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Considerations of Why Full Disclosure About Aliens May Be Impossible At This Time, Sorry Folks

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posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 01:09 AM
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The purpose of this thread (From my perspective) is to consider why full disclosure may not be a viable option at this time, aside from the obvious reasons usually posted here on ATS. Please feel free to contribute why you think it is not beneficial, or possible for humanity to know about possible alien visitations to our planet. Your opinions are priceless, as always.

I'll offer a brief Summary of a few of my reasons, and then you can skim over my justification for offering these alternative reasons, aside from the normal one about humanity turning to anarchy.


1) Lack of global communication system to ensure everyone is introduced to the truth (possible truth) simultaniously. Equality for all may be a highly valued concept for those who do know about possible alien envolvement.

2) Our own language, and means of communication prevent such dialogue.

3) People are simply not conscious enough about what is going on around them, or their own fears (fear of losing something is still fear) prevent them from being capable of handling the truth. (again, speculation)


Why Full Disclosure may not even an option at this time.

It would be selfish to leave some behind. It may not be consistant with intergalactic ethics.

Communication is key. And, we can measure the belief of what a superpower such as America thinks of the importance of communication by witnessing and observing the fact it is one of the first resources they forcefully take out of the equasion when attacking their foes. They obviously put it on the top of their list every war. and negate the command centers's potential to communicate with their front line troops, usually the very first night of bombing attacks has been suffiecient to do this, utilizing their stealth, and the cover of darkness.

But, consider this: A worldwide communication system is the primary pre-requisite for global wide full disclosure, or full disclosure is not even an option. You want full disclosure? Promote worldwide communication. The overwhelming majority of humans on this planet do not have phones, computers, or TVs. So, the same thing you want most is now no where near an achievable task at this point. But, within 30 years it could be possible to ensure the 99% of Afghanis, and the 99% percent of Iraqis that do not have this communicational promoting technology will. Judge actions and behaviors and cause and effect when attempting to to judge intentions folks.

Just my thoughts on the subject. Just my opinion.

Most individuals in humanity are not aware of 99% of humanity's 7,000 years of recorded history, and usually they are aware of less than 1% of our recorded history. How could we possibly relay by word of mouth the recorded history of an alien race with hundred's of thousands of years of recorded history in any timely fashion to the multitudes of Earth when we don't even speak the same language throughout regions?

There would be so much information it would be overwhelming for the vast majority, and since we learn through the process of the "law of association", i doubt people would have the sufficent accumilation of pre-requisite pre-accepted truths to be consciously aware of the information being presented anyways. Furthermore, there would be many concepts that were so foriegn to anything known, there is no way of knowing we even have the words in our language to fully communicate many aspects of knowledge that we are attempting to relay.

In other words: it may in fact be our language that prevents effective dialogue between our species, because we simply do not have the words to convey many concepts. This adds an interesting perspective to the concept/assumption that the aliens may have been altering our dna, altering it to promote effective communication with them.

A kind reminder: This is just speculation, and considerate of the delicate concepts of others. Some of the ideas introduced to you in this thread are not necessarily backed by hard indisputable proof. Then again, the ultimate form of submissive behavior is hiding, and not being seen in the open.

So, have you ever pondered such things? If so what are your thoughts. Speculation and conjecture are more than welcome, and all presented contributions are appreciated. However, totally unsubstantiated posts about being a known hybrid that is over 600 years old and originally from a star system 412 light years away, and from the future will more than likely not be accepted without a little bit of skepticism by most members, to say the least.

Thanks in advance for your contributions.


edit for typos

[edit on 8-1-2006 by Esoteric Teacher]




posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 01:23 AM
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If aliens are real and here, and have telepathic powers as some speculate, then I think they could communicate with every man, woman, and child on the planet through conveyed thougts, images, and emotions. Conveying emotions and images telepathically would overcome any language or communications technology barrier. But of course, this is pure speculation.



