Why over Bush on the supposedly spy scandal when Clinton and Carter did the same thing?

He is covering up a big turd. There is more involved than domestic spying, his handlers are using the intelligence spooks as a collective group of thugs, more like the mafia than a respectable democratic government.

I like to take them down, so easy, just follow the trail right to the paymaster.

April 2004:

"Now, by the way, any time you hear the United States government talking about wiretap, it requires - a wiretap requires a court order. Nothing has changed, by the way. When we're talking about chasing down terrorists, we're talking about getting a court order before we do so. It's important for our fellow citizens to understand, when you think Patriot Act, constitutional guarantees are in place when it comes to doing what is necessary to protect our homeland, because we value the Constitution."

See this Video - and ask yourself, is the President of the United States a Liar?

Still this is the man that said, Constitution is a, and I quote, "A God damned piece of paper" - is that Okey with you guys?

[edit on 23/12/05 by Souljah]

Yes its ok with me , so long as they are doing what there paid to do, and that is to protect us from the martians and other nastys.

Originally posted by NumberCruncher
Yes its ok with me , so long as they are doing what there paid to do, and that is to protect us from the martians and other nastys.

One Question:

Who is going to Protect YOU from THEM?

Originally posted by Souljah

Originally posted by NumberCruncher
Yes its ok with me , so long as they are doing what there paid to do, and that is to protect us from the martians and other nastys.

One Question:

Who is going to Protect YOU from THEM?

I dunno maybe you and your Light Saber ? im more concerned with the martians and other nasty's.

[edit on 063131p://04126 by NumberCruncher]

Originally posted by Souljah

Originally posted by NumberCruncher
Yes its ok with me , so long as they are doing what there paid to do, and that is to protect us from the martians and other nastys.

One Question:

Who is going to Protect YOU from THEM?

It's all about the scare tactics folks. They want you to be more scared of the president than terrorists. In fact, terrorists arent even a threat, just president Bush.

[edit on 23-12-2005 by Dronetek]

Originally posted by jsobecky
...Yet, in spite of the sensitivity of this information, it continues to be leaked and picked up by our enemies. We are all aware of the Washington Times leak about the sat phones being used by bin Laden which resulted in the loss of a source of valuable intelligence. No one was punished for that, as far as I remember.

Ray Davies of the Kinks said it best: "Paranoia will destroy ya"

Saddam Hussein never hated our way of life. We may hate his, but he was reliant upon us even after the Gulf War to legitimize his regime. Prior to the Gulf War, he was reliant upon us for cash, for arms, and for those much-ballyhooed WMDs: missiles, and of course biological and chemical weapons like anthrax and mustard gas.

Osama bin Laden is much the same. If he is our enemy, the real terrorist behind the 9-11 attacks, why has President Bush stated that he is not really interested in finding Osama? Why did he, both before and after the attacks, protect bin Laden from investigation just like his predecessor, Bill Clinton did?

Now of course you will turn this on me and say "who is being paranoid now?" but I ask you, which is more credible? That those who rely on the US for both funding and weapons (and in exchange for what, one must ask!) turned to bite the hand that feeds them, or that an administration made up of chickenhawks with a self-proclaimed plan for "a new American Century" actually carried out those stated plans and created this tragic "Pearl Harbor-like event" as part of a plan of global domination? Does George Bush really care about the way of life of 90%+ Americans? Or is his focus on making welfare handouts and no-bid contracts for his rich cronies and their corporations?

Setup and script. Just like on TV. And just like TV it is in turn both comforting and vaguely disquieting to believe what you see on the screen is real.

Thanks for your time...

Still this is the man that said, Constitution is a, and I quote, "A God damned piece of paper" - is that Okey with you guys?

Souljah I have yet to see any evidence that verifies your claim, as such I would appreciate it if you did not assert that quote as being fact. Because it might just perhaps make you look like the liar.

Originally posted by Dronetek

It's all about the scare tactics folks. They want you to be more scared of the president than terrorists. In fact, terrorists arent even a threat, just president Bush.

[edit on 23-12-2005 by Dronetek]

Exactly if is one thing that the Bush administration has been very good at since 9/11 is the way they manipulate the media creating mass hysteria.

Keep the people afraid from terrorist and fearful for their lives and they will give away anything just to be safe again, even their civil and constitutional rights.

