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Depleted Uranium Tipped Shells

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posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 03:39 PM
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Some people might nko a little bit about uranium,like that it was used to create the Hiroshima bomb, but what about depleted uranium? Depleted uranium can be used as an incindeiary because it sparks at high temperatures, but it also has other uses. It is a fabulous armour piercing substance. The U.S. has knowingly, just like in Vietnam, sent soldiers into a poisioned battlefield. The U.S., in direct violation of the Geneva Convention, has used armour piercing depleted uranium tipped shells in Iraq without telling the American public our the soldiers.





posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 03:47 PM
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Originally posted by Jakobx
U.S., in direct violation of the Geneva Convention,

Where does it forbid that?


has used armour piercing depleted uranium tipped shells in Iraq without telling the American public our the soldiers.

Everyone knew that depleted uranium was being used. It does not make battlefields poisonous.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 03:55 PM
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Originally posted by Nygdan
Everyone knew that depleted uranium was being used. It does not make battlefields poisonous.



yes it does - theres enough proof that it does.

US rejects Iraq DU clean-up

news.bbc.co.uk...

The administration claim its safe - the UN says its not = whose right??


even the iraqi government is saying it causes cancer

news.bbc.co.uk...




"Depleted uranium is more of a problem than we thought when it was developed. But it was developed according to standards and was thought through very carefully. It turned out, perhaps, to be wrong."
-- Brent Scowcroft, National Security Advisor to President George Bush in 1991 Gulf War .


academic.evergreen.edu...


WHO 'suppressed' scientific study into depleted uranium cancer fears in Iraq?

www.notinourname.net...



just a handful of links - and none of them `aljazeera` headlines either.



www.rense.com...

a sad read from vet`s who are suffering , but no one on the hill cares.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 04:01 PM
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Originally posted by Nygdan
Everyone knew that depleted uranium was being used. It does not make battlefields poisonous.


I agree that I've know about DU munitions for some time, but I disagree about it not making the battle field poisonous.


From : DU and its effects
Verified adverse health effects from personal experience, physicians, and from personal reports from individuals with known DU exposures include: (a) Reactive airway disease, (b) neurological abnormalities, (c) kidney stones and chronic kidney pain, (d) rashes, (e) vision degradation and night vision losses, (f) gum tissue problems, (g) lymphoma, (h) various forms of skin and organ cancer, (I) neuro-psychological disorders, (j) uranium in semen, (k) sexual dysfunction, and (l) birth defects in offspring.

Also from the above, how are people exposed :
Exposures requiring medical screening within 24 hours of exposure and consequent care included:

"a. Being in the midst of smoke from DU fires resulting from the burning of vehicles uploaded with DU munitions or depots in which DU munitions are being stored.

b. Working within environments containing DU dust or residues from DU fires.

c. Being within a structure or vehicle while it is struck by DU munitions."



Hmm the health effects sound pretty serious.

Nygdan, perhaps you'd like to volunteer to clean up the wreckage of war where DU is used. Make sure to breath deep when you kick up any dust.

- McGrude

Mod Edit: New External Source Tags – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 3/1/2006 by Mirthful Me]



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 04:21 PM
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Depleted Uranium also has a half life of 4.51 × 109 years, so for centries after the combat the area will still be irradiated.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 04:25 PM
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poisoned not irradiated.


all teh medical science shows that DU poisons the land (and people) - there isn`t enough evidence to show that it irradiates peole.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 04:33 PM
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Q. What is depleted uranium?

A. Depleted uranium is what is left over when most of the highly radioactive types (isotopes) of uranium are removed for use as nuclear fuel or nuclear weapons. The depleted uranium used in armor-piercing munitions and in enhanced armor protection for some Abrams tanks is also used in civilian industry, primarily for stabilizers in airplanes and boats.

Q. What makes depleted uranium a potential hazard?

A. Depleted uranium is a heavy metal that is also slightly radioactive. Heavy metals (uranium, lead, tungsten, etc.) have chemical toxicity properties that, in high doses, can cause adverse health effects. Depleted uranium that remains outside the body can not harm you.

