Bill in Ohio Will Allow Arrests For No Reason

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posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 07:07 PM
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A bill pending in Ohio would make it legal for the arrest of anyone who doesn't give their information to a requesting police officer. The bill does not require that the person be doing anything illegal, only that the officer has to ask.

The bill, called the Ohio Patriot Act would also require anyone entering certain transportation sites to show ID. Gov. Taft is expected to sign the bill.
 



news.yahoo.com
A bill on Gov. Bob Taft's desk right now is drawing a lot of criticism, NewsChannel5 reported.

One state representative said it resembles Gestapo-style tactics of government, and there could be changes coming on the streets of Ohio's small towns and big cities.

The Ohio Patriot Act has made it to the Taft's desk, and with the stroke of a pen, it would most likely become the toughest terrorism bill in the country. The lengthy piece of legislation would let police arrest people in public places who will not give their names, address and birth dates, even if they are not doing anything wrong.


Please visit the link provided for the complete story.


Ok. It's bad enough that we have to show an ID to board a plane, after the first of the year will need a passport to go to Canada or Mexico; in 2008 will need an "internal passport" to fly WITHIN the United States; but now, if you live in Ohio, you can get arrested if you don't show your ID?

Now, you don't have to be a suspect or commit a crime. An officer on the street can just come up to you and say "Let me see some ID", and if you don't produce some sort of identification, off to jail you go!

Papers, please!

Related News Links:
abclocal.go.com
www.wksu.org
www.daytondailynews.com




posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 07:17 PM
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Great!

I bet all those joggers will love this. Make sure you bring your papers when doing your laps around the block or the park.



posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 07:25 PM
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What a bunch of crap- little by little, everyday, shock after shock, more and more will be wanted. I see the time when we will have to have special permission to leave home.

Do they have a name for this oppression?

Hitler would have been proud. I just get sick when i read this garbage. What a bunch of insignificant idiots we are as a nation....powerless to do anything at all about all that's coming down...



posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 07:27 PM
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Agreed this is just total nonsense. People need to ignore these facist laws and just go about their business. They simply cannot arrest everyone.



posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 07:39 PM
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This looks like it's a direct response to this little news item:

NEWS: Bus commuter vs. Big Brother. Papers, please!

"What It's not legal?
Then let's pass a law that says we can!
Nobody to stop us! ... "

.



posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 07:40 PM
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welcome to the NWO ... with your host, John Howard

They didn't label them "Anti-Terrorism" laws in Ohio though huh ? Interesting.

We're already going through it

Tune in next week, when John is joined by George and Tony!

The other States will folllow shortly, I am sure.






[edit on 21-12-2005 by ImJaded]



posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 07:42 PM
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Just a point of clarification...according to the article it says they can arrest you for refusing to give your name, address, etc. verbally not necessarily show an I.D.



posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 08:13 PM
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The bill will probably die and if not a court will probably make it illegal.

We have the main patriot act on hold in congress and now some states will make their own?

I wonder how much the people in the state of Ohio will fight for their civil rights or are they so worked out by propaganda that they will think that is something good for them in the name of national security and public safety.

Just wondering.



posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 09:02 PM
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This topic has been discussed on ATS a while back. I am in favor of it, btw.


Ok. It's bad enough that we have to show an ID to board a plane

Can you explain what is so bad about showing an ID to board a plane?


The Ohio Patriot Act has made it to the Taft's desk, and with the stroke of a pen, it would most likely become the toughest terrorism bill in the country. The lengthy piece of legislation would let police arrest people in public places who will not give their names, address and birth dates, even if they are not doing anything wrong.


How is this different than the relationship betwen a police officer and you today? If you are stopped for a traffic incident, you are asked for ID. If you refuse to supply ID, you can and should be held until either you cooperate or the officer is able to determine your identity.

I guess the question is, why in the world would you not co-operate? To be obstinate? Or because you are truly concerned about a 4th amendment infringement? And I'm not putting forth the argument of "If you're not guilty, then why not co-operate?"

If I'm a cop, and I walk up to you and ask for your name, etc., and you poutingly refuse with a big "NO!. Don't hatfta!"
, I'm not going to be satisfied with my partner saying "Yep. He's right, John. He doesn't have to tell you anything". I'd be less inclined to say "Sorry for botheriing you, sir. Have a swell day" than I would be to finding where you jaywalked.

The point is, a little bit of cooperation goes a long way towards keeping your life simple and smooth.



posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 09:44 PM
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It's very interesting, how the original Patriot Act got flushed down the toilet, then this happens.

I e-mailed a friend in Ohio to ask if she's heard about it. I'll fill you in when I hear from her, unless she's already been arrested.



posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 09:51 PM
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It's bad enough that we have to show an ID to board a plane



This isn't a bad thing. This type of identification verification is understandable. Really can't trust people these days. However, the writing of this bill which allows officers to arrest people for refusing to give their name and address is, in my opinion, pushing things a little too far.

Did I read that other states were going to start this? Hmm, that would be a bad thing for everyone around. Eventually, the government is going to push and the people are going to shove back.



posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 10:03 PM
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Something kind of like this happened in Germany a while back. Not only did some folks have to show their papers on demand, but they had to sew six pointed stars on their clothes so they could be identified and appropriate action taken.

