View footage of 2nd JFK shooter here

I am no physicists, or ballistics expert at all. I am abit of a fan of the JFK assination though. I have a copy of the zapruda tape on my comp, and when i watched it for the first time i was surprised with the bullets destruction of jfk's head.
Anywho, from what i could tell the bullet came from the front right of kennedy, his heads moves back left yes. But also you can see the entry wound on his right skull. I find the most questioning shot at kennedy was the first one that hit his neck, it didnt wound him that bad, he seemed confused as what had happend. If it was a high power sniper rifle, i would assume it would of taken a chuck out of his neck and he would of been near dead. So what sort of gun could hit a man in the neck, but yet not cause much harm?
If anyone has a different tape which shows the first shot more clearly, please post, because as many of you may know a sign blocks out the first shot in the zapruda tape.

Confused? He's grabbing his next with both hands...

Have you seen the shot on the front of his neck? It's a good chunk missing. I don't think I'm allowed to post such pictures, and I just had dinner, but just look at the autospy photos. What bothers me most is his facial expression, he looks like he's smiling.

Yeah he is grabbing his neck looking around, seemed confused to me. WHile jackie didnt seem to worried by it. Like it was a small cut on his neck.
She leans over, looking at him. Then the fatal shot comes.

I havent seen the autospy photos, i will search for them on google thanks anyway.

If he's got a big chunk out of the FRONT of his neck, then the bullet came from BEHIND him. I saw a test done recently that proved the "magic bullet" theory of the shot that hit him, passed through him, and into the governor. It followed the exact same path in the test as it did in the report, with the exception that it didn't fully penetrate the dummy leg at the end. I can't remember the reason they gave for that, but it was a perfect replica of the real shot. And they shot it from behind and above.

I just watched the stabilized film, and those were DEFINATELY from behind him. I've seen autopsy pics of bullet wounds. The entry wound is usually the size of a dime or quarter, even from a high powered rifle, and the exit blows a chunk out, as was stated previously. When a bullet enters a body, the tip flattens, causing a much bigger shockwave effect. This is what causes such huge exit wounds.

Oh right! When they did the test, the bullet skipped off two ribs in the "governors" body, where in the actual shot it skipped off one. The second rib took enough energy off the bullet in the test, that it didn't fully penetrate the leg at the end.

[edit on 1/12/2006 by Zaphod58]

I'm not talking about whether or not the neck shot was from behind, we're talking about the head. If there are multiple shooters, one was in the depository building. I just don't believe that was Oswald, and that that guy shot the final shot.

So let's say the final shot DID come from behind. It would be somewhat plausible that the back of the skull would have such a big hole because of the implosion, but why would the exit hole be so small? And why was his WHOLE BRAIN missing in the autospy?

Entry wounds are ALWAYS small. The bullet is still sharp until it enters the body, at which point it blunts and becomes a big flat mass moving through the body. It doesn't matter what kind of gun you use, the entry wound will be small. Period. That's simple bullet mechanics.

I thought this was a nifty pic i found on the net.
Picture of Zapruder describing the head wound.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
Entry wounds are ALWAYS small. The bullet is still sharp until it enters the body, at which point it blunts and becomes a big flat mass moving through the body. It doesn't matter what kind of gun you use, the entry wound will be small. Period. That's simple bullet mechanics.

And you miught notice that the "small entry wound" is on the forehead, and the big chunk of skull missing on the back of his head. Meaning he was shot NOT FROM BEHIND, End of story?

Actually, in all the pictures where you were able to tell anything, the TOP of his head was blown open. However, IF he was shot from the front, maybe you can explain how his grey matter defied the laws of physics, and blew forward, AGAINST the travel of the bullet.

I would gladly upload and circle the hole in the back of his head, but I don't think that's allowed on ATS.

I looked at the autopsy photos not 20 minutes ago. It was the top of his head. They had a shot looking down his body showing the top of his head, and there was a giant hole right at the top of it. There was a flap of skull hanging back, and a giant hole at the top.

Originally posted by Valhall
James E,

Do you know of any place that has a downloadable copy of the Nix film? Or is the Sixth Street Museum keepking it all locked up from the public (unless you go there to view it, that is).

Sorry Val I ddint read this post until now

most of the films and photos are in the link here and Jimstradamus has got the rest of what's not on site.

www.rejectz.com...

Its best to study different formats of the films and different sources because there are differences, especially quality wise.

I looked at the autopsy photos not 20 minutes ago. It was the top of his head.

The autopsy phtos are a mystery in themselves. many different sources claim different things about the photos,

there were two sets
there was a composite of jfk's skull
the hair length on some shots doesnt match
dr's mysterious deaths who were there
they were faked
they were real
a substitute jfk was on the table

and more. It really is a study in itself to examine all the theories about the autospy photos

www.jfklancer.com...
autopsy photos - graphic

* Floyd Riebe, one of the two autopsy photographers, stated in a filmed interview for KRON-TV in 1988 that the autopsy x-rays and photos had been doctored in some way, and that the photos did not show the wounds that he saw on the night of the autopsy. Riebe said he recalled seeing "a big gaping hole in the back of the head." The other photographer, James Stringer, stated in a taped interview that he did NOT take the photos of the back of the head, which show that area intact, contrary to the testimony of literally dozens of credible witnesses. Who, then, took the back-of-the-head pictures?