A common misconception is that radiation is depleted uranium's primary hazard. This is not the case under most battlefield exposure scenarios. Depleted uranium is approximately 40 percent less radioactive than natural uranium. Depleted uranium emits alpha and beta particles, and gamma rays. Alpha particles, the primary radiation type produced by depleted uranium, are blocked by skin, while beta particles are blocked by the boots and battle dress utility uniform (BDUs) typically worn by service members. While gamma rays are a form of highly-penetrating energy , the amount of gamma radiation emitted by depleted uranium is very low. Thus, depleted uranium does not significantly add to the background radiation that we encounter every day.
www.gulflink.osd.mil...

My mistake,im only human i think.

Mod Edit: New External Source Tags – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 3/1/2006 by Mirthful Me]



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 04:40 PM
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The issue isn't with depleted uranium isn't with it being solid or used in ammo. Just as asbestos is safe in a solid form, so is DU. The problem is when its used in ammo, and it breaks away into particles. As it explodes, melts in a fire, or simply breaks to pieces, small particles of it become airborne and spread like mustard gas with the wind. Now you have airborne particles that, without gas masks, get into lungs and into the bloodstream. It may be less radioactive then regular uranium, but soldiers still have just inhaled it nevertheless.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 04:51 PM
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The shells are traveling at high velocities since theyre armour piercing, so of course the DU will be broken into smaller particles, as Wolf said.

[edit on 3-1-2006 by Jakobx]



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 05:07 PM
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Whether one wants to get side-tracked into a pointless debate (whose sole purpose IMO is to side-track) about the radioactive qualities or otherwise of DU surely the point is that deliberately and randomly exposing people to breathe and contact toxic heavy metals which have been turned into 'aerosols' is a really really bad idea.

Where on earth is there the slightest bit of surprise that this has led to a rash of illnesses loosely termed 'Gulf War Syndrome' along with a sharp rise in birth defects both in the countries where the war took place and amongst the men returning home and their progeny?



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 05:26 PM
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Originally posted by sminkeypinkey
deliberately and randomly exposing people to breathe and contact toxic heavy metals which have been turned into 'aerosols' is a really really bad idea.


I think that is the part of this situation that is in conflict with the Geneva Conventions - especially in regard to endagering the civilian population.

Consider how many photos you have seen of children playing on burnt out Iraqi tanks, etc. I see one on news sites about once a month or more.

- McGrude

edited for typo.



[edit on 2006/1/3 by McGrude]



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 05:35 PM
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According to the 4th Convention, civilians are not supposed to be knowningly harmed in times of war, and yet we do with DU.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 05:40 PM
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posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 07:52 PM
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Originally posted by Harlequin
The administration claim its safe - the UN says its not = whose right??

Depleted Uranium is dangerous to people who clamber over tanks that have recently been hit with the rounds. Its dangerous to inhale the dust because its a heavy metal, and, accoording to the UN, it gets dispersed to low-non-toxic concentrations quickly. If you are in the tank or truck when its hit, it'd be dangerous to inhale the dust.

even the iraqi government is saying it causes cancer

And yet, they don't bother to clean up the sites eh? Must not be worried too much no?


jakobx
so for centries after the combat the area will still be irradiated.

That is completely and utterly false.

Consider how many photos you have seen of children playing on burnt out Iraqi tanks, etc

That is a way to get exposed and be in danger, especially if its shortly after the tanks were hit.
So don't climb on the tanks.

According to the 4th Convention, civilians are not supposed to be knowningly harmed in times of war, and yet we do with DU.

Civilians are not targeted. What you are saying would outlaw war period. And the conventions certainly do not do that.

McGrude
I think that is the part of this situation that is in conflict with the Geneva Conventions

The geneva conventions do not prevent the use of DU rounds.

Being in the midst of smoke from DU fires resulting from the burning of vehicles uploaded with DU munitions or depots in which DU munitions are being stored.

