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AboveTopSecret.com is a Government COINTELPRO Disinformation Operation

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posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 11:21 AM
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Guess the deafing silence says it all.


Spooky.........




posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 11:29 AM
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Originally posted by zeed85
Guess the deafing silence says it all.


Spooky.........


You are expecting an answer after 4 hours? You DO know that staff also have jobs in the real world. Nothing "spooky" about that. And yes, you got this post because it's my lunch hour.



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 11:49 AM
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Originally posted by intrepid


You are expecting an answer after 4 hours? You DO know that staff also have jobs in the real world. Nothing "spooky" about that. And yes, you got this post because it's my lunch hour.


Well there have been Skeptic plus mods and members in the last four hours.

Spooky was refering to the fact this thread through it`s many pages haven`t answered any of the points questioned by an external site, yet the responses are of the type mentioned in that site.

People who have experiance and knowledge of Cointelpro activities and tactics posting how this site (if Cointelpro) would react and then l read 15 pages of the reactions that are typical kinda makes you wonder.



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 11:54 AM
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Originally posted by zeed85
Is there any truth behind Laura knights claim that the IP addresses for ATS/BTS/PTS address can be traced back to CIA at Langley.

See points out 213.206.128,213.206.129,123.206.130 Node Name GOV -BB21-LAN-14,GOV- BB22-LAN-15,GOV-BB23-LAN-16.

Anyone posting that information is either:
1) Off their "rocker"
or
2) Unable to do simple look-ups of IPs, and notice those are fake IP's.

That information is based on a joke-post made by a member on our chit-chat board on April-Fool's day. It's not real. It's a joke. It always was a joke.




Why have other sites made these claims and have been the first to use Cointelpro which every govt consprircy buff knew excisted to make these claims to ATS before ATS members made them to the other sites.

ATS members tend to be more sophisticated and resist knee-jerk reactions. So, while you're certainly going to see speculative conclusion-jumping here on ATS, it's not as rampant as on other "conspiracy sites".

Many staff and long-term members here on ATS work hard at promoting a theory-agnostic approach toward conspiracy research that is focused more on finding truth than proving a pre-existing pet theory. Most other "conspiracy sites" on the Internet begin with favorite pre-existing theories, then search for tidbits of information that prove those theories, and ignore anything that disproves their theories. Here on ATS, most of our members try to be more interested in the truth, even if it ends up disproving popularized conspiracy theories. That stance has often resulted in negative responses from those seeking to validate theories in which our members discover contrary evidence.




The one thing about Mrs Knight that makes it more crediable is the fact she is much more open on her site than the ownership here.

That could just be a personnal choice of the 3 Amigos, but to have a conspiricy site and yet run it as if they are the conspritors makes the question keep coming around.

This is likely because we've made the decision to step into the background and create an environment that is exceptionally open, and empowers our members to engage in collaborative discussion and debate on nearly any subject. We're not "less open", we're "less active" in topic discussions. And this will become even more evident as we work hard to ensure that "AboveTopSecret.com" is not seen as endorsing any specific theory through the posts of the top-three.




but the arguments Mrs Knights site offers would in a court of law make ATS look very very suspect.

I honestly have no idea what you mean by that.




One thing that l would like to know from ATS themselves is how ATS could afford to employ one of Americans largest law firms to deal with a small copyright issue.

At the time, as many know, we had aspirations to move into the development of broadcast content through a television show (it's still being worked on, as well as many other offline possibilities). We thought it important to engage a highly credible firm who also happened to have a lead attorney who as a friend and member of ATS (thereby presenting some price advantages). As things progressed, we're no longer engaged with that firm.

And anyway, we've never treated inappropriate use of our member's content as a "small copyright issues." This is among the many reasons we continue to enjoy loyal members, and intelligent new members. We've made it clear, on several dozen occasions, that we will make all efforts to protect the integrity and usage of the intellectual property our members post to ATS.

The episode in which legal assistance was needed escalated simply because the infringing party wouldn't abide by our simple Creative Commons content deed (linked on every post). All we wanted was proper attribution and indication of additive material (to lessen the derivative nature of their piece)... they refused... we sought legal assistance. Simple.



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 11:56 AM
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The one thing about Mrs Knight that makes it more crediable is the fact she is much more open on her site than the ownership here.


Much more open? You obviously don't have a complete picture of this woman's past. Rather than give you the information, let me just suggest to you that there is information to be found that completely shatters her credibility, if you are only willing to put in five or ten minutes looking.

If she appears more open, it may be because her comments are not constrained by the boundaries of truth and good sense.



