The Terrorists Have Won the War in Iraq

Well not technically, but I believe they are going to get what they want, an Islamic state run by religious clerics who want the U.S. out of Iraq. The Iraqis using the new democratic freedoms we placed on them voted to based their new country on their religion Islam.

Iraq's election result: a divided nation

Religious fundamentalists now have the upper hand. The secular and nationalist candidate backed by the US and Britain was humiliatingly defeated.

The Shia religious coalition has won a total victory in Baghdad and the south of Iraq. The Sunni Arab parties who openly or covertly support armed resistance to the US are likely to win large majorities in Sunni provinces. The Kurds have already achieved quasi-independence and their voting reflected that.

*****

Islamic fundamentalist movements are ever more powerful in both the Sunni and Shia communities. Ghassan Attiyah, an Iraqi commentator, said: "In two and a half years Bush has succeeded in creating two new Talibans in Iraq."

The success of the United Iraqi Alliance, the coalition of Shia religious parties, has been far greater than expected according to preliminary results. It won 58 per cent of the vote in Baghdad, while Iyad Allawi, the former prime minister strongly supported by Tony Blair, got only 14 per cent of the vote. In Basra, Iraq's second city, 77 per cent of voters supported the Alliance and only 11 per cent Mr Allawi.

And if you remember old news, and have a little vision, you can see that Sharia law will be part of the new Iraq.
ABUSE CRISIS: Iraqi Women Officials Vow to Implement Sharia

WAR: Iraq's Jaafari aims for Sharia rule

Not exactly what we had in mind is it President Bush?
But there is always hope that claims of election fraud could suddenly see the results make a complete turnabout.

Worldwatcher thanks for posting this taste of reality.
IMH you would have to be very naive to think that an election is the answer to all of Iraqs problems. You would also have to be very naive to think that the election was held without interfence from other countries and tribes in Iraq.

And thats not mentioning the fact Iraq only exists on a map.

Well, what can you feel for a people who choose slavery over freedom, except pity?

I don't see that we have any right to prevent this. We put them in a position where they actually had a choice for once. This was a noble endeavor in my opinion. If they have chosen chains and servitude to a religion that seems intent upon forcing the rest of the world to destroy it, then their fate is out of our hands, and we should not trouble ourselves to worry over them anymore. They had the choice.

The day Sharia law is adopted in Iraq is the day we should withdraw everything from there including all financial and diplomatic aid. We have no right to force them to choose our way, but neither do we need to reward a stupid decision. We should not withdraw to enact revenge or to punish, but for the simple reason that societies ruled by religion are incapable of coexisting with secular societies based on the rational assumption of basic equal rights and individual liberty.

It's quite simple. Religious States cannot be trusted. Who knows what their God will tell them to do tomorrow?

Appearances can be deceiving.
Bush mentioned the other day that patience would be needed in relation to how things would unfold in coming months. Also, it will be at least 2 or 3 months before a government really takes shape, and it will take a 2/3 majority to select positions.
Furthermore, the Iraqi Constitution will be abridged, etc.
As the Iraqi Constitution currently stands, if followed, Iraq cannot have a government the same as Iran.






seekerof

Seekerof the Iraqi Constitution is just a bit of paper. If people choose they could vote to over turn the Constitution or the government could ignore the Constitution. I doubt an Iran style government would take hold straight away it would be a gradual process.

About as much a piece of paper as the US Constitution, huh?
I guess evil George Bush was correct then?





seekerof

Originally posted by Seekerof
About as much a piece of paper as the US Constitution, huh?
I guess evil George Bush was correct then?

Without derailing this thread I will say that you understand the point I made. From my limted readings on US history the first US presidents struck by the US Constitution and after that American leaders moved away from the US Constitution.

The US moved away from its founding documents without the tribal factions Iraq has thats not including the American indians.
Any part of the Iraqi Constitution could be ignored in order to maintain security this could either help Iraq or lead the country back to a Saddam/Iran style regime. If you want my views on Bush just read my posts on PTS.







[edit on 21-12-2005 by xpert11]

[edit on 21-12-2005 by xpert11]

[edit on 21-12-2005 by xpert11]

well seeker its not over 200 years old or held to infamy like ours....

xpert very limited and noone has moved away from our founding documents.....

Originally posted by namehere
xpert very limited and noone has moved away from our founding documents.....

At the end of the day its probaly a matter of opinion and a debate for PTS.
:drags thread back on topic:

As long as no one screws with the oil flowing we won't give a crap. Screw with oil production then we must go back into Iraq due to Iraqi national security and in the interest of the U.S. and the UN. It just won't be said that way,

Originally posted by Ambient Sound
Well, what can you feel for a people who choose slavery over freedom, except pity?

I don't see that we have any right to prevent this. We put them in a position where they actually had a choice for once. This was a noble endeavor in my opinion. If they have chosen chains and servitude to a religion that seems intent upon forcing the rest of the world to destroy it, then their fate is out of our hands, and we should not trouble ourselves to worry over them anymore. They had the choice.

The day Sharia law is adopted in Iraq is the day we should withdraw everything from there including all financial and diplomatic aid. We have no right to force them to choose our way, but neither do we need to reward a stupid decision. We should not withdraw to enact revenge or to punish, but for the simple reason that societies ruled by religion are incapable of coexisting with secular societies based on the rational assumption of basic equal rights and individual liberty.

It's quite simple. Religious States cannot be trusted. Who knows what their God will tell them to do tomorrow?

You have voted Ambient Sound for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have one more vote left for this month.

Well said, their free to be Idiots, but we should not support stupid choices...hopefully there will be a trial-and-error here, so when the voters see how poorly theses religious leaders perform....they will choose wiser on the next election.

Its their 1st time at the polls, kinda like letting a kid run wild thru a candy store and grabbing what they can off the shelf. Next time I am hopeful they choose better leaders.....hope is all we have in these days of darkness.

Maximu§

LA_Maximus if the religious leaders in question come to power do you really think there will be another election?
Do you think the political process can prevent another Saddam/Iran regime from taking power?
Time will tell us how much understanding the Iraqi people and politicans have of the political process.

Originally posted by Ambient Sound
Well, what can you feel for a people who choose slavery over freedom, except pity?

I don't see that we have any right to prevent this. We put them in a position where they actually had a choice for once. This was a noble endeavor in my opinion. If they have chosen chains and servitude to a religion that seems intent upon forcing the rest of the world to destroy it, then their fate is out of our hands, and we should not trouble ourselves to worry over them anymore. They had the choice.

The day Sharia law is adopted in Iraq is the day we should withdraw everything from there including all financial and diplomatic aid. We have no right to force them to choose our way, but neither do we need to reward a stupid decision. We should not withdraw to enact revenge or to punish, but for the simple reason that societies ruled by religion are incapable of coexisting with secular societies based on the rational assumption of basic equal rights and individual liberty.

It's quite simple. Religious States cannot be trusted. Who knows what their God will tell them to do tomorrow?

I totally agree. It is quite tragic that in this modern era there still exists a desire for a religious state. Anybody who believed that the Iraqi's would chose otherwise needs to lay off the drugs.

Sigh...

- Attero

While the so-called "Democracy" is installed in Iraq just to make Bush's war in Iraq and all the Casualties "Worth it" - Iraq is ruled by Militias. There is no Law above them. All the presidents and prime ministers have no power over them - only Clerics control them. And these Religious Militias represent all three sides and not just one, and while two sides can roam around and do ANYTHING, while under the protection of the Coalition - the third side is blamed for everything and is the only Iraqi Scapgoat.

Bush had no Idea what he was getting himself and his fellow countrymen into when he marched into Babylon...

Yes take this as a warning, Islam wishes to instill upon the world a calipahte and Sharia law on YOU!

Originally posted by NumberCruncher
Yes take this as a warning, Islam wishes to instill upon the world a calipahte and Sharia law on YOU!

Yes ofcourse - that's why US has 730 bases in more then 50 countries all over the World.

WHO's nstalling WHAT all over the World?

Damn I feel so SAFE!



Raise the Flag of Capitalism!

[edit on 21/12/05 by Souljah]

Originally posted by Souljah
Yes take this as a warning, Islam wishes to instill upon the world a calipahte and Sharia law on YOU!

Yes ofcourse - that's why US has 730 bases in more then 50 countries all over the World.

Are you really that misinformed or just playing dumb.

The US keeps forces deployed across the globe because they protect American interests abroad. With us being one of the largest economies in the world we no doubt have just a little right to ensure our economic safety across the globe. But then again that doesn't cover the various parts of the world where we try and keep the local populations from ripping each other apart to the best of our abilities (see Bosnia). Oh and then there are the countries whom we hold strategic training and military exchange programs with.

The US military does a lot more across the globe than try and set up McDonalds. In fact the US military has little connection to the fact MCDonalds does a great job of expanding overseas. Last time I checked there wasn't boots on the ground in China but MickyDs sure did a great job of opening up shop.

If you try to say that America insuring its prosperity is worse than Islamofacism trying to impose hardline islam across the globe then your flat out wrong.

Regardless of Iraq,9/11, or the London Bombings its easy to see that Islamofacist ideology has directly resulted in death,destruction, and increased the cycle of poverty in the middle east.

[edit on 12/21/2005 by Agent47]

Yes Souljah is just plain dumb i agree.

it's easy for him to sit there in his free country bashing everything he takes forgranted, if it wasnt for capitalism he wouldnt have his dear computer or internet to preach his misinformed ideas on us.

but back on subject, its a very interesting lesson learnt here that the Iraqi's choose to vote in Sharia law as opposed to freedom and democracy.

A leopard never changes it spots comes to mind ?

Originally posted by Agent47
The US keeps forces deployed across the globe because they protect American interests abroad. With us being one of the largest economies in the world we no doubt have just a little right to ensure our economic safety across the globe.

Agreed.

Without Essential Oil Reserves your American Ecnomoy, based on Crude Oil, will Collapse like a Tower of Cards. So fragile it is, that the USA can not afford, that Crude Oil would be sold in PetroEuroes, therefore making the PetroDollar drop.

The US military does a lot more across the globe than try and set up McDonalds. In fact the US military has little connection to the fact MCDonalds does a great job of expanding overseas. Last time I checked there wasn't boots on the ground in China but MickyDs sure did a great job of opening up shop.

You did not Understand the Meaning of this Photo - you are watching it too narrowminded. It is not about Mcdonalds - it is about Exporting the American Lifestyle, the Fast Food Lifestyle, the Capitalistic Lifestyle - and calloing THAT Democracy, when in fact it is nothing but puru Corporate Imperialism, being executed by "Sticks and Carrots" - you don't want our carrots, we beat you up with our sticks!

If you try to say that America insuring its prosperity is worse than Islamofacism trying to impose hardline islam across the globe then your flat out wrong.

Why?

First - there is NOT Global Islamic Empire, that threatens the Security of this World. However they are Numerous ANGRY Muslims, whos countries are occupied or "OWNED" by the West and their Corporate Interests, which create a giant gap between the common and and the Wealthy elite few. Capitalism has created an expanding Third World, where Poverty, Hunger, Diseases are something they have to fight on daily basis - still the so-called "CIVILIZED WEST " does nothing to stop that. Why? Because that intentions do not protect American interests abroad. Simple. They do not offer ANYTHING worth to the Greedy Corporate West, nothing but Bills.

BUT,
Everytime an US soldier Dies the GDP goes up.

Everytime a Patient is diagnosed with Cancer, the GDP goes up.

Everytime a Rainforrest Falls, the GDP goes up.

The Corpiorate Economy is FUELING with other peoples Misery.