Because is all good for the people and for the nation that is what a good patriot will do, trust your political leaders blindly.

How dare anybody questioning the government intentions. Right?





[edit on 23-12-2005 by marg6043]

Exactly if is one thing that the Bush administration has been very good at since 9/11 is the way they manipulate the media creating mass hysteria.

Actually the media does that all on it’s own, if there's anything the media loves is mass hysteria because it translates into huge ratings.

Keep the people afraid from terrorist and fearful for their lives and they will give away anything just to be safe again, even their civil and constitutional rights.

You mean the same terrorists that blew up the Twin Towers, or the ones that bombed Britain? We’re stupid to be afraid of those guys, they couldn't hurt a fly!
Also, what constitutional rights have I given up?

How dare anybody questioning the government intentions. Right?

How dare anybody support their government. Right?

[edit on 23-12-2005 by WestPoint23]

Originally posted by WestPoint23
Actually the media does that all on it’s own, if there's anything the media loves is mass hysteria because it translates into huge ratings.

Yes they do can not deny that occurs the Bush public opinion team just make things a littler bit better, War on Terrrorrrr and They hates us for what we stand for all good examples of filing the head of the people with pride and hate against whatever the government say is the Enemy even if that means your brother or sister, Be afraid and in guard because the enemy is everywhere

But not to worry the government is going to help you fight and will protect you but first we most listen to your phone conversations and we will not tell you.

Its all for the good of the nation.

How dare anybody support their government. Right?

How can anybody support a government as corrupt as the one in power is beyond me, but I guess when you tell people over and over that everything is done for their good the ones that still cling to ideologies will believe anything.

Even turn against anyone that dare to question. Right?

The brainwashing of You are either with us or against us was mean to be not to put Americans in guard against outside influences but rather make American divided and have them fight their fellow Americans that can see behind the veil of corruption, lies and deceive.

Merry Christmas westpoint.

[edit on 23-12-2005 by marg6043]

Yes they do can not deny that occurs the Bush public opinion team just make things a littler bit better, War on Terrrorrrr and They hates us for what we stand for all good examples of filing the head of the people with pride and hate against whatever the government say is the Enemy even if that means your brother or sister, Be afraid and in guard because the enemy is everywhere

Well I don't know what you would call it, but the War on Terror seems fitting to me. Also, the last time I checked I don't think the Islamic Extremists were too keen on our way of living and our culture, funny, that almost sounds like they hate what we stand for
As for the rest of your post, well, that's just your usual speculation and fear mongering, so I won't bother responding to it.

But not to worry the government is going to help you fight and will protect you but first we most listen to your phone conversations and we will not tell you.

Its all for the good of the nation.

Isn’t that what all governments are supposed to do? By the way, since when has any president ever announced that they were going to listen to your phone calls? I think that kind of defeats the purpose of it

How can anybody support a government as corrupt as the one in power is beyond me, but I guess when you tell people over and over that everything is done for their good the wants that still cling to ideologies will believe anything.

This government is just as corrupt as others have been in the past, there's nothing special about it. Furthermore, there is no government that is free of corruption, it’s an inherent flaw of the system.
And Marge can you prove that things being done are not for my own good? I didn’t think so, until then I will continue to support my government.

The brainwashing of You are either with us or against us was mean to be not to put Americans in guard against outside influences but rather make American divided and have them fight their fellow Americans that can see behind the veil of corruption, lies and deceive.

I believe it was the former, the latter Americas have done for themselves. We were doomed to it ever since the establishment of political parties. It has nothing to do with one party’s corruption or deceit, no one has a patent on that, but it does however have everything to do with how we view things.

And a very Merry Christmas to you too Marge.

[edit on 23-12-2005 by WestPoint23]

Has any individual come forward who has been arrested or had claimed their rights were violated?

Has there been any other attacks on American soil since 9/11?

The way I see it, if it's working let it keep going. What scares me is people are so blinded by their hatred for Bush that they would easily sacrifice more American lives. I really get the sense that many posters here would take a 2nd 9/11 type attack or larger in trade for getting rid of Bush.

Makes me wonder what the loudest people crying about this have to hide? We know there are enemies of America and they have spies and influence (aka money). Maybe the dems are afraid something may be found out in regard to their party's funding.

www.cnn.com...