Sure maybe irritating to the owners, but the arguments Mrs Knights site offers would in a court of law make ATS look very very suspect.And after all we do seek govt disinfo and truth.It may come to a point where the 3 Amigos might have to stop using the Avatars for protection and come into the light. Mrs Knight may well be correct in her statements regarding the methods used by the owners regarding answering sensitive questioning.


The Amigos don't owe the public anything, least of all a free shot at them out in the real world. They provide a free, high-quality service, and if you don't appreciate it, that's not their problem - as I see it, we're all guests here. We're in no position to make demands or nurture unreasonable expectations.

I also value my privacy a great deal. Many people on here know my name, and my location, and that's fine by me because I don't make enemies, generally. But I'm not about to disclose that information in a grand public display, giving every nutjob in the world a free ticket to cause me pain and annoyance if they so choose. It's not worth the hassle, just for an attempt at dispelling rumors. Truth is, rumors aren't dispelled so easily, and even such a grand gesture would probably fall far short of actually remedying the ignorance in question.

When people want to believe something, they will go to great lengths to avoid and discount information that calls their belief into question.

There's a ton of info on this subject right here at ATS. I suggest that if you're really interested in uncovering the truth, you do your own legwork, instead of expecting the owners of the site to be on-call to answer these re-hashed (and ultimately baseless) accusations.



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 12:09 PM
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Originally posted by zeed85
Well there have been Skeptic plus mods and members in the last four hours.



I'm very ssssad to disssssapoint you that we are not cointelpro, half reptillion CIA agentssss, that we were not able to notice your possst in the lassst 4 hourssss. I apologisssssse.


Personally I have more important stuff in my life to go acting out all cointelpro on people. Especially since I live on a small island off the coast of Venezuela.



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 12:21 PM
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Bandit, I know what you mean. I'd love to take over the world and enslave the human race, but I've gotta be at work in thirty minutes.




posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 12:23 PM
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Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Anyone posting that information is either:
1) Off their "rocker"
or
2) Unable to do simple look-ups of IPs, and notice those are fake IP's.

That information is based on a joke-post made by a member on our chit-chat board on April-Fool's day. It's not real. It's a joke. It always was a joke.


They were pulled from here web site in an entry dated 7th january 2006.Maybe l am of my rocker on an iT dunce.Is that wrong?

www.abovetopsecret.com...



but the arguments Mrs Knights site offers would in a court of law make ATS look very very suspect.

I honestly have no idea what you mean by that.



Her responses statements and evidence on her site are more plausible than ATS`s.

If you are unaware of her site quoted above maybe you should use your friend as they do seem to be very close to the mark.



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 12:25 PM
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how come the link to her site l`ve typed at send to this thread and not her blog site?

I typed laura-knight-jadczyk-blogspot.com/2006/01/cointelpro-above-top-secret.html

[edit on 8-12-2006 by zeed85]



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by zeed85

They were pulled from here web site in an entry dated 7th january 2006.Maybe l am of my rocker on an iT dunce.Is that wrong?

www.abovetopsecret.com...


And if you just follow the breadcrumbs... It will lead to this post right here.

You just had to read the damn thread to see that it was an April fools joke. The link you gave is even linking to that thread. Read the thread. If you want to do detective work, do it good because at this point you are getting a F from me young man.

Can we not be funny on April 1st anymore??? Oh the DRAMA!!



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 12:36 PM
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Originally posted by Unright
So now are the people who try to defend the official position going to get riducled and told that their posts are creating a "sad day" on this site? CatHerder hurled a lot of personal insults that disagreed with him and there was no Admin Edit on his posts. So now can someone insult people who defend the official story and not worry infracting on the board rules?



pft, i get insulted pretty regularly about the fact i dotn think there were demo charges in the WTC. yes. the T&C try to keep it civil and polite, but teh rest of being part of any discussion online or in real life is having a thick skin.

given that i have seen few threads started by mods, or directed by mods...unless everyone that was starting threads was "in on it" how could ats be a govt cointelpro op?



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 12:37 PM
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Originally posted by zeed85
how come the link to her site l`ve typed at send to this thread and not her blog site?

I typed laura-knight-jadczyk-blogspot.com/2006/01/cointelpro-above-top-secret.html



Because we have decided not to give undesirables unwanted attention.



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 12:45 PM
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If it was a April fools joke fine,it is possible that the link you just put up is false.

that`s a statement of observation not my view point.

If Mrs Knight is making up stuff on her site maybe time to shut her down.I would prefer to come to a site such as ATS than one that is trying to slander other`s.



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 12:56 PM
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Originally posted by zeed85
If Mrs Knight is making up stuff on her site maybe time to shut her down.I would prefer to come to a site such as ATS than one that is trying to slander other`s.