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 01:30 AM
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Originally posted by BRCMontana
.. . .. .. . But of course, this is pure speculation.


Pure speculation where adament proof and indisputable facts are not present are more than welcome always in my threads. Don't worry about loosing cool points with me. Speciulation is a tool we have, therefore I feel we are justified in using it.

It may not lead to absolutes, but sometimes speculation does lead to asking the right questions.

I thank you for sharing your thoughts.

Edited to add: And you may very well be right.

I know this thread is uncomfortable for some avid believers, but it is essential we address such issues, or we are in fact ignoring half the equasion. How can you truly debunk anything when your not willing to consider opposing viewpoints that may not fall neatly into your outlook on the subject matter at hand. Speculation and consideration of all sides of the arguement/dialogue are a pre-requisite to denying ignorance.

Speculation and conjecture is always welcome.

[edit on 8-1-2006 by Esoteric Teacher]



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 01:42 AM
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Originally posted by BRCMontana
If aliens are real and here, and have telepathic powers as some speculate, then I think they could communicate with every man, woman, and child on the planet through conveyed thougts, images, and emotions.


You know, after further consideration of this idea, you very well may be on to something. However, it is important to note, that maybe a lot of people are not willing to accept that they have senses available to them that lie outside the norm. Most people are not consciously aware of what thought processes are transpiring in their subconscious minds.

This is the primary reason I believe this form of communication may not be possible. But, this does in no means negate the possibility, nor the plausibility of such ideas. Thanks again BRCMontana, for making me think. Thinking is goog, in moderation.

edited to add:
Another possibilty is that this telepathy thing is already happening, however people are not consciously aware that their subconscious mind is in fact "hearing" such communications. If you can not accept it consciously, perhaps your subconscious mind does not permit that information to surface to the top?



[edit on 8-1-2006 by Esoteric Teacher]



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 02:11 AM
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Interesting proposition/post Esoteric Teacher.

Consider . . .

If full and complete disclosure were made, what would turn on this in the absence of any kind of knowledge, technical, anthropological download or exchange? This is rhetorical question, read on.

Consider religion, medicine, and technology. Millions would know about the alien existence. Would there be questions? You bet. Which ones would be answered, if any at all?

Let's look at religion. Which religion is right? Is there such a thing as religion? What would definative answers to the question of religion do? Bring everyone immediately and happily together? Doubtful.

Consider technology. Would there be a download of technology? If so, what? Who would get it? Everyone? With man's historical penchant for using new technology for weapons, would the download of technology they'd allow us to have be worth anything at all? Would the aliens, understanding our ability to make horrific weapons, give us even the smallest amount of technology? Doubtful.

Consider medicine. Say the aliens gave us a pill that cured everything from bad breath to aging. What of the pharmaceutical companies? Gone with the wind, and along with them investments, jobs, and the associated supporting industries. Immediately a house of financial cards starts to implode. Don't get me wrong, I don't care a bit for the money-grubbing PRKs! But they are an integral part of the financial fabric of this world. Let's though, carry the point further, now we have a population that does not age and does not get sick. How do we feed it as it grows? What of the associated increase in polution?

Here we go full circle. We'll need new technology to feed us. How do we clean the air? Well, we'll need new technology to do so. Remember man's undying penchant for weapons? In the face of not knowing what technology might be needed to cure these problems we can't assume we'd get any technology. Now we really are in a pickle.

What of government? Who governs? Who picks it? Would the precepts of a sovereign society allowed self determination be a reality? One could ask, "Would it matter?" Indeed, would it? One could ask if we have that now, but I would consider that to be a politically cynical snipe and not germane to your question.

How about considering man's undying reluctance to embrace truth? If indeed the aliens presented truth, how could we measure it? Would we accept it?

Much as I'd like to see disclosure happen, in the face of the issues just listed I'm not sure it would help anything because of who and what we are.

Edited for a typo, it's a curse.