Also it is my understanding that this is electronic surveilance via computer for data originating from suspected terrorist connections. I really don't think you need to worry about your 900 number calls being listened to by g-men. How would you feel if one of these intercepted calls resulted in the foiling of a bomb plot that would have killed you or a member of your family?
To me it is akin to arguing police should not have guns because they might accidently shoot me. Until I see evidence that this is illegal or being abused I have no problem with it.

[edit on 23-12-2005 by Apoc]

[edit on 23-12-2005 by Apoc]

[edit on 23-12-2005 by Apoc]

Originally posted by Apoc
The way I see it, if it's working let it keep going.

Really. I mean REALLY, do you actually believe that it's working?
Even the most Conservative of Conservatives are leaving this regime out to dry, like rats leaving a sinking ship.

www.humaneventsonline.com...

msnbc.msn.com...

...et cetera, et cetera.

I think the writing is on the wall, and even these folks have seen Bush has gone waayyy overboard. I think that time will show this president to be an embarrassment to both conservatives and the rest of the population of the US.

There probably is still time though to distance yourself without TOO much shame.

(sorry still working out the bugs on how to quote properly :duh

[edit on 26-12-2005 by unmarked01]

Originally posted by marg6043

Originally posted by WestPoint23
Actually the media does that all on it’s own, if there's anything the media loves is mass hysteria because it translates into huge ratings.

Yes they do can not deny that occurs the Bush public opinion team just make things a littler bit better, War on Terrrorrrr and They hates us for what we stand for all good examples of filing the head of the people with pride and hate against whatever the government say is the Enemy even if that means your brother or sister, Be afraid and in guard because the enemy is everywhere

But not to worry the government is going to help you fight and will protect you but first we most listen to your phone conversations and we will not tell you.

Its all for the good of the nation.

How dare anybody support their government. Right?

How can anybody support a government as corrupt as the one in power is beyond me, but I guess when you tell people over and over that everything is done for their good the ones that still cling to ideologies will believe anything.

Even turn against anyone that dare to question. Right?

The brainwashing of You are either with us or against us was mean to be not to put Americans in guard against outside influences but rather make American divided and have them fight their fellow Americans that can see behind the veil of corruption, lies and deceive.

Merry Christmas westpoint.

[edit on 23-12-2005 by marg6043]

Have you ever thought that maybe YOU are the one that is brainwashed. I mean, this thread is supposed to be about the fact past presidents have done the same things, yet here we are talking about how scary Bush is.

All you guys do is talk about how dangerous our government is. HAve you ever thought that YOU are the one scare mongering?

It helps me sleep at night knowing the richest and most powerfull country in the world is happy to drag any man woman or child into the street and kick the #e out of them in the name on national sercurity.

Guilty or not who cares!

God Bless America

Originally posted by talon565
It helps me sleep at night knowing the richest and most powerfull country in the world is happy to drag any man woman or child into the street and kick the #e out of them in the name on national sercurity.

Guilty or not who cares!

God Bless America

What the hell are you talking about? I dont know what country your talking about, but its not like that here in the US.

I am not too well versed on this issue but if I remember correctly when Clinton did this in 1994 there was a hole (or a 'contigency' that was overlooked, may be a better way to put it) in the FISA laws that made it legal for them to carry the unwarranted searches on persons out. I also believe after it happened they acknowledged that the law should be changed to make this no longer possible and that they worked with congress on updating the FISA laws so that it didnt happen again, effectively checking and balancing themselves(the executive).

Now if Clinton, Carter and Bush did break the law why should it make a difference to Bush?? anyone who breaks the law should be accountable to it.

I am always amazed at the cohorts on this forum ready to protect the crimes and wrongdoings of those who share their ideology.

Just because another president did it doesnt mean its okay for them to do it imo. All I hope for is a fair and balanced enquiry into this whole matter and what seems to be a clear violation of the FISA law and the 4th amendment.

thanks,
drfunk

Just because another president did it doesnt mean its okay for them to do it imo. All I hope for is a fair and balanced enquiry into this whole matter and what seems to be a clear violation of the FISA law and the 4th amendment.

That's the problem isn't it, whose to say they broke the law? The courts? Congress? Both of those institutions don't seem to think so or they would have taken up the matter already. You'd think that if they truly broke the law there would be more then a handful of democrats calling for a hearing.

There are a few Republicans also calling for investigations, but you'r point is still valid.

[edit on 26-12-2005 by Dronetek]