We certainly don't desire to advocate any such thing.

The goal of ATS owners, senior staff, and moderators has always been to do our best to lead by example. For the most part, our members follow along and focus more on generating quality content for our forums.

As for the fake IP addresses, it was clear that they were fake since they only contained 3 numbers, not 4 which are standard IP format. (and anyone who did a lookup on our domain could see they were no where near our actual IP)

Because one member spent considerable effort to author a well-researched post that refuted the theories that something other than a passenger airline struck the Pentagon, and we decided to promote a well-presented post on our home page... we were labeled all kinds of nasty things by those intensely married to the no-plane theory.... then, they looked for anything that might discredit "ATS" and found one joke post about government IP's.



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 01:00 PM
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And for the record l like this site.

Responses from the mods that have been here so far are case typical of the E-Mails that are given as examples from mark@abovetopsecret.com and Skeptic.Good, badcop.It would be nice if ATS responses were less of the agressive type.

I know l haven`t been here long and there are many loons around, but it would be nice not to be stereotyped.

But being interested in Govt black ops (They rock my world along skeptics tight buns in that hot red outfit
) these questions and this disscussion is one of the more plausible on this and any other site.That maybe due to the quality of the site it is very very good and well run.



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 01:03 PM
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IP Freely


Originally posted by zeed85
Is there any truth behind Laura knights claim that the IP addresses for ATS/BTS/PTS address can be traced back to CIA at Langley.

See points out 213.206.128,213.206.129,123.206.130 Node Name GOV -BB21-LAN-14,GOV- BB22-LAN-15,GOV-BB23-LAN-16.

You don't have to take anyone's word for it. You can look up IP addresses here:

www.dnsstuff.com...

Please feel free to share what you find.


The Least Important Opinion


Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
This is likely because we've made the decision to step into the background and create an environment that is exceptionally open, and empowers our members to engage in collaborative discussion and debate on nearly any subject. We're not "less open", we're "less active" in topic discussions. And this will become even more evident as we work hard to ensure that "AboveTopSecret.com" is not seen as endorsing any specific theory through the posts of the top-three.

I want to comment publicly on this because I'm running into the same thing with PTS.

Personally, I have all sorts of opinions about all sorts of things. I don't tend to fall into any of the traditional categories when it comes to conspiracies, politics or the "supernatural". In my time on ATS, I've been accused of being right-wing, left-wing and various shades in between.

I tend to think of myself as more of a moderate because I'm open to changing my opinions on the issues if the evidence suggests it, but nonetheless I have strong opinions on some things which can lead to (false and misleading) labels of my views.

Where this can be frustrating relates to my duties on PTS.

Free Tradeoff

As the "PTS Guy", I can go to painstaking lengths to make it clear that that my personal opinions are not "official PTS opinions", but -- inevitably, no matter how hard I try -- many members will come to see it that way.

I can't count the number of PTS threads where I just wanted to jump in and start spouting my opinions on the issues, but instead had to bite my tongue for fear of discouraging anyone who might disagree with me from posting their opinions.

I can protest until I'm blue in the face that I don't take moderator action based on my personal political views, but I already know that's a waste of time. In fact, I've learned that the more I try to explain the distinction, the worse it gets.

Don't get me wrong. I volunteered for the job and can quit anytime if it really bothered me that much. As it turns out, promoting candid, civil, topical discussion is immensely satisfying itself, so I'm willing to make the tradeoff.


So it is for the Amigos. Any time the comment on the issues, as sure as the sun rises and sets, some members will accuse them of bias, pushing propaganda, stifling dissent, hiding the truth, etc. etc. etc.

Bottomless Pit

Just look at all the absolute lunacy surrounding this whole SOTT business.

There's no way I can describe how stunning it is to watch as people continue to believe that crap while knowing for an absolute fact what the truth is. I mean just damn, I'm pretty sure I would have noticed by now if ATS was some sort of government COINTELPRO operation.


It is profoundly disturbing to see just what some people are willing to believe, and just how far they will go to deceive themselves.

But as I like to say: The right to be wrong is just as important as the right to be right.

Though I would love to be able to help Deny Ignorance wherever I can, I do have to respect the right to be wrong.

After all, I've exercised that right often enough in my own life.


Closed Openness


Originally posted by zeed85
The one thing about Mrs Knight that makes it more crediable is the fact she is much more open on her site than the ownership here.

You mentioned Ms. Jadczyk being more "open". Yeah right, open with her opinions, which are certainly no secret since they're copied and pasted all over the Internet, for crying out loud.