[edit on 8-1-2006 by FEMA]



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 02:13 AM
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And still yet another possibility, if they are in fact engaging in or planned to engage in telepathic communication by the conveyance of imagery or emotions, it's entirely possible that their imagery and emotions might be just as alien to us as they are.



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 02:23 AM
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FEMA, you in essence pointed out a way for aliens to destroy or conquer our race if they so intended to. Their "gifts" of new technology could essentially unravel our civilization. They could literally kill us with "kindness" if that were their desire. They could plunge our nations hopelessly into war by "answering" questions about religion, even if they needed to fabricate the "answers".

Maybe this is the reason for their clandestine actions. Perhaps they are planning very carefully, every facet imaginable for first contact. Maybe they have made first contact with many races and in turn, have learned many lessons. Maybe they learned some at a very high cost to all parties involved.

This is also a sad commentary on the state of our world as a whole, after all we shouldn't NEED anyone to solve our problems for us now should we?

[edit on 8-1-2006 by BRCMontana]



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 03:24 AM
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Sadly, you make compelling points BRCMontana.

I don't like being cynical, ever, though it seems to be far easier to be cynical than positive these days.

I suspect if there are aliens they are profoundly intelligent. If so, I doubt they'd kill us with kindness. Please don't think I'm dismissing your point, I'm not. Perhaps I should have typed: "If so, I hope they wouldn't kill us with kindness."

A gentleman who contends he was part of UFO recoveries for the DoD once confided that he'd asked a DoD scientist at one such recovery about level of intelligence the aliens possessed. The scientist said that not all aliens were equal in intelligence. He told the man to consider the sum of all intelligence to be aligned along the length of a yardstick. He went on to say that alien intelligence starts at about the 7-inch mark and can travel out to around the 23-inch mark. He then said humans occupy the first 3-one-hundred-thousands of the first inch.

If the story is bunk, so be it. If it is true, well, it's cause to be really, really humble if not outright scared.

Again, if it's true, what is it that makes us think we can, even remotely, handle what they have to share?

Edited for syntax, it's a curse.

[edit on 8-1-2006 by FEMA]



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 04:36 AM
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Well regarding the comments about communications systems, i have to disagree here. We have a fleet of satellites orbiting the Earth, we have numerous 24 hr news channels ie Sky News, BBC News 24 here in the UK, i am sure the USA and other countries have the eqvivalent, Surely any aspiring ET would simply take over the satellites and broadcast their greeting whether it be peaceful or with hostile intent. Many of us would then know, and for those who live in areas without comunications i am sure they would get to find out within a day or so. The other alternative would be simply to show up in every capital city of the world like in the mini seiries V or Independence Day. There would be no disputing the existance of Ailens then !!



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 01:33 PM
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Originally posted by FEMA
Interesting proposition/post Esoteric Teacher.

Consider . . .

Consider religion, medicine, and technology. Millions would know about the alien existence. Would there be questions? You bet. Which ones would be answered, if any at all?


Until you asked the question, I had not considered the following statement:
It is possible that there will be as many questions as there are people who have priorities. In other words: Each individual will want to know 2 overwhelming factors, having listened to their devil (how will this benifit me, and the things i value?) on the one shoulder, and the angel (fear of consiquences;how will this be detremental to the things i value?) on the other. Outstanding Fema! I had not thought to look at it this way until your contribution.


Let's look at religion. Which religion is right? Is there such a thing as religion? What would definative answers to the question of religion do? Bring everyone immediately and happily together? Doubtful.


Again, and this is merely my opinion based upon my observances through my experiences, I believe there is an ultimate observer, and if there is a true one god, it would most certainly be known to them. The fact we may not know of their (aliens) presence provides me some personal gratification. I think hiding from open view is the ultimate submisive stance, and a submisive posture is indeed one deep seeded in a sense of reverance. They possibly respect us so great, they most certainly would follow how they percieve GOD's intentions to be. So, is it in fact their actions that demonstrate their willingness to respect the collective will of humanity? (rhetorical question).


