The Jews have it half right.

I have heard this said jokingly by christians about the jews because they believe in God but do not accept Jesus as their lord and savior. However,how can they be half right? Is there a half heaven? I think not. To deny Jesus as Lord is to re-crusify him. The Jews were the ones who originally crusified him, and by denying him, they continue to do so. The bible states, the only way to the father is through the son. So in theory, that makes the jews no different than muslims, atheists, buddhists, ect. So why do christians and predominately christian societies(United States, western europe, etc.) defend Israel and back their claim to that land. Seems to me if Israel did not exist where it is presently located, or if the jewish state was in a corner of Nebraska or Spain, e.g, that the tensions in the middle east, and the arabs hatred of the west would be significantly lessened

1) How do you know that YOUR right, that YOUR savior wasn't a false icon, or a myth, or a liar? Two out of three of the abrahamic religions don't believe he was the son of god, perhaps Christianity is the one whos half-right???

2)Hatred of westren culture stems from the crusades, where the western civilizations sent soldiers down to fight a holy war, and slaughter arabs, rape their women, and take their land. That was what started theyre hatred for western civilization.

That being said, there is a reason why isreal is backed by us, and its not a religious one.

We put them there after World War II. It's one of the only democratic countries in the middle east, and its one of our only supporters then in the region. Basically its an important investment for us.

Originally posted by WolfofWar


2)Hatred of westren culture stems from the crusades, where the western civilizations sent soldiers down to fight a holy war, and slaughter arabs, rape their women, and take their land. That was what started theyre hatred for western civilization.

And prior to the Christian crusades was the Islamic crusades whom did exactly the same to Christians.

Originally posted by NumberCruncher

Originally posted by WolfofWar


2)Hatred of westren culture stems from the crusades, where the western civilizations sent soldiers down to fight a holy war, and slaughter arabs, rape their women, and take their land. That was what started theyre hatred for western civilization.

And prior to the Christian crusades was the Islamic crusades whom did exactly the same to Christians.

Not the point, the point is that the crusades are what really flared up the western world hatred. I'm not trying to make a stance of who was right, who war wrong, or who started the fight, but the fact remains that the crusades are what enraged alot of the middle eastern worlds.

Originally posted by WolfofWar
1) How do you know that YOUR right, that YOUR savior wasn't a false icon, or a myth, or a liar? Two out of three of the abrahamic religions don't believe he was the son of god, perhaps Christianity is the one whos half-right???

I know i am right because of my faith. I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that Jesus is Lord because he has shown himself to me and works in my life daily. I do not expect you do understand or accept this because your questioning of this reveals that you do not believe in Jesus. That is your personal reality, and i can not be convinced otherwise as to the validity of Jesus as Lord. No matter if i was the last person on earth that believed in Jesus, it would not mean that he is not The Christ.

That being said, I do not want this to turn into a thread were people try to prove or debunk the concept of Jesus as Lord. Those that accept Jesus as Lord do so without arguement and rely on their faith.

My main purpose is to examine the link between the US and Israel, and the US' motivation for estalishing the Jewish state. It seems to me that the US accepts Israel and the Jewish state because they are better than the muslims because at least they believe in god. but the fact that they deny Jesus as Lord makes them no different than the other non-believers.

Jewish, Christian, and Muslim all practice and pray to the same god. The only difference with Christians is that they believe jesus was the messiah, Jewish people dont believe he was a messiah, and muslims believe he wasn't a messiah, but a prophet in a chain of prophets leading up to their last prophet, muhammad.

And no, I dont want this topic to turn into a debunk fest either, but I just gave you two points to ponder in your topic.

The US established the jewish state because they had nowhere to go. Also, they have kept allied with it because its one of the only democratic countries in the middle east, and strategically, could be used for potential future operations there. Remember the Isreali airforce is one of the best in the world, and Isreal gives us a base of operations for middle east conflicts.

Originally posted by zoso28


My main purpose is to examine the link between the US and Israel, and the US' motivation for estalishing the Jewish state. It seems to me that the US accepts Israel and the Jewish state because they are better than the muslims because at least they believe in god. but the fact that they deny Jesus as Lord makes them no different than the other non-believers.

Im sure Muslims beleive in God (allah)

All the groups that beleive in God and Heaven just seem to beleive in a different messenger/prophet.

What if the real test is with God and not with the messanger, and those who persucute others because of the messenger that they beleive in may just well find them selves bathing in a lake of fire.

I believe in the same G-d as all the Abrahamic religions do and I don't put much stock into any of the "prophets", "messengers", "messiahs", or what any of them call their "Holy Scriptures".

There's more than one way and I'm pretty sure that G-d doesn't much care how you get there.

Saying "the Jews are half-right" is to deny their spiritual path to G-d. You cannot use the New Testament to prove the New Testament to a person who does not believe what is written in the New Testament. It's a circular argument. If Christianity and a belief in Jesus helps you get closer to G-d then, that's a wonderful thing. It's just not the "one true path" for everybody and trying to "own G-d" by making such claims is exactly what gets people into battles - physical or verbal or legal or whatever. So, just stop that! OK?
Thanks!

Originally posted by zoso28
To deny Jesus as Lord is to re-crusify him. The Jews were the ones who originally crusified him, and by denying him, they continue to do so.

You're assuming of course that Jews (or others) take your messiah myth seriously. They don't.

Originally posted by zoso28
The bible states, the only way to the father is through the son.

That would be the New Testament of course, which is only given serious consideration by Christians.

Originally posted by zoso28
So why do christians and predominately christian societies(United States, western europe, etc.) defend Israel and back their claim to that land.

...because they are trying to make the end times come true, and the zionists wisely figured out how to play that fiddle. You're being used.