But what happens when you disagree with those opinions? That's also easy enough to see, since that's copied and pasted all over the Internet, too.

Her ideas of right and wrong are clear enough: agree with her and you're right. Disagree with her and you're wrong -- and a "psychopath" to boot. How quaint.


Compare and contrast that with the ATS discussion environment. Since when has the ATS staff ever dictated what members should think about the issues?

Is that the ATS "COINTELPRO" goal? To give people a place to voice their honest opinions and discuss the issues with other people who may have differing opinions?

If that's the "sinister agenda", then I'm proud to be "sinister".

But that's just my personal opinion, and yours is quite welcome to vary.



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 01:11 PM
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Originally posted by zeed85
Responses from the mods that have been here so far are case typical of the E-Mails that are given as examples from mark@abovetopsecret.com and Skeptic.Good, badcop.It would be nice if ATS responses were less of the agressive type.

As I've said often enough, Mark's heart is in the right place, but his mouth is in Texas.


Look... imagine being a long-time conspiracist who has made considerable efforts to build and support free and open environments where anyone can discuss anything... then you become the focus of all kinds of nasty accusations. We try to be polite. We try to ignore as much as possible. But over time, frustrations build and not everyone "on staff" is able to hold their temper each time this issue comes up. It's hard... very hard.



posted on Dec, 8 2006 @ 02:46 PM
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Originally posted by zeed85
And for the record l like this site.

Responses from the mods that have been here so far are case typical of the E-Mails that are given as examples from mark@abovetopsecret.com and Skeptic.Good, badcop.It would be nice if ATS responses were less of the agressive type.


The "mark@abovetopsecret.com" is me. When I responded with that email it was after our attempts at being polite and simply asking them to follow basic, decent, Intellectual Property courtesies had been met with my partners and I being called "psychopaths, liars, government fronts", etc...

As S.O. states, I grew up in Texas and I have been known to get a little "riled up" when people attack me and my friends/family and when I get "riled up" over that I tend to lose my social graces and the result is in that email. Thankfully it was limited to email.


I am human, but I finally understood that the result of reacting to these types of people is they just keep going because they are getting free publicity. The dumbest thing I could've done was respond to that email, well I've done dumb things before and I imagine I've still got a few left in me but I won't be paying any attention to that sort of bollocks again.


The "aggression" comes from a weariness of the insanity this represents and the threats to our families and ourselves that happened because of this stupidity. We are trying to be "less aggressive" as I hope is evident here.


You have a valid point about being "stereotyped" when you bring this subject up, that's human nature too and we are trying to avoid doing that as well. Again, the gravity of the idiocy and the egregious invasion of privacy, threats against our loved ones, left a lasting impression and "very bad taste in our mouths".

In any case, I don't blame you or anyone for asking about this out of genuine curiosity, we just simply won't be drug back into this nonsense by those with "other" motivations.


Springer...

[edit on 12-8-2006 by Springer]



posted on Dec, 10 2006 @ 04:53 AM
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Originally posted by Springer


In any case, I don't blame you or anyone for asking about this out of genuine curiosity, we just simply won't be drug back into this nonsense by those with "other" motivations.


Springer...

[edit on 12-8-2006 by Springer]


This kinda response is what us the norms like to read.If we have post`s containing theories that the US govt is willing to kill thousands of its people just to justify a war or whatever reason.Saying ATS is govt run isn`t that impossible so l guess the the mods Admin will just have to settle down and accept that there board be treated this way.Its the down side to been in power.You have to learn how to grow thick skin.

Unfortunetly for the Admin this subject probably won`t sleep for long as in the past, many post`s will probably continue.

For my view is ATS coinpro or similar.I still think it is possibly run or somebody within the Admin is within the intel IT area.

Is it Simon,Skeptic,Springer or all three l don`t know, but l don`t believe it is for anything to control the masses.

Is it bad for the Intel community to be involved here.I don`t mind if they are.I haven`t anything to hide.I don`t care if Simon is NSA or anybody else.I am happy and relieved my govt and others have secret organisations.


Ex

posted on Dec, 10 2006 @ 10:37 AM
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I feel the great need to explain my actions during
Dark Matters down time and I was over in ID..
I am not any great mind or person of any serious concern
other than I have a computer and LOVE ATS.
It was by serious innocence that i posted the links to
THE WOMANS........attacks..and was just looking for
a discussion on this issue.
It was to my surprise when ATS was backup that there
has been a continuing thread and very open discussion
about this....

Smirks.was very nice in correcting me ...
and I am sincerely sorry for any grief I may have caused
to SO
..or any of the persons that put so much work
and tireless effort into making ATS the best site on the internet!
EX



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