US poor are not so poor.

I've heard alot in the past few years about the disparity between rich and poor here in America on how the rich live compared to how the poor live. I've also noticed that many people believe the gap between rich and poor to be widening. I've found an interesting article that well doesn't disprove that directly it does say that the poor seem to be better off now than they ever have been before. But don't take my word for it here's the article.

moneycentral.msn.com...

At a time of concern about the standard of living for future generations, the study offers hopeful signs of tangible progress, even as the pace of income growth has slowed in recent years.

The above statement really makes me wonder, we have more stuff apparantly but no increase in income. I would bet my left flank that the price of things surely has not dropped any over the past few years, so how do we have more things with the same ammount of money? Perhaps they should have included some numbers about credit card and loan related debt...

"Poor" is relative to the society you live within. If one cannot provide for their basic necessities in order to live and function reasonably within that society, one is "poor." Using the dollar standard to measure if one is poor is misleading. There are people in African and South American nations that earn the equivalency of $2 or $3 dollars a day, however this is a somewhat sufficient amount of money to reasonably live and function within their societies. Beggars in America can pull down 10 times that amount and it barely provides them with food and certainly not shelter.

Well thats true Kozmo poor is relative in regards to which society you currently reside. However what I took from the article is that those who are considered poor in our society are rather well off compared to what the media has been portraying. What I mean is why if this article is correct is the media giving this kinda of a picture about the american lowerclass. Bear in mind I'm not saying that things couldn't be better but in my opinion portraying people in this manner seems a little condescending and doesn't help matters much. In fact I find that the media is being rather elitist when they report about the "oppressive" poverty in america.

That doesnt cancel out the fact that 10% of the population own 80% of the wealth. I learned that in economics class.

so what if 10% of the population owns 80% of the wealth. its better than 1% of the population owning 100% of the wealth. are you advocating economic equality?









edited for spelling

[edit on 1-18-2006 by KrazyIvan]

I sure hope that was sarcasm. Seriously.

I think KrazyIvan was stating that in many so called socialist nations that were espousing economic equalty such as the Soviet Union, Cuba and the other Communist bloc countries turned out to have even more of a disparity between the wealthy and the poor. I apologize if I'm wrong

Not really in Cuba the level of health care is better than over here. The literacy rate over their will kick our butts here. There are capital ventures in operation over there but the basic necessities are taken care of cooperatively. They have systems over there that if you work harder than the next you do get better pay. But like all economys things change in thier case. From sugar to a more diverse economy.

I agree if you go into appilacia mountains or the missisppi and alabama and some parts of texas and kansas you WILL see poverty. There is inner city poverty then there is country poverty. Yes i use to do voluteer work and i did see kids with no shoes. They may have a roof over their head but bareily. The mans said it Poor is Poor. If you cannot pay for basic things then your family suffers in so many different ways.

I know it not really seen on tv and many many people do not go into those areas but it is here.
And we are not talking about single mom stuggling poor we are talking about illeterate cant get a job because of the econmy and no skills my family is eating ketchup soup everynight poor.

How many of that 10% got off their butts and worked 80 hour weeks, didn't take a vacation, etc... to get their portion of that 80%. Sorry if I don't take them to task for being willing to work really, really hard. They are the ones who keep the ecomomy rolling.

How many of that 10% got off their butts and worked 80 hour weeks, didn't take a vacation, etc... to get their portion of that 80%. Sorry if I don't take them to task for being willing to work really, really hard. They are the ones who keep the ecomomy rolling.

Not many most of that money was inherited and on that note most do not understand the paycheck to paycheck live either. Most of the middle class work 80 with no vacation. People like GW Bush A Gore have to went to an interview for job in their entire life!!!


The myth that hard honest work will get you ahead is a lie in most cases. You can look at the fines for CEO's in these accounting cases . Stole Millions fined thousands with no jail time usually. The idea of CEO not having to cut their salaries, retirement, and "pirks" on the average of 25 million. While they tell regular workers Middle class you have to cut health and no retirement. It is sick and that is why the poor are getting poorer and rich are getting richer.

Originally posted by BlackThought
Not many most of that money was inherited and on that note most do not understand the paycheck to paycheck live either. Most of the middle class work 80 with no vacation. People like GW Bush A Gore have to went to an interview for job in their entire life!!!

I have to disagree with you for the most part. While most of the well to do people in our country and around the world for that matter come from families that were well off they didn't just simply inherit their hole fortunes. I'll give some examples lets start with Bill Gates. Sure he came from a fairly wealth family but his father just didn't crook and leave billions to his son did he. And we shouldn't forget Larry Page and Sergey Brin again from fairly affluent families but again the billions just didn't fall into their laps did it. Sure a fair amount of the people who are rich inherited their money but not most of them. I don't even believe the majority of them, look up the forbes 400 richest people in the world list google a few names I think you might be surprised.

Originally posted by BlackThought
The myth that hard honest work will get you ahead is a lie in most cases. You can look at the fines for CEO's in these accounting cases . Stole Millions fined thousands with no jail time usually. The idea of CEO not having to cut their salaries, retirement, and "pirks" on the average of 25 million. While they tell regular workers Middle class you have to cut health and no retirement. It is sick and that is why the poor are getting poorer and rich are getting richer.