SO don't stand next to burning US Tanks.
b. Working within environments containing DU dust or residues from DU fires.
The dust disperses to non-toxic levels quickly. It gets blown by the winds and is dispersed in a large volume of air. Since we're talking about heavy metal toxicity, we're talking about concentrations, and with low concentrations, its simply not 'poisoning entire battlefields' or 'deforming babies all across iraq'.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 08:00 PM
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Originally posted by Jakobx
www.projectcensored.org...



Jakobx,

I agree with you that DU is terrible and should not be used, but it is also useful to consider it from a different perspective. That perspective is the practical war fighting one.

The reason that lead is used most commonly in munnitions is because of its high density - it packs a greater amount of matter in the same volume - this means that a lead bullet leaving a gun muzzle at the same velocity as the same bullet made of iron carries much more kinetic energy and therefore will penetrate futher into a material or through harder materials. The same goes for DU shells, they are more dense than iron or lead shells and therefore have a greater penetration capability.

Greater penetration capability means greater short term survivability of the army units using DU shells. Short term survivability means that you can sustain greater pressure on the opposing force early in the conflict, often leading to a quicker victory.

Armies tend not to consider the long term survivability of their individual frontline troops (e.g. after the conflict is over). At that high a level (the commanders) the troops are to them as consumable office supplies are to a standard business.

And one final note : how better to dispose of useless uranium - that is the uranium that is not suitable for either nuclear weapons or fuel rods.

- McGrude





[edit on 2006/1/3 by McGrude]



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 08:11 PM
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Originally posted by Nygdan

Consider how many photos you have seen of children playing on burnt out Iraqi tanks, etc

That is a way to get exposed and be in danger, especially if its shortly after the tanks were hit.
So don't climb on the tanks.


Sure, that is easy enough for your or I to understand (and since we are statisitically less likely to be in contact with such things easy to accomplish). I wonder, is anyone educacting the Iraqi population to the dangers?

- McGrude



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 08:16 PM
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i saw a program once on discovery or something where they built a box out of DU then tested it for radiation levels. surprisingly inside the box the levels were less as it was blocking the normal background radiation. only real problem i can see is when it breaks up on impact into a fine dust and inhaled.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 08:20 PM
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British and American coalition forces are using depleted uranium (DU) shells in the war against Iraq and deliberately flouting a UN resolution which classifies the munitions as illegal weapons of mass destruction.
MAbye DU not directly banned in the Conventions, but the UN banned it.
DU has a half-life of 4.1 billion years. for all this time the particle are still dangerous, they are also inhaled after passing through gas mas filters.
As with the first Gulf War, there were relatively few immediate American casualties. But with each passing year, more and more Gulf War veterans are sick and dying,very possibly due to exposure to depleted uranium. The latest Persian Gulf conflict was basically a low-level nuclear war, and our new recruits are destined to suffer DU-related illnesses and fatalities.
Soldiers from this war have also been showing signs of high exposure
HTis is all from the Project Censored files and the Health departments evaluations of current soldiers home from Iraq

[edit on 3-1-2006 by Jakobx]



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 08:26 PM
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Originally posted by Jakobx
British and American coalition forces are using depleted uranium (DU) shells in the war against Iraq and deliberately flouting a UN resolution which classifies the munitions as illegal weapons of mass destruction.
MAbye DU not directly banned in the Conventions, but the UN banned it.
DU has a half-life of 4.1 billion years. for all this time the particle are still dangerous, they are also inhaled after passing through gas mas filters.
As with the first Gulf War, there were relatively few immediate American casualties. But with each passing year, more and more Gulf War veterans are sick and dying,very possibly due to exposure to depleted uranium. The latest Persian Gulf conflict was basically a low-level nuclear war, and our new recruits are destined to suffer DU-related illnesses and fatalities.
Soldiers from this war have also been showing signs of high exposure



Jacobx, is this your original writing? If not please quote it properly and site the original source. I'd like to read the whole article.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 08:31 PM
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The Useless Nations have banned many things, but you still see countries using them or ignoring the UN. As long as a country sees an advantage, and DU IS an advantage, they're going to keep doing it. The Useless Nations can "ban" all they want, doesn't mean they can make it stick, or the ban has any power.



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