Consider technology. Would there be a download of technology? If so, what? Who would get it? Everyone? . ...


Some good points to consider in that entire paragraph, Fema. I think in many regards we may indeed be seeing the fruits of such technology. Given it took us 7,300+ years to get from horse-drawn carriages to the Ford Model-T, and 67 years to get from the mass production of automobiles to the surface of the moon. Technology begets technology, but agian I pose the rhetorical question: But, at this rate? The only percievable way this makes sense to me is because we really have no other history from which to compare ours too. There is simply no point of refference, so we have to blindly accept the improbable as plausible and certifiably true.



What of government? Who governs? Who picks it? Would the precepts of a sovereign society allowed self determination be a reality?


I've pondered this, and the only justification i could come up with for their (aliens) influencing our world governements is the fact we more than likely will be exploring other solar systems within the next 500 years. And, since it is a shared reality, their invested interest in us is justifiable, and i believe we would do the same if we had reached their elevated level of understanding.


How about considering man's undying reluctance to embrace truth? If indeed the aliens presented truth, how could we measure it? Would we accept it?


Preach it brother! Most people are not even consciously aware of what it is that motivates and justifies their own intentions. Sorry to say this, but i see a lot of it, even in my own actions and behaviors, sorry to say, but it is the truth.


Much as I'd like to see disclosure happen, in the face of the issues just listed I'm not sure it would help anything because of who and what we are.


Amen.



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 01:42 PM
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Originally posted by BRCMontana
FEMA, you in essence pointed out a way for aliens to destroy or conquer our race if they so intended to. Their "gifts" of new technology could essentially unravel our civilization.


I also liked the killing with kindness issue you address BRCMontana. Reading this reminded me of a quote from I believe was Martin Luther King: "We have guided missiles, and misguided men." Good point BRC!


Maybe they learned some at a very high cost to all parties involved.


A valid perspective worthy of consideration.


This is also a sad commentary on the state of our world as a whole, after all we shouldn't NEED anyone to solve our problems for us now should we?


"I get by with a little help from my friends, from my friends .. . . "

I read that part, and now I got that song stuck in my head, damn it!

I'm going to go listen to a little "White Stripes", a band, well really only 2 people. Their new album is entitled "Get Behind Me Satan". Nothing to do with the topic at hand, but I like them, alot.
edited to add: I'm doing this to get that other song out of my head.



[edit on 8-1-2006 by Esoteric Teacher]



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 01:47 PM
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full disclosure of alien life ect is necaserry in the war on terror because the terrorist have then no real purpose no more because there believe will be shatered. and they will have to addept not because of the usa or western nations but by the facts aliens ect and that they have visited us
in the ancient time of the bible/ koran



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 01:55 PM
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Originally posted by Wirral Bagpuss
Well regarding the comments about communications systems, i have to disagree here. We have a fleet of satellites orbiting the Earth, we have numerous 24 hr news channels ie Sky News, BBC News 24 here in the UK, i am sure the USA and other countries have the eqvivalent, Surely any aspiring ET would simply take over the satellites and broadcast their greeting whether it be peaceful or with hostile intent. Many of us would then know, and for those who live in areas without comunications i am sure they would get to find out within a day or so.


I respect your opinion, and it is considerably a plausible one. However, there are entire cultures who do not have 3rd grade educations. Entire countries where the illiteracy rate is phenomenal, and entire social structures around the globe who have no idea what Earth looks like from space. Overwhelming populations in places like South America, Asia, and Africa, where as far as some of them are concerned man has yet to go to the moon. Hell, even in America, suposedly the world power, there are people who do not accept as fact we even went to the moon. My point is your objectivity is considerably plausible, but the building blocks to be able to accept such introduced knowledge may not be present in many cultures throughout the world. I'm certainly not saying you are wrong for presenting such a perspective, it is plausible, I'm just saying it is also plausible that people would not even know what aliens were, nor be able to comprehend what it is they represent. Again, this is merely my opinion, and certainly not written in stone.



