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A distant thread has taken an interesting turn, We Need Secret Society Input, please

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posted on Jan, 11 2006 @ 06:21 PM
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I'm not sure if this is proper ATS edicate or not. If not I truly apoligize, but we have met a somewhat interesting impass. We may require some viewpoints from a perspective of people who know more about "Secret Societies" than the current contributors of the thread currently posses. It is concerning trying to determine the intentions of world leaders in respects to why they may prevent (speculation is welcome) Full Disclosure concerning alien visitation. We are simply inquiring from you, the Secret Society subject matter members, what causes and effects, and actions and behaviors you may know that may pertain to the intentions of why such knowledge would be undisclosed.

It is mostly speculation, and again, we simply don't know enough about such subject matter to continue where some speculative concepts has led us to.

If you have the time and you are willing, i humbly invite you to address and voice your opinion as to why those who may know the truth concerning alien visitations would not make this knowledge openly public. This thread is mostly speculation, and you input would be highly valued.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

I ask you please take the time to read over the post and chime in with any thought that may come to your mind.

Thanks in advance,
SSgt John P. , USAF




posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 12:11 PM
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We may need what is in your brain.

We need to know if some in the ruling class have been the ruling class for generations.

We need to know if some traditions and practicing ceremonies could be the abstract thoughts that may have a place in our quest to know:

Under what circumstances would we do what it is we say they(conspiritors) are doing in regards to keeping information to themselves concerning alien visitations?

Yur input is welcome, and your speculation is exhaulted.

In advance,
Thanks for your time.
SSgt John P., USAF firefighter



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 06:50 PM
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I encourage knowledgable members who frequent this forum to check out that thread and offer their insights on these subjects.


ET, it might be a good idea to give a short break-down though, because SS posters might not be up to speed on ufos and Disclosure.

[edit on 12-1-2006 by Nygdan]



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 08:03 PM
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Nygan, you are absolutely right. Why are we asking (Begging) for your input concerning UFO and possible alien visitation information from being with held from the general public? Why have we come to you for your accumulated knowledge? And why is it we value your input on this matter?



"BE NOT AFRAID"
- Every Messenger of TRUTH
Still waiting for disclosure?
"I can assure you that flying saucers, given that they exist, are not constructed by any power on earth."
— President Harry S. Truman, 1950.


I imagine these are some of the questions you may be asking.

I did this because we have reached an interesting impass and it concerns variables we (the current contributors) may be ignorant about. However in our quest to comprehend all angles of: Why would we personally do what it is we say they (The people who may have the truth about possible alien visitation) . . . are doing. There are people at the highest levels of government agencies the world over that are vague in their responses to such inquiries. There is a slew of information dating back thousands of years that tells us that our ancestors were also witnessing ufo phenomenon, not to mention extra-terrestrial contact. Although not justified in the minds of many, we are not willing to disregard the voices of millions, if not billions of people that preceded us.

So, why is your knowledge important? Because in our personal studies, and our U2U exchange, myself and a few other people seem to believe that the ruling class has been the ruling class through generations, their geneology, their bloodlines, and their relatives. One person who would definitely know is probably George Bush Senior, whom is on record denying a brand new president by the name of Jimmy Carter access to information concerning the UFO phenomenon during his first week in office. I know enough about Secret Societies to know the name George Bush Senior would probably grab your attention. He was also related to a few more famous people, to include former presidents. And his self proclaimed involvement with the “skulls”, in his own book is credence enough to invite you to chime in with whatever knowledge you may posses, and have no fear about speculation. Where facts are not concrete, speculation is what will provide the means to take us from the known, to the unknown. And, the unknown is where we will direct this thread to go, if we are to be successful in revealing previously unknown information which may indeed parallel the Secret Society ideology.

What led us to need your assistance?

First, here is the original post that introduced the thread:


Considerations of Why Full Disclosure About Aliens May Be Impossible At This Time, Sorry Folks
The purpose of this thread (From my perspective) is to consider why full disclosure may not be a viable option at this time, aside from the obvious reasons usually posted here on ATS. Please feel free to contribute why you think it is not beneficial, or possible for humanity to know about possible alien visitations to our planet. Your opinions are priceless, as always.

I'll offer a brief Summary of a few of my reasons, and then you can skim over my justification for offering these alternative reasons, aside from the normal one about humanity turning to anarchy.


1) Lack of global communication system to ensure everyone is introduced to the truth (possible truth) simultaniously. Equality for all may be a highly valued concept for those who do know about possible alien envolvement.

2) Our own language, and means of communication prevent such dialogue.

3) People are simply not conscious enough about what is going on around them, or their own fears (fear of losing something is still fear) prevent them from being capable of handling the truth. (again, speculation)

Why Full Disclosure may not even an option at this time.

It would be selfish to leave some behind. It may not be consistant with intergalactic ethics.

Communication is key. And, we can measure the belief of what a superpower such as America thinks of the importance of communication by witnessing and observing the fact it is one of the first resources they forcefully take out of the equasion when attacking their foes. They obviously put it on the top of their list every war. and negate the command centers's potential to communicate with their front line troops, usually the very first night of bombing attacks has been suffiecient to do this, utilizing their stealth, and the cover of darkness.

