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Mirochiped Credit Cards

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posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 10:18 AM
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Recently I heard in Canada they are getting a new kind of credit card. Instead of having the magnetic strip it will have a microchip instead. I heard they also use credit cards like these in Europe and some other countries. My question is why are they changing the credit cards? Are other countries like the US going to be changing there cards? Could this be another way for the government to track people? They have not come out yet in Canada but they are supposed to be coming out soon, probably early this year. I wanna know why they're changing the credit cards.


[edit on 3-1-2006 by The_Truth_Seeker]




posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 10:21 AM
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I don't know, but I do want to say that there are two things that I am very happy that I do not own - a cell phone and a credit card.

I am quickly becomming a minority there.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 10:27 AM
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You are correct. Mastercard is so far the main company which is going to implement this new scheme. They say that it will prevent credit card fraud. But the negative impacts that it could have on society is that tracking a credit card user will be a lot easier to do with this new implementation.


MasterCard calls for microchip in Credit Cards
MasterCard Canada is hoping to move Canadian credit card users into the 21st century and a Regina business is trying to stay at the head of the pack when it comes to smart card technology.

Credit Union Electronic Transaction Services Inc. (CUETS) is one of 12 Canadian credit card issuers to commit to using computer chip-enabled credit cards.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 10:30 AM
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They're probably switching from magnetic strip to microchip because the microchip could be safely placed inside the credit card, without risk of scratching or breaking - unlike magnetic strips which can be scratched out and torn.

So, in effect, the credit cards will look pretty much the same, minus a magnetic strip. Don't be alarmed by this change - the government is getting the same amount of information off the magnetic strip as off the microchip, it's just one is more efficient, cheaper, and more reliable than the other.

Do not fear Truth Seeker! I too do not have a credit card or cell phone! However, I do have a credit card under my name (used only during holiday shopping so I can actually afford things), and my Debit Card is pretty much the same thing as a credit card (though I'm changing to only cash withdrawls now).



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 02:55 PM
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I just got the new Chase-MasterCard in the mail yesterday. Aka, the "blink" card. It still has the strip on it though, as the only places i've seen so far where I can use the "blink" thing to pay are the duane reades and the movie theater on 14th St at the Virgin Megastore. (in NYC, btw). so not sure when, if ever, they'd completely switch to a chip only CC.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 03:02 PM
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The only way I would approve of this is if the card needs to be in direct contact with the reader. The possibility of RFID remote identity theft is what gives me the most pause. Some RFID can be read a few feet away
Can you imagine the black markets reaction to this!?!

[edit on 3-1-2006 by sardion2000]



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 03:08 PM
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Here in the uk they have microchips on all new credit and debit cards. They work the same way as the old cards but are more secure.

The new system is called chip and pin

Although it is a clever system which will foil the fraudsters, chip and PIN couldn't be easier to use. Instead of signing a paper receipt to verify a card payment, you will be asked to enter a four-digit Personal Identification Number (PIN), just like you do now at a cash machine.

The majority of card holders will now have chip and PIN card. If you have not yet received your chip and PIN card yet, you don't need to do anything. Chip and PIN cards will continue to be issued throughout 2005, most probably when cards reach their expiry dates. You can continue to use non-chip and PIN cards in all outlets, and you will be asked to sign for goods, just as you always have done.



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The new chip won't really make it any easier to be traced because it just does the same job as the magnetic strip on the back of old cards, so whatever info they were keeping on you before is teh same as they will beable to collect on you now.

I'm not sure if the situation is the same in the US but over here in the UK the biggest supermarket Tesco issues cards that u can hand over every time you shop to get money off vouchers through the post every quarter to use in store. Their was a pilot scheme run that took information on what peple bought at the supermarket (healthy/unhealthy food etc) as well as data from other sources to make a *health map* to show areas and people most at risk of being overweight and the health problems that come with that. A team of people then went and targated these people at risk and found alot of people with health problems that would have otehrwise fell through the net.
( i cant find the link but i will keep looking )

I think this is both a good thing and a bad thing. I am against the government collecting information on us, but i think sometimes we need to be saved from ourself.