Again I have to disagree with you mostly while it is true that the justice system was a mess until recently. And yes the working class has it hard much like it always had. However while most people who work hard don't become billionaires (that requires as much luck as talent and dedication) they do get ahead if they put the time and effort into it and if they keep their wits about them and not try and cut corners. And yes I know its not easy (from personal experience) being from the working class but this country is full of opportunities people keep coming here after and some risk life and limb doing it. I think if this country wasn't all it is cracked up to be word would have gotten back to them by now.

i believe that with the exception of a few places such as appalacia, the american poor are much much better off than the poor in other countries. for the most part, poor here means your on foodstamps or living in public housing. poor in africa means starving to death. there are so many more opportunities here as well. someone like myself can grow up dirt poor not owning a new set of clothes until he's eight years old, and then turn his life around simply by joining the military and getting some training in a good job field. or you can study really hard and get scholarships. or, like many an athlete, you can work your butt off and get an athletic scholarship followed by a well paying job in the big leagues (or at the very least, a quality education for simply playing ball). people in nations such as africa just dont have the opportunities that we do here.

climbing down from my soap box now....

You mention 3 to four people and tell me that is how America Works please....Not even close. Family wealth becomes personal wealth you have to spend money to make it isn't that a saying?

Cutting corners isn't that what tax shelters are for? Isnt that what they just ruled for the accoutning of CEO PERKS as a part of their salairy? Cost reduction at the middle class is the way. Did the CEO of ford take a paycut when he is about the fire all those people? Pleazz...


And in all those cases it comes down to opportunity. Who gave the opportunity? Who gave them training? Who accepted their ideas?

There are people who die from hunger in America.

Originally posted by BlackThought
You mention 3 to four people and tell me that is how America Works please....Not even close. Family wealth becomes personal wealth you have to spend money to make it isn't that a saying?

I mentioned the three most glaring examples of people who made their fortunes themselves. But I could mention more such as Micheal Dell, Larry Ellison and Sam Walton but I could go on for hours. I'm not telling you how America works pal what I'm trying to say is that America is the most economically mobile nation the world has ever seen. Sure the American dream doesn't come true for everyone. But remember the biggest part of the American dream isn't that you end up with a mansion, a jag and yearly trips Hawaii its that you've been given the opportunity to make your life and the life of your family better. And as far as needing to possess money to make money partly true however not entirely. I would suggest you google Larry Ellisons bio for instance like I said before you might be surprised.

Originally posted by BlackThought
Cutting corners isn't that what tax shelters are for? Isnt that what they just ruled for the accoutning of CEO PERKS as a part of their salairy? Cost reduction at the middle class is the way. Did the CEO of ford take a paycut when he is about the fire all those people? Pleazz...

Hey I'm not saying its a level playing field. I'm also not saying America is a perfect place or even a fair place what I am saying is that this country more than anyother has a way of inspiring people to do to better themselves and to reach their full potential.

Originally posted by BlackThought
And in all those cases it comes down to opportunity. Who gave the opportunity? Who gave them training? Who accepted their ideas?

Yes it came down to opportunity. My friend opportunity isn't given nore can it be inherited. Opportunity to better oneself happens every day to all of us. We just have to take advantage of it. Who gave them training and who accepted their ideas well if you look at the greatest entrepreneurs in history you will find they trained themselves and rarely are their ideas accepted right away many are considered mavericks by their peers. Adversity breads success of you allow it.

Originally posted by BlackThought
There are people who die from hunger in America.

As they do in every country and every region of the world.

i understnd your post but what does that have to do with poor people? Opportunities(when i mean opportunites in men jobs and training for jobs) do not happen everyday and excusing the rich folk of their tax shelters will not help the situation. What good is an employer if they do not give a living wage? For instance right now their are people who want to further their eduaction but have to work two jobs to break even how are thery going to go to school when their life is full of working and trying to keep a family structure?

unemployment rate=no opportunites

[edit on 12/09-2005 by BlackThought]

there are always jobs out there. the problem is that people dont want to lower themselves to the point of working for mcdonalds, which is why we have so many mexicans doing the jobs that americans wont lower themselves to do....and guess what? the mexicans are working together as families doing the jobs no american wants, pulling their money together as families, and sending their kids to quality schools to get a good education, who in turn get good jobs and take care of the rest of the family.

thats what the rest of americans have forgotton....how to work for the longterm goal. the mexicans have got it figured out, and as much as i hate the huge number of illegals we have here now, you can learn alot from how they operate for their families.

What good is an employer if they do not give a living wage? That is what I mean there are "jobs" you can get but it will cost you more to go to them than stay at home a find a better living wage job.

For instance I need a job over 45k a year thats the lowest I can have to maintain the household.
Micky D's Aint doing it for me! My savings would be drained if i take another type of job. Living wage at least 10.50 an hour for everyone.

which is exactly the point, BT. if youre worried about finding a job that will support your lifestyle, you arent dirt poor, are you? if your worried about finding a job that is convenient then you arent about to starve, are you?

because you see, that is the difference. at least there is the opportunity of some kind of a job here. nobody just plain cant find work in this country (with the few exceptions of invalids). in africa and other areas of the world with 3rd world nations, sometimes there just arent any jobs, and there arent any government programs to assist the poor, and therefore people starve to death. cant you see the difference?

LIFE STYLE hmmmmmm well like haveing an old car living rental and trying to raise three kids that is not a style of life it is life period. We are not talking about tea on sundays and trips every 6 months. we are talking basic needs in the Wash dc area. Starving no never... I have once but never again.

My point is the ability to move up or be stuck in a loop. This system has many stuck in a loop the working poor. It use to be if you worked you did get ahead not now in some situations.