But, consider this: A worldwide communication system is the primary pre-requisite for global wide full disclosure, or full disclosure is not even an option. You want full disclosure? Promote worldwide communication. The overwhelming majority of humans on this planet do not have phones, computers, or TVs. So, the same thing you want most is now no where near an achievable task at this point. But, within 30 years it could be possible to ensure the 99% of Afghanis, and the 99% percent of Iraqis that do not have this communicational promoting technology will. Judge actions and behaviors and cause and effect when attempting to to judge intentions folks.

Just my thoughts on the subject. Just my opinion.

Most individuals in humanity are not aware of 99% of humanity's 7,000 years of recorded history, and usually they are aware of less than 1% of our recorded history. How could we possibly relay by word of mouth the recorded history of an alien race with hundred's of thousands of years of recorded history in any timely fashion to the multitudes of Earth when we don't even speak the same language throughout regions?

There would be so much information it would be overwhelming for the vast majority, and since we learn through the process of the "law of association", i doubt people would have the sufficent accumilation of pre-requisite pre-accepted truths to be consciously aware of the information being presented anyways. Furthermore, there would be many concepts that were so foriegn to anything known, there is no way of knowing we even have the words in our language to fully communicate many aspects of knowledge that we are attempting to relay.

In other words: it may in fact be our language that prevents effective dialogue between our species, because we simply do not have the words to convey many concepts. This adds an interesting perspective to the concept/assumption that the aliens may have been altering our dna, altering it to promote effective communication with them.

A kind reminder: This is just speculation, and considerate of the delicate concepts of others. Some of the ideas introduced to you in this thread are not necessarily backed by hard indisputable proof. Then again, the ultimate form of submissive behavior is hiding, and not being seen in the open.

So, have you ever pondered such things? If so what are your thoughts. Speculation and conjecture are more than welcome, and all presented contributions are appreciated. However, totally unsubstantiated posts about being a known hybrid that is over 600 years old and originally from a star system 412 light years away, and from the future will more than likely not be accepted without a little bit of skepticism by most members, to say the least.

Thanks in advance for your contributions.


Here are some exerpts from the dialogue:


[I]originally posted by Salsa[/I]
uniting the world under one voice should be a priority but that's won't happen with this many people on earth. Hard too say... If one alien race jumped in I'm sure others would so.. there are other issues that must be considered.



[I]Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher(me)
People can only truly compare their observances and experiences with holding them up for comparison to what it is they know, what they themselves accept as truth. So, can humanity truly get behind one person, one group, and truly trust them? People may not be able to support a single ideoplogy, or a single voice, because they know what they would do if they were to obtain such power. So, even if one was to present themselves as having everyone's best interests at heart, there is no guarantee that the mass majority of souls on Earth would even recognize it for what it (he/she/it) was, pure love of truth. How many people do you honestly think from a state of mind that is "Truth lovingfully Truthingfully". Most people are usually far different at the core, hence the world's current affairs, and 7,500 years devoid of 7 consecutive days without war, killing, and destruction.



[I]Originally psoted by Esoteric Teacher[/I]
But, why wouldn't it be disclosed? If they do exist, and have been involved in our history, of have been visiting us (all speculative), then what reasons could you think of that would justify those who might know keeping it all a secret?

I know this one is very difficult guys, because it requires us to as individuals to deny thyself, and stop thinking as humans, and have empathy enough to put ourselves in their shoes. We indeed would have to think like aliens, and not like humans. And this definatley stretches the imagination, i know.



[I]Originally posted by FEMA[/I]
Another thought about disclosure might be one of timing. For instance, as an old and intelligent society, the aliens may have conducted contact many, many times. Perhaps there are very specific and metered steps that have to be made, say, with a society such as ours, before complete and utter disclosure can take place. For instance, step one might be to appear in anceint art over the natural course of a planet's history. Step two. ….



[I]Originally posted by Defragger[/I]
Looking for Forgiveness
I was listening to Coast to Coast and Art B. had David Adair interview rebroadcast. One of the things he said that caught my attention had to do with disclosure. He said (paraphrased) that disclosure wont happen until the the majority of public at large are willing to blank check forgive their respective governments for holding the secrets that they have for as long as they have. Indications are that a lot of the secrets being kept that are revolutionary in nature and have immense world changing ramifications associated with them. Another problem is that the secrets have been kept for too long and those persons/agencies/governments holding the secrets are in the secret keeping business and are so far over their heads that they cant see how on earth they could release data/technologies/events and still survive politically or keep their careers going. They are basically afraid of chaos or revolution once most people realize just how deep and subversive these secrets are and how long they've been kept. Think about it. If we could have been using AG drives for space exploration instead of solid and liquid rockets or years ago could have eliminated our dependance on fossil fuels and rid ourselves of suckling on a national power grid people would get pretty pissed once the reality and weight of the secrets settled into peoples minds. Governments would be even less trusted than they are now and may even be torn down because of this. Are most of us ready to hand out blanket forgiveness to our leaders for potentially duping the common man for they last 50-60 years? For potentially intentionally holding human advancement back simply to keep a secret?