P.S.
just to keep up the trend
i do own a mobile phone, don't own a credit card but do own a Tesco clubcard.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 03:37 PM
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Originally posted by sardion2000
The possibility of RFID remote identity theft is what gives me the most pause. Some RFID can be read a few feet away
Can you imagine the black markets reaction to this!?!
[edit on 3-1-2006 by sardion2000]


I agree with you on the whole RFID privacy thing. I even thought it could be read up to a few meters away, not just feet AND that RFID scanners can read hundreds of tags at once (hence scanning inventory arrival in boxes easier)...just picture RFID scanners on streets scanning people as they walk by.

I though I heard someone say the GAP, or KMART is/will be using RFID tags on clothing. That's scarier to me than using it on CCs.



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 04:18 PM
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Well with that as long as it's on a removable tag and not integrated into the product itself then its okay IMO.

[edit on 3-1-2006 by sardion2000]



posted on Jan, 3 2006 @ 05:56 PM
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I see that they're changing the credit card with microchips on them, because they're heading towards microchipping people full speed ahead.

Everything is getting smaller, more portable, easier to use & easier to track. This is a trend I've noticed since I was 6 years old, building to the system how it's going today.

I remember when it was difficult to get information on someone, & I miss those days. Information, isn't just information, it can be used as a weapon. I've got a small post on that already here :

www.abovetopsecret.com...

See, if you remember, the military uses the word, Intel, to label Information.
It's short for Intelligence Data, which would be Information.

The Allies during WWII, gathered "Intel" on it's enemies, the Germans, Japanese, & The Italians, so they could learn their weaknesses, & then turn around & exploit them.

Then, there's after WWII, when the Russian & Americans became embroiled in the Cold War, both sides were gathering "Intel" on each other, through many different means. Satellite photos, espionage through the CIA, & whatever other means, through paying infomants. I think you get the picture.

Gathering Information, or Intel, has always been a part of War, or Controlling the Masses.

So, microchipping, is where I see this going, to where they microchip every individual on the planet, but first they have to sell it to the public.

They're doing that, through putting microchips on the credit cards, they have the "Mobil Quick Pass" which has a microchip in it, inside the keychain, which charges to your credit card. Then, let's not forget the small credit cards, made to look cute because they attach to your keychain.

Have you ever noticed how everthing you do nowadays, is able to be tracked?

Think about it, & we'll start right here, on ATS. How do you think ATS knows who put what thread tag on what thread? They track you, not saying ATS has no right to do it, just pointing out that it's done.

The Internet, tracks every website you go to.

The X-Box Live, tracks what games you play, who you talk to, & what else you do on X-Box.

Your Social Security Card, is used to track you.

Your credit cards tracks your purchases.

Getting an account on Amazon.com, tracks your purchases, what your interests were, so as to advertise what you might buy in the future.

Everything, is being made to track you these days.

Microchips in your credit cards just doesn't surprise Me, in the least.

[edit on 3-1-2006 by SpartanKingLeonidas]



posted on Jan, 4 2006 @ 09:35 AM
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They can also track where you have drove with the GPS system in cars. Everything is definetly getting smaller. Think of how big cell phones used to be and how small they are now. You could buy clothing with the RFID's in them and not even know there in there 'cause there so small.

[edit on 4-1-2006 by The_Truth_Seeker]



posted on Jan, 4 2006 @ 04:06 PM
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No offense guys where have you been? Ive had my smart card visa for several years now. Its nothing more then an additional form of verification on the card , with my visa i got a free reader which i can connect to my computer and certain places set up for it require i insert the visa into the reader for verification. That way its not as easy as just finding someones old reciept and just using the numbers off of it to make online purchases. As far as additional purchase tracking the chip contains nothing more then the card id number and the expiration date in an encypted format ( not to hard to hack i might add ) Plus depending on the card you might have a log of your purchases but this is nothing more then convinence for you to track your history , the credit card company allready has the history anyway.

A prime example of the ability to be hacked is pay tv services such as directv or dishnetowork which have been using these same smart cards for years for programing. In the UK i think smart cards have been widely used for laundrymats and telephone cards for years, and they too have been repeatedly hacked. Someone mentioned using a a smart card for a certain chain of gas stations for ease at the pumps and from what i remember those cards wherent out a week before they where hacked.


