone or else? and then the lonesome vampire has simply agreed.

4) the last and most puzzling but true reason. Shouldn't we be finding ways to prove why they cant exist not ways to show they do? i mean there is more proof showing they do, from sightings and odd events and history staitments. There is no proof that they don't exist accept from the fact that there isn't any to show 100% that they do. so if anyone ever says they do not exist then ask them for the proof. I bet they cant show you any and never will. I don't know if we ever will know if they 100% do exist but look at the facts and the science of it all. we have prodigies, physics, and extraordinary people in this world which should be impossible so why not vampires?

Thanks for reading

Any questions that are sensible i am happy to answer

Bells.

reply to post by TheBlueSoldier


as a protestant i would like to apoligize forsome poeples racist remarks. if you are a church going christian you would know t hat god hates the sin but loves the sinner. also that you will be judged according to how you judge others so be very careful asto how you do so. catholics although misled are people the same as us all. its not about which religion you are but about your faith. god honors faith. as for werewofls and vampires, if you research history properly you will find accounts where peopel did things that made them look the part in peoples eyes. a dutches in and around germany wastold thats he could stay young forever if she drank the blood of virgins. so she would take virgins and bleed them and drink the blood. she killed uwards of 3000 in her lifetime before she died. vlad the impaler was taken for a vampire for his deads. in south america people with a desease whcih gives them hair all over their bodies were mistaken for werewolfs. so its the human percption of how others look and what one persons idiotic opinion which starts off a myth and or peoples fears.

reply to post by Anonymous ATS


loup-garou, ... trust the french. they can make anything sound classy.

not saying that werewolves arent classy, i wouldnt know. its just not the first thing that springs to mind.

Originally posted by WolfofWar
You should note that Lycans and Werewolves are two seperate things. The term lycan is short hand for lycantrophy, which means a human transforming into a wolf. Where Werewolves are humans that turn into a hybrid wolf-man.


Lycans=Skinwalkers essentially

Wrong. Lycanthropy has mostly branches to it that do not include transforming into a wolf where it is mainly a mental transformation more than a physical transformation. Also, it is slim to none to find a real werewolf claiming to a physical transformation.

Originally posted by Bella-x
Think of this as you will. but i am a firm believer in vampires. and i would just like to put down some reasons why I and many others believe in what we do. my name is Bella but don't think im a twilight obsessed fan im only in this because i am a vampire believer and always have been:

1) If vampires are truly as clever, intelligent and evolved as myth and legend make them out to then is it any wonder why they haven't yet been properly discovered and have been able to blend in with the scene of the normal day life of a human with out a hitch?

2) think to a few years back, when scientists said that absolutely nothing could live to a certain point in the ocean as the pressure at the bottom was so strong anything that went down there would inevitably ... die? well years later they found a whole new species! aquatic creatures that we would never of dreamed of. and that shows that people get it wrong, it shows that scientist can be wrong sometimes... dead wrong.

and yes what if vampires have tried reaching out to us? Like if a newly created vampire is lonely and wants, needs to tell someone about him/her so it can take the strain off them, but by the time they try to convince us, a fellow vampire or a coven member has told them the dangers and has convinced him/her vampire that they cant tell anyone or else? and then the lonesome vampire has simply agreed.

4) the last and most puzzling but true reason. Shouldn't we be finding ways to prove why they cant exist not ways to show they do? i mean there is more proof showing they do, from sightings and odd events and history staitments. There is no proof that they don't exist accept from the fact that there isn't any to show 100% that they do. so if anyone ever says they do not exist then ask them for the proof. I bet they cant show you any and never will. I don't know if we ever will know if they 100% do exist but look at the facts and the science of it all. we have prodigies, physics, and extraordinary people in this world which should be impossible so why not vampires?

Thanks for reading

Any questions that are sensible i am happy to answer

Bells.

I completely agree and happen to know that vampires do exist, but simply not in the traditional sense. They drink blood but are not vicious, they use donors and underground blood banks to quench it, and they seem like every other human most of the time. They blend into society for their own protection because people in general are afraid of the unknown, and if the unknown became known and reality, people would want it destroyed at any cost.

My theories on this from my experiences with this lycans apparently are very well hidden and have tribes in the hidden parts of the world. Vampires i think live underground and might be hidden by the catholics who worship them since lucifer is the sun god or w/e it makes sense if vampires pull the strings of the catholics. Also, witches are rarer nowadays but theres still those who dare still practice black magic. the statues of moai for example were idols for their gods who in turn gave them gifts just like lucifer (the emperor of the entire world) gives gifts to his subjects who in turn keep the secrets of the world secret so these secret societies can live in peace and keep on ruling the world or in peace (hidden) from lucifers vampire hunters, dont get me wrong but i think the main battle nowadays is between the vampires and lucifer but no one wants to see the vampires win because their vampires and yeah i know theres alot of holes in these theories but maybe i got a couple parts wrong and maybe u guys get the point