The Ordo Templi Orientis (O.T.O.) is not the "Australian department of Freemasons". O.T.O. is not Freemasonry in any way, shape, or form, and is an entirely separate organization.

Anyone from Australia reading this topic?

If you are you should look into whether this judge is a freemason or not.

Most judges in the freeworld are from the Old days when Masonry reached it's peak popularity in the 60's and 70's.

Justice tends to be bought in this day in age so more then likely some backdoor agreement went on. Thats how it's always been after all. We would be kidding ourselves if we thought the freeworld is fair and honourable.

Originally posted by TerraX


Perhaps here is where some people get the wrong impression?

Probably. The O.T.O. is sort of patterned after Freemasonry. But, then again, all fraternal organizations are patterned after Masonry to a more or less extent.

The O.T.O. is different from Masonry in the same way that the Knights of Columbus are. The Knights of Columbus admit only Roman Catholic men into their fraternity, limiting it to a particular religious belief. The O.T.O. admits both men and women, but requires them all to be adherents of the religion known as Thelema, a neo-Egypto-Gnostic religion founded by the Thelemic prophet Aleister Crowley about a century ago.

Having studied Thelemic literature and scriptures in depth, as well as having conversed with long-standing members of that faith and O.T.O., I have long reached the conclusion that they are completely harmless. Crowley's erratic bravado displayed in many of his writings are nothing more than hyperbole and rhetoric; he was by nature a poet, and knew how to grab people's attention.

Thelemic and O.T.O. practices do not involve child abuse, or any other type of abuse. It could perhaps be argued that some of the Thelemites are weird and unorthodox, but being weird and unorthodox are not crimes (at least, not yet).

Originally posted by Nygdan
? Why? This has nothing to do with masonry. OTO is suing under religious protection laws, OTO is a religion, masonry is just an occultic society made up of members from many religions, mostly christianity.

The O.T.O. is not a religion, it is a religious group Thelema is the name of the religion the O.T.O. follows.

Originally posted by Masonic Light
The O.T.O. is different from Masonry in the same way that the Knights of Columbus are. The Knights of Columbus admit only Roman Catholic men into their fraternity, limiting it to a particular religious belief. The O.T.O. admits both men and women, but requires them all to be adherents of the religion known as Thelema

Technically you don't have to be a Thelemite to join, you don't have to state you accept the Book of the Law until the I°. and even then you don't have to "really" be a Thelemite until the IV°. but for the live of me I don't know why a non-Thelemite would join even in the 0°.

Why is everyone so detirmined to 'miss' the 'meat and potatoes' of the issue?

Check out the issues brought to light on this whistleblowers site.

Check out all the threads on ATS, to do with missing children, child sex slavery, paedophilia, etc. (my two last posts at 'skunkworks' on 'Australian conspiracies' thread, touches on the current situation in Australia) while you still can.

Review how often this arguement, from the link of the Freemasons charges...
"The main testimony leading to this conclusion comes from an alleged witness and victim of this group who, it is claimed, suffers from Disassociative Identity Disorder and/or Multiple Personality Disorder."...is used when folk raise personal complaints they have with Freemasonry.

These 'mental health' problems are 'diagnosed', treated and supported (still more a subjective art than medicine) by people who hear the same stories, time and time again, by unrelated people (often naming the same names) seeking relief from damage done by the traumas of child sexual abuse (inc. Ritual Satanic) so they are actually 'evidence' of the fact of these practices.

However due to the cunning practice of abusers being scattered throughout these 'professions', the correlations are broken up rather than gathered and 'justice seekers are effectively 'silenced'.

This, 'call the victim crazy', is a favourite 'tactic', used to discredit the validity of the testimonies of those moved to 'blow the whistle' on entrenched corruption because, other than eyewitness accounts of survivers, other 'hard evidence' is extreemly hard to gather and stop from 'disapearing' before long delayed trials.

This story should scare the hell out of anyone who hopes to keep their children safe from Organized Child Sex Rings, and worse...

I have always maintained that, Organized, Ritual, Satanic Child Sexual Abuse and Sacrifice, is the WORST PROVEN Conspiracy going, but protecting 'the good name' of the people involved and getting a share of the the vast wealth and power they earn from it, is soooo much more important than DENYING IGNORANCE in order to deliver justice.