But it can't happen here; still it's a brave new world.



posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 10:11 PM
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Law enforcement officers don't make it a habit of going around and harrassing law-abiding citizens. If there is suspicious activity going on, then they intervene. Not indentifying yourself when asked should be grounds for arrest until the person is identified and cleared.

Most officers (the ones I know) of the law are far to busy to harrass the everyday, ordinary "Joe".



posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 10:23 PM
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Ok, uh, I'm one of those people who would end up in jail, for refusing to cooperate with this law. Why? Because, in my opinion, if I haven't done anything wrong, then it is none of the police's business who I am!!

The whole point of living in a free society, is that I have the right to go about my business freely. If I haven't broken any laws, then I should be allowed to do so anonymously, if I so choose.

People have been so seduced by the argument that if you've done nothing wrong then you should have no objection to providing your info, having your home/person/bags searched, or having your biometric info put in an international database.
This way of doing things is completely reversed from the ways a free nation operates.

It should be the case that if a person has done nothing wrong, they have the right to be "free from unreasonable search and seizures". The burden of proof of wrongdoing is supposed to rest on the police, prosecutors, and judges, in order to prevent them from becoming tyrants and oppressors.

Go back through history and read what has been said about governments who rattle the sabres of war and infringe on people's freedoms under the auspices of protecting them. It never ends well for the people.

Why in the hell is it so hard for people to learn from the mistakes of the past?? I just don't get how some people are so oblivious to things that are seemingly so obvious!!



posted on Dec, 21 2005 @ 10:38 PM
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I don't mind it either, I don't have anything to hide and I like talkin to cops usually.

It's especially funny when U give your name as something in a foreign language and watch them struggle to spell/pronounce it


I was one "Tomato Eggplant" (in arabic)
lol they never find anything on the computer so I don't see how making it legal to have to give your name yet not show ID is really doing anything productive


just stupid IMO but hey, I'll play



posted on Dec, 22 2005 @ 12:02 AM
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jsobecky, here's an interesting challenge for you. You've admitted you support this legislation: Lets say this exact same legislation was enacted by the Iranian government. Would you refrain from using this legislation to paint a picture that "freedom and democracy" needs to be spread to Iran? Or would you use it, amongst other things, to say "Look Iran is oppressing its citizens".

Just what exactly constitutes "freedom and democracy"? Why are you so gung-ho in allowing everything your nation stood for to be removed so you can feel a little safer? Notice I said "feel", these kind of laws will do bubkiss to stop terrorists.



posted on Dec, 22 2005 @ 12:21 AM
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I can imagine the new police force simply enforcing the new law with road blocks or checkpoints. Drive through one and the driver might be ok, but your mother, brother, sister, friend etc. may get arrested due to the officer having a suspicion that something funny may be going on. That's right, the officer doesn't even need a reason, so if you even look at the officer wrong, it's off to jail you go. If you don't like it, they'll take your friends and relatives as well. Why we may ask? Because there might be something illegal going on. Everyone will be safer if anyone can be stopped for no reason whatsoever right? It doesn't make me feel safer. Apparently some people prefer to live in a police state.



posted on Dec, 22 2005 @ 04:05 AM
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Jsobecky, i love you to death, but dude,
doesnt anything bother you?

Please tell me, I'd love to know.


I think it would bother you if and when it happens to ya. OR will you go peacefully and thank them for encarcerating you for something like J walking? I hear that could get you 20 years of hard labor.



posted on Dec, 22 2005 @ 08:15 AM
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Ok, uh, I'm one of those people who would end up in jail, for refusing to cooperate with this law. Why? Because, in my opinion, if I haven't done anything wrong, then it is none of the police's business who I am!!

Not exactly the same thing, but...just say you're out of town and collapse on the sidewalk from a heart attack. As you drift into and out of concsciousness, a police officer asks you for your name, so that a search into the National Medical Data Base ( which you vehemently opposed, btw, as infringing on your privacy ) can begin, giving the emt's valuable info to save your life ( it turns out that you're allergic to a certain common heart attack medicine ).

You refuse, so you die. But - wait - there's a silver lining! Your family collects from a lawsuit against the emts for giving you meds that you were allergic to.

My attitude here is in line with Intelearthling's, and ImJadeds'. Maybe I just run in different crowds. Most cops I know are like the one in the story of the NYC cop, who pulled over a carload of teens, one of who had been mooning people out the back _ As he is about to let them go, he says something like this to the mooner: "And if I ever catch you sticking your tongue out at people again, you're going straight to jail!".



from subz jsobecky, here's an interesting challenge for you. You've admitted you support this legislation: Lets say this exact same legislation was enacted by the Iranian government. Would you refrain from using this legislation to paint a picture that "freedom and democracy" needs to be spread to Iran? Or would you use it, amongst other things, to say "Look Iran is oppressing its citizens".


I'd probably view it as progress, in Iran, given their history of true, current human rights violations.


from dg Jsobecky, i love you to death, but dude, doesnt anything bother you?

Please tell me, I'd love to know.


Sure:
When I run out of coffee;
When my words/deeds manage to hurt nice people that don't deserve it.



posted on Dec, 23 2005 @ 06:17 AM
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quote: It's bad enough that we have to show an ID to board a plane




This isn't a bad thing. This type of identification verification is understandable. Really can't trust people these days. However, the writing of this bill which allows officers to arrest people for refusing to give their name and address is, in my opinion, pushing things a little too far.

I agree that it is not a bad thing. The author, however, has a different opinion. I'd like to know why they think that it is bad that we need to show an ID to board a plane.




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