www.jfklancer.com...
autopsy ohotos --graphic
ourworld.cs.com...
problems with autopsy photos
History Matter
how five investigators got it wrong
Autopsy
problems with the autopsy photos
www.thesmokinggun.com...
smoking gun
www.anomalous-images.com...
autopsy photos incomplete
www.chron.com...
pathologist dies. see also mysterious death list
www.prisonplanet.com...
autopsy conspiracy
www.chron.com...
doctors cloud autopsy


[edit on 12-1-2006 by Mayet]

If I may offer my own opinions on the 2nd shooter theory, although I have not seen the footage linked in this thread, as I said I would like to offer my own theory. What if.. and think about this for a second before you decide to say "No" and debunk it, what if JFK's driver was the second shooter? think about this.. BANG, Lee Harvey Oswald shoots.. panic ensues, people scatter, the SS agents do their thing, the focus is off the driver, he turns and fires.. try that one on for size and let me know what you think... thanks for indulging me

Originally posted by Zaphod58
I looked at the autopsy photos not 20 minutes ago. It was the top of his head. They had a shot looking down his body showing the top of his head, and there was a giant hole right at the top of it. There was a flap of skull hanging back, and a giant hole at the top.

Wait, his right or our right? I'll upload a couple pictures showing the hole in the BACK of his head. I'll post links soon.

Nobody's right. I wasn't talking about the right of anything. Right=directly. As in DIRECTLY AT THE TOP OF HIS HEAD.

Originally posted by Ox
BANG, Lee Harvey Oswald shoots.. panic ensues, people scatter, the SS agents do their thing, the focus is off the driver, he turns and fires.. try that one on for size and let me know what you think... thanks for indulging me

The theory that Greer shot the president has been a popular conspiracy over the years. The Zapruder film shows that it certainly is possible. But more and more I personally believe the Zapruder film has been touched up and faked with missing frames. A few witnesses actually said that the shooting came from right in the limo. Greer is seen in the Zapruder film, turn possibly fire a gun and then pass it to Kellerman in the front seat to dispose of.

Greer was a protestant (methodist) and he disliked the philandering catholic president, that was deep seated, Greer's son has admitted that many years after the event. Greer is now dead.

But I do believe this is part of the conspiracy. We have witness groups and photo evidence in groups, suberbly fitting in with various conspiracies.

We have the driver theory and a group of witnesses to back that up. We have the grassy knoll and a group of witnesses to say that the shot came from there. We have the Texas School Book Depository an a goup of witnesses to say it came from the sixh floor sniper's window and we have a group to say it came from the other end of the TSBD. We have a group that says it came from the Dal Tex building, a group to say it came from a sewer, a group to say it came from the overpass bridge. Each one is possible, each is a red herring designed to tie these sort of discussions up for years in various arguments and theories.

For every theory you can throw, I can find back up against it, For every theory I throw, you can find back up evidence against it. Thats the way its all been desgned, to keep people at each others throat and away from the real truth. People will just argue the theory they believe in through and through over and over. Which is great but it gets no closer to the truth. Who ever masterplanned this conspiracy was a genius, as its has been designed to have people chasing their tails and going around in circles for years.

Start looking for stuff that hasn't been said before, Identify the witnesses on Dealey Place that havent been identified and find out their truth and you might be getting somewhere. That starts with two ladies between Dark Complected Man and Gayle Newman and Green Man and his companion on the other side of road. All there up front and personal close to the scene, all four never identified. There are a couple of others that havent been dissected either.

www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk...
William Greer Bio
community-2.webtv.net...
Did the driver do it

Personally I think Greer (the driver) is a red herring.

Oh and was Zapruder even there that day. The Martin Film says not, while Muchmore and Nix and a couple of others show Zapruder up on his pedestal, the Martin film shows an empty pedestal. I'm just throwing that in to show you there are a large amoun of inconsistencies about the day. I am not saying he wasn't there but I am saying there are rumours he was rumours he wasn't.

[edit on 12-1-2006 by Mayet]

Originally posted by Zaphod58
If he's got a big chunk out of the FRONT of his neck, then the bullet came from BEHIND him. I saw a test done recently that proved the "magic bullet" theory of the shot that hit him, passed through him, and into the governor. It followed the exact same path in the test as it did in the report, with the exception that it didn't fully penetrate the dummy leg at the end. I can't remember the reason they gave for that, but it was a perfect replica of the real shot. And they shot it from behind and above.

Hello Zaphod58, I normally agree with what you say, but in this they are wrong in that it followed the same trajectory...

I saw the same docu and the bullet exited the dummy's chest and not the throat, JFK didn't have a chest wound...

Oh and while we are discussing the throat wound...

That gaping hole was the result of an incision for a tracheostomy...

Dr. Perry noted the massive wound of the head and a second much
smaller wound of the low anterior neck in approximately the midline.
A tracheostomy was performed by extending the latter wound.

www.jfklancer.com...

[edit on 12-1-2006 by Jedi_Master]

Chest, neck, similar smell. The point was that the "magic bullet" really could cause all the injuries that they said it did.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
Chest, neck, similar smell. The point was that the "magic bullet" really could cause all the injuries that they said it did.

Well...yes that is so in a way, if you look at the autopsy pics...

Warning the following pics are graphic, if you click on them you absolve me of any connection to these pics, and that I'm not annoying you

jfklancer.com...

Notice that the so called exit wound is lower than the so called entrance throat wound...

jfklancer.com...

So how can a shot from above, cause a wound lower in the body, and exit higher in the body ?

And in the Zapruder film in no point does JFK lean over to make this shot possible...

When I looked at all the autopsy photos the other night, the back wound was in the upper back, near the shoulder region.