This is a quote of mine from the "Australian Consiracies" thread, on paedophiles and coverups to protect them:

It's worse now than then, active partisipants have grown in number as they've proven they can better protect their own and keep punishment to a minimum for the rare ones that are successfully prosicuted.

It is an entrenched EVIL.

[edit on 21-12-2005 by suzy ryan]

Hi suzy,

I wish to thank you for calling me a baby raper, a murderer, a cannibal, and a pedophile.

All the best seasons greetings to you as well.

Frater C.U.G.

Well I just threw the 'whole shoe box' out there and didn't specify what size or style it contained or which 'individual's' foot it fit's...but anyway...

I wish I could thank you for just as eagerly jumping to the defence of those called "crazy" just for daring to tell the truth....

Ritual Satanic Child Sexual Abuse, and Worse, goes on, and is an International Multi Billion Dollar (heavily protected by Powerfull, 'Respected' people) Trade, that WOULDN'T EXIST if it didn't serve an awfull lot "Powerfull", "Respected" people.

By all means defend yourself, as is your right. I'm sorry if 'the shoe' looks like one out of your closet. If I knew, 'exactly', what you wore I would have specified, "Does not fit Cug."

I didn't realize you are so much more important and at risk than defenceless, powerless babies who don't have another International "Brotherhood" to protect and defend them.

Originally posted by suzy ryan

Ritual Satanic Child Sexual Abuse, and Worse, goes on, and is an International Multi Billion Dollar (heavily protected by Powerfull, 'Respected' people) Trade, that WOULDN'T EXIST if it didn't serve an awfull lot "Powerfull", "Respected" people.

Since this thread is about the O.T.O. Name one person in the O.T.O. who is "powerfull" or "respected" by the general population. Just one.

The site on the first post has a membership list of the Australian O.T.O. (That scares the HELL out of me! I can see a supporters of that site, doing some ugly things to innocent people.) What powerful Australians are in it's 1-200 or so members?

I didn't realize you are so much more important and at risk than defenceless, powerless babies who don't have another International "Brotherhood" to protect and defend them.

I feel sorry for you. This much hate can't be good for you.

libel, just because libel is ok on here that dont mean you wont be sued for it.

First of all, I seem to have made a mistake with the topic line and as others have pointed out the O.T.O. is not the same thing as the Freemasons allbeit somewhat similar. Apologies for that. The site-owner of gaiaguys.net also seems to have it wrong.

When I first read the stories on the gaiaguys website I recognized that these were serious accusations. Let me say that if it's true then those involved in criminal acts should be severely punished. However, despite of the accusations no direct involvement of the O.T.O. is proven in relation to pedophilia cases and it becomes somewhat like a conspiracy theory where powerful figures cover eachothers backs. As the website-owner found out, if you can't proof your accusations then it's slander and defamation.
The O.T.O. like other groups is a mysterious organisation and therefore lends itself to theories being applied to it. In a way they themselves create (negative) controversy. I must also point out that their handling of the witness and labeling the witness as mentally unbalanced is somewhat of a cheap shot.

Well the thread was about Freemasons suing FOR OTO. It wasn't stated otherwise 'till after I left the board, just that they weren't the same thing.
It (the suit) was over things posted on the gaiaguys site.
I asked people to check out the site being sued to understand the issue.
I pointed out that there was campaign of discrediting testimonies of victims by, slandering them, with accusations of being "crazy", as was printed in the story.
Being a member of anything, including 'mainstream' churches, doesn't preclude people from persuing their own interests, including being active in the child sex trade.
The child sex trade could not exist without powerfull and respected people,"networking" to protecting their interests.
The structure of the law, particularly in Australia, protects the child abusers, by shutting down discussion that would build "winable" cases, because you can't ask specific questions about any one or group that isn't already convicted, without being sued.
I did not accuse any specific individual or group.
Threatening me with a suit, for raising these, very, on topic aspects of the issues, already covered by the thread and links, just seems.....