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 01:56 PM
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Originally posted by MarkLuitzen
full disclosure of alien life ect is necaserry in the war on terror because the terrorist have then no real purpose no more because there believe will be shatered. and they will have to addept not because of the usa or western nations but by the facts aliens ect and that they have visited us
in the ancient time of the bible/ koran


Great point!

I herd that the W.O.T is suppose to last for many years ahead...so hopefully the aliens will intervene and put a stop to all of this chaos..before we wipe ourselevs off the planet

allah was prolly a alien too?



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 02:00 PM
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I'm curious why you think we would 'HAVE' to be able to grasp their history? And what's the big problem......... we understand the history of the Earth which is around 4.5 billion years............... surely we can grasp while not memorize their history?

Personally, if there are alien races I don't see why they would bother to communicate with us? What's in it for them? Besides they probably use the 'Star Trek' creed.............. after all where did you think it came from.....



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 02:14 PM
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Originally posted by Scout1959
I'm curious why you think we would 'HAVE' to be able to grasp their history?


People fear change. People fear the unknown. If it is unknown, it triggers the prime directive of every cell in your body: "Self Preserve", aka = Self Before ALL, self before i serve anything, or anyone. This is simply how i look at it, not neccesarily the absolute truth of it.


Personally, if there are alien races I don't see why they would bother to communicate with us? What's in it for them? Besides they probably use the 'Star Trek' creed.............. after all where did you think it came from.....


I don't think they took to the stars looking for gold or other precious things that are not alive. I think they would take to the stars for the same reason we do. "Are we alone". The greatest resource out there will be consciousness itself. The greatest resource is life, and intellegent life, in my opinion.

Edited to add: Your contribution was important to me, or i would not have bothered responding to it. Your outlook is a valued one, and i for one thank you for sharing it. I hope you did not find my responses belittling, because they most certainly were not intented that way. Thanks for sharing, and you may very well be right.

[edit on 8-1-2006 by Esoteric Teacher]



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 02:19 PM
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4) Aliens do not exist, therefore the full disclosure you seek will never happen. Hope disclosure does come about so you can have fun hearing how US government enjoys its own citizens thinking its spy planes are alien UFOs instead.


We do have a global communication system: ATS. You guys do speak another language: ignorance.



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 02:48 PM
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Originally posted by Frosty
4) Aliens do not exist, therefore the full disclosure you seek will never happen. Hope disclosure does come about so you can have fun hearing how US government enjoys its own citizens thinking its spy planes are alien UFOs instead.


We do have a global communication system: ATS. You guys do speak another language: ignorance.



After years of skepticism on my part, and decades of study, and 8 years in the USAF with extensive, but admittingly not all knowledge of all known aircraft, my perspective somewhat differs from yours. Also, it is ignorance to look up at the night sky at literally trillions upon trillions upon trillions of other solar systems and convince yourself that it's that big of a vacancy. But, then again maybe your definition of ignorance and my definition of ignorance is different, but you are certainly entitled to your opinion. But to state as fact that life exists no where else, without proof, well ... . .
It would be truly ignorant of me to take that utterly blind leap of faith based upon no credible evidence. What i state i state as speculation, what you have offered is stated as fact, devoid of any supporting evidence. So, do you think I am more ignorant of the facts? Here is where I get some of my information, that does effect my opinion on this subject matter:

My brother's chain of command is as follows:
1) The commadant of the Marine Core.
2) A colonol
3) Deputy Secretary of Defense
4) Secretary of Defense, Donald Rumsfeld


Originally posted by Frosty
4) Aliens do not exist, therefore the full disclosure you seek will never happen. Hope disclosure does come about so you can have fun hearing how US government enjoys its own citizens thinking its spy planes are alien UFOs instead.


We do have a global communication system: ATS. You guys do speak another language: ignorance.


Ignorance is not knowing. So if you tell us we speak the language of ignorance, then perhaps it is only interpretted by a mind that does not know, and that reciever of said message is the variable of ignorance, not the senders of said message, nor the message itself.