When it comes to the RFID chips they are entirely different then these chips inbededed in smart cards.

Also there are essentially two types of RFID chips active and passive , active requires a battery or some source of power, passive has no power source and certain types of them are mearly printed out with a computer printer and are dependant on the ink. Passive RFID chips as a general rule are the most common and can be read generaly at a minimium of 20 feet and are for the most part write once only and contain very little data . Active of course contains more data and can be read at much greater distances and the data can be rewritten on most chips. There are variant chips but in a nutshell the above describes your most commonly used RFID chips.

On a side note someone mentioned K-mart using RFID chips soon well im not sure but i think they have been using them for quite some time. I know Wal-mart boasts how over 90 % of there inventory is RFID tagged and then its deactivated at checkout. The US goverment also is now requireing all new purchases of goverment inventory to be RFID tagged as of jan 01, 2006.

When it comes to tracking your purchases all stores do it as well as creidt card companies , they then custom tailor sales flyers and junk mail for geographical areas and individuals based on this data. They even track your returns in order to catch would be return scammers. Some stores of course will defend this practice to the end , and state this is for inventory practices not marketing, for example Wal-mart has stated thats how they knew that the two most important things to be stocked on the shelves after a bad hurricane in florida are ..................are you ready? .......................Beer and poptarts.

By the way Walmart also has the second largest computer network in the world. Just think how much data they have on the average consumer who uses thier debit card every time they make a purchase.



posted on Jan, 4 2006 @ 09:13 PM
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I have had chip and pin for about a year now, since my last Debit Card expired. Have to say it is far better and there is nothing that they can track now that they couldn't 10 years ago. The chip is the same as the magnetic strip, just more durable.

It is especially secure as no-one knows my PIN, nor do they have the opportunity to try and forge my signature (which, incidentally, is a forgery of my mum's, who has the same initials. Came in handy at school when I forgot my games kit!).

No need to don your tin foil hats guys, it is no different than the magnetic strips you have now. It's like swapping over from floppy disks to CD's. Natural evolution.

I am surprised the US is only just implementing this. I thought you guys were the first to do the new stuff. Seems I was wrong!


EDIT: I might add that Sky TV are doing a new mastercard with a chip in that you can slot into your digi-box and make purchases through your TV, pay bills, that sort of thing, making payments more secure in the process.

[edit on 4/1/06 by stumason]



posted on Jan, 4 2006 @ 11:54 PM
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I don't know about credit cards, but I heard the Bank of Montreal wants to put this in their bank cards, some of which are combination debit cards/Mastercards. I've got an account there, too... I hope my chipless bank card keeps working, I've still got the same card they gave me when I opened the account five years ago.

In reality, though, to be close enough to track somebody's RFID card, you'd probably have to be in the same room as them. Your purchases could be tracked, of course, but 'they' can already do that, now. Hopefully they make this technology properly so that some guy with an electronic scanner can't read your card from 10 feet away and get your PIN or something crazy like that.

Oh, and for the record, I don't have a cellphone or credit card, either. I'll probably never get a cellphone, but I could see myself having a credit card someday, to boost credit rating and make online purchases.



posted on Jan, 6 2006 @ 08:48 PM
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My "blue" from american express has a chip in it



Cug

posted on Jan, 6 2006 @ 10:25 PM
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It looks like there is 2 diffrent types of chips being talked about here smart card and RFID.

The new mastercards have RFID chips (I got a new debit/Atm card with one).

It's called pay pass and the idea of it is you just need to "tap" your card on the reader to pay for your purchases if the total is under $50 you don't have to use a pin, or sign anything.

I only ran across a pay pass terminal once so far, and I left it in my wallet and tapped the terminal and it worked. But the RFID chips in these cards use the 908 - 928 MHz frequency range and if you have the chip close to your body, the effective range of the chip is about zero compared to the 10 foot range that a large scanner will have.

I have some plans for a RFID reader, and soon as I get all the parts and fire up the soldering iron I'm going to do some experimenting as I think there is a HUGE security hole with these things in a credit card.



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