What was my 'determination'? Just that people don't 'effectively' protect and support the child sex industry (which supplies ritual abusers, the cause of the suit comming about) which they do when they ignor and silence public discussion of it in order not to possibly 'offend' others that may be involved.

[edit on 22-12-2005 by suzy ryan]

I read this thread this morning and decided not to answer it then as I was tied up...well not literally.

I was directed to the gaiaguys website a few months ago by a activist I know after we got talking "issues", it is run out of a town not far from me. I read two pages, was turned off by this blatant poop and sorry to say that any credability they could have got for decent parts and section kinda flew out the windows. The accusations were ridiculous, slanderous and wrong.

Lets get down to the meat and potatoes. We have paedophiles, child rapists, masons, OTO's golden dawners, templars, abusers and murderers.

It all reminds me of that online iq question. How does it go..

If some zips are zots, and some zots are gups? does that mean all zips are gups? bah something like that, anyway.

My name is Charlie I rape children, on sundays I go to church and then I go down to the gentlemans club for a game of chess and then at night I don the lambskin and attend my monthly lodge meeting. that does not mean that joe blow next to me at lodge shares my same sickness. Its a sickness perpetuated and the abusers in order to be able to perpetuate and carry out their hidden sickness, work their ways into positions of trust where they can carry out their confined sickness in peace with no suspicion or aspersions cast
These jobs of trust include judges, church members, church leaders, teachers, scout master, child care teachers, charity workers and all other respected insitutions of trust where it is easy to carry out that sickness because of lack of suspicion. It does not mean that All of even many of that organization the abuser joins are all abuser. Now you may get an abuser that meets anothe abuser and he joins the same social clubs as part of their mateship but once again, it is not the social club, its is not the organisation.

Dennis Ferguson was just re imprisoned for child abuse charges and would be the most least likely mason/oto member I could think of, just as my uncles and grandfather are the most least likely paedophiles I can think of.

Gaiaguys were so wrong on so many levels. I'm not in the OTO and never intend to but Crowley I consider to be one of the great masters and I seriously doubt, no I know that any organization that devotes themselves to his teachings and learning of that knowledge on such a level could even contemplate those ideas. The book of the Law, is a literary masterpiece, I regard it personally higher than the bible.

And Freemasonry, I dn't respect many of its ideas and methods but even I give grudging respect to an organization who strives to attain that higher knowledge, so I will whisper quietly so none of the masons I so love to argue wth here hear me, Thats a right down insult to freemasonry and the OTO.

Gaiaguys may have got so much right on their site, who knows because sprouting that poop is a total tunoff from going any further.

You have voted Mayet for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have two more votes this month.

Well Mayet, nice to know you support police and others who actively coverup paedophilia and want people to believe that Reina Michaelson's work to do something about it is "poop".

Deliberately directing people away from links to understanding, the depth of the 'problem' and connecting with those fighting it, is effectively supporting and protecting the monsters.

As I already mentioned the site is like ATS, (some wacked out views can be found on it, IMHO) so thats why I refered people to stories linked with Reina Michaelson.

Is sucking up to certain people on ATS, masons and Crowely worshipers like yourself, who don't like these issues discussed, really more important to you than waking people up to the high level interference that protects Organized Child Sex Rings?

Obviously,yes. You couldn't dispute the the stories I refered to, so you did your best to tell people to remain ignorant, with your dribble strongly implying the stories lacked credibility.

The point of the stories is that it isn't just, odd sickos that find people of the same "sickness", but that our justice system is REFUSING to investigate. The only sickness these highly functioning people, involved in the child sex trade, have, is cold, selfish evil.

You've painted a very brave, honest, caring, just picture of yourself by jumping to the defence some 'offended', on ATS. Pity you displayed the opposite attitude to the plight of powerless, voiceless sexually tortured babies and children, by trying to discredit and silence the voices speaking for them.

Isn't good, honest reporting impossible without balance, and democracy impossible without balanced reporting? Well untill these official reports and transcripts get the mainstream media coverage as their seriousness deserves, outlets like ATS and Gaiaguys, are the few where this tool of democracy can be exersized.

Thats right doesn't your hero, Crowely, have a 'low oppinion' of, 'democracy for all', or was that just printed by one of the many groups that follow his 'teachings'?