[I]Originally Posted by FEMA[/I]
Consider though, that once disclosure was understood in its totality, who'd have time for a political witch hunt? John suggested that there might be far more relieved faces in Washington than red ones. It's a thought we can't forget.

Consider, for instance, if we were on the utter brink of nulear war and it suddenly became irrefutably known that "They Are Here," I think that war would be put on the back burner because there is something far more important to be considered. And, if they were here, would you want to be the country to send the first volly of bombs to see what might lay in store for such an action?



[I]Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher[/I]
Defragger,

That is the reason at the top of my list, but i wasn't going to open this one up, until someone else had already done so.

The implications of the will of the people makes us responsible for why full disclosure isn't.

This reason is the most profound. It makes us responsible. It makes us the conspirators, and the message from the messengers from thousands of years throughout our history are then confirmed. Religion plays a role.

And, an interesting twist:

Do the aliens also require our forgiveness?

edited to add:
Are we the conspiritors? Are we the ones responsible for FULL disclosure being withheld from us?

this was the real reason i put the sad face emblem next to the thread title in the forum.

i knew you guys wouldn't let me, you, and us down. Now, we are beginning to want the truth bad enough. Now this thread takes on a new face.


And, here is where we start to see why we need the knowledge and minds of those who subscribe to the study of Secret Societies


[I]Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher[/I]
This may be a little outside the boundries of this forum, but i wonder if we'd be permitted to take it there, if it is where our inquiries led us . .. . .???

What if it has been being kept for generations. What if we could trace the geneology of current world rulers back, to some of the same bloodlines ruling hundreds, if not thousands of years ago?

Would this effect our theories about conspiracies? If there were truth in it, but then again, who is responsible for creating history on national, and global scales?



[I]Originally posted by FEMA[I]
Whether the thread goes to answer the question of the lie or not remains to be seen. But your question above has spawned some profoundly alarming questions.

If your postulation were true, then one would be utterly compelled to ask: "To what end was this done? Would history have played out any different, and how many lives might have been saved, or lost, by knowing?"

Your question opens a ocean tanker full of questions.


The dialogue needs your assistance.

Please read through the thread, and feel free to speculate away.

You have an interesting perception, backed with the knowledge of Secret Societies, their members, their ideals, their rituals, their traditions, and their involvement in world affairs. Surely you could bring something to the table, whether you believe in alien visitation or not, you have an opinion that incorporates experiences that the current contributors may not. We need your help, please. If there are world domination organizations, that run things from the shadows, they would most certainly know some truth concerning our celestrial neighbors, if in fact there is knowledge from celestrial neighbors to be had.


Remember we are making an attempt to understand intentions by measuring cause and effect and actions and behaviors. This minimizes the need for speculation, however speculation and conjecture are not scorned, nor ridiculed. Only scorning and ridicule are.

How much do i know about possible alien visitation? If it has not happened, I'll gladly forfeit my existance. That's how much i'm convinced it is the truth. This is my opinion, based upon the 19 years I've been studying the subject matter. I was not always so adament.


Cug

posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 09:03 PM
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Esoteric Teacher,


I really don't have much to add to that thread. I'm assuming when your talking about secret societies your speaking of the Masons, Skull and Bones, and maybe the Bohemian grove, not the more occult groups that I have experience with. In that case I just do not see what they would get out of hiding any UFO info.

I really don't see how I can fit this comment to the other thread so I'll post it here.


If anyone is behind something like that I'd look to those who would have the most to "lose" from that information being outed. The only group that I can think of would have any reason to hide anything would be one or all of the "Big three" religions (Judaism, Christianity, and Islam). Most of the world superpowers are run by members of the above faiths. (And in the communist countries, communism it's self could be the "religion" they are protecting.)



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 11:51 PM
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Originally posted by Cug


If anyone is behind something like that I'd look to those who would have the most to "lose" from that information being outed. The only group that I can think of would have any reason to hide anything would be one or all of the "Big three" religions (Judaism, Christianity, and Islam). Most of the world superpowers are run by members of the above faiths. (And in the communist countries, communism it's self could be the "religion" they are protecting.)



Thanks Cug. But, what is it they stand to loose? Your perspective may indeed be helpful.

We are just asking you to ponder, with your accumilated knowledge, what in your view would justify keeping alien visitation secret from the general public?

What variables from the Secret Society realm would (in your mind) justify their actions?

I'm asking for you guys to have impathy for some people who would know and think what variables in the equasion we may be ignorant of. Considering all you know about ruling secret societies, to include the "Bitburg (sp?) Group" that meet at least once a year. I know their agenda has also been becoming the agenda of many nations the world over. Why, and to what means?


Cug

posted on Jan, 13 2006 @ 12:34 AM
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Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher

Thanks Cug. But, what is it they stand to loose? Your perspective may indeed be helpful.


Because the Bible (or the Old Testament as it shared between the 3) did not say on the 8th day God created the Greys. The bible did not say that god created a race that was "better" or more advanced than us (and if they are here they are more advanced). I'd think that people would start wondering what else is the bible wrong about? when that happens the big 3 lose their power.



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