Kind regards,
John

Edited to add: Frosty's perception, and this brand of thinking may be yet another great example of why FULL DISCLOSURE is simply not an option at this time. People are simply not ready, this is of course following the assumption that aliens do exist. However, I would like to say that even if a respected world leader were to say they existed, people similar to Frosty's outlook would certainly not accept their words, or their voiced intentions. I refer you to my signature, and the quote from President Truman, circa 1950, 56 years ago.

So, ask yourselves while considering Frosty's tone:

Does Frosty posses the same input and experiences that say President Truman, or parallel, leaders throughout the world when making such statements in support of or debunking the evidence? May I also remind you that President Jimmy Carter was also denied the answers to inquiries about the UFO phenomenon (when he took over as president) by then CIA top man George Bush senior.

[edit on 8-1-2006 by Esoteric Teacher]



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 03:43 PM
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I wrote earlier: Let's look at religion. Which religion is right? Is there such a thing as religion? What would definative answers to the question of religion do? Bring everyone immediately and happily together? Doubtful.



Again, and this is merely my opinion based upon my observances through my experiences, I believe there is an ultimate observer, and if there is a true one god, it would most certainly be known to them.


Interesting perspective John. I'll get back to it in a second. When I asked the question: "Is there such a thing as religion?" I asked it in the sense that aliens *might* torpedo such a notion. The question was meant to be a rhetorical *answer* and thus throw yet another variable into the mix of *answers* that might spring from questions asked of the aliens. Please forgive the use of the asterisk, I'm only using it to point out the variable, nothing else.

Back to your position on a true god. Through many conversations with the DoD gent who contended he was part of a recovery team, I asked about the question of God. The uncanny thing is that your position and what he contends is the truth are the same. Strange this. It either means both of you are flakes (hardly) or there is a strong thread of truth to your collective experiences. He said: "They say there is indeed a god, an all omnipotent being, and that they and all things are subject to it. They went on to tell him that, and this is a quote taken from my notes: "Despite our science and technology we cannot pull back the veil of that which you call Heaven."

All I can say about this gentleman is that he is telling me what he believes to be the truth based on his experiences. Bunk or truth? I can't say. I can say that after conducting more than 1000 hours of investigative interviews with him, I've not been able to trip him up on anything he has ever told me. BTW, if you ever want his number and wish to talk with him, I'll provide an introduction and the number, he'll be ready to take your call. Ask him anything, he's quite open but pulls up short on matters of national security. He'll provide copys of his service records, anything that will help you determine he is who he says he is.


The fact we may not know of their (aliens) presence provides me some personal gratification. I think hiding from open view is the ultimate submisive stance, and a submisive posture is indeed one deep seeded in a sense of reverance.


Interesting again John, because it dovetails with what they say about a god. You sure you ain't one of 'em?



They possibly respect us so great, they most certainly would follow how they percieve GOD's intentions to be. So, is it in fact their actions that demonstrate their willingness to respect the collective will of humanity? (rhetorical question).


Hope you got an answer for the above question from some of the stuff I presented.

Hellofa an intersting thread partner.



posted on Jan, 8 2006 @ 03:47 PM
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Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher

Originally posted by Frosty

Edited to add: Frosty's perception, and this brand of thinking may be yet another great example of why FULL DISCLOSURE is simply not an option at this time. People are simply not ready, this is of course following the assumption that aliens do exist. However, I would like to say that even if a respected world leader were to say they existed, people similar to Frosty's outlook would certainly not accept their words, or their voiced intentions. I refer you to my signature, and the quote from President Truman, circa 1950, 56 years ago.


Maybe...some people do not care.

There are what appears to be a possibility of an infinite amount of stars in existence (so how many stars in the universe is that? One mole
). But I do not think for one second that information or anyother proves that life elsewhere exist. We could be the first and only lifeforms in the universe or we could be the last and the only